New plinth for my Garrard 301 [Archive]

View Full Version : New plinth for my Garrard 301

Thermionic Idler

25-11-2012, 19:55

Thought the collective might appreciate a pic of the new SMD plinth I picked up recently. I've had the black 'solid chassis' 301 for a little under 3 years in a sort of Lori-clone wood plinth, but just got hold of this in the last fortnight.

I'm using the 3012 at the moment as I'm still waiting for the Schick arm board to arrive, looking forward to trying that out too.

I know the colours aren't original so apologies to those who like originality!

It's playing the 4MWB pressing of Swiss Movement / Eddie Harris & Les McCann. Rather beautifully.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8198/8216494111_1445219d3c_b.jpg

Audio Al

25-11-2012, 19:57

:stalks::stalks::stalks:

OMG :stalks::stalks::eek::eek::eek::doh::doh:

Thats beautiful WOW

Love it :)

Barry

25-11-2012, 20:00

Thermionic Idler

26-11-2012, 00:27

Looks lovely. What is it made of - slate?

Nice to see an SMP/12" SME combination. Will be interested in your impressions of the Schick arm compared with the SME.

Well controversially it's actually polished granite! I questioned Shaun @ SMD about this, as the received wisdom generally holds that slate is the best material to mount these things in because its structure is similar in principle to the popular CLD wood plinths. Years ago I had a Slatedeck 401.

SMD have researched this quite thoroughly, and it turns out that there is a dependence on how it's coupled to the stand. If it's hard coupled, i.e. spiked, then slate does indeed edge ahead of granite. However, the situation is reversed if you decouple and damp out the top layer by placing it on sorbothane spheres (a bit like what Loricraft do with their squash balls, and in fact the SMD sorbothane spheres are the same size as a squash ball and will fit a Loricraft plinth). With this decoupling in place (which is itself beneficial), granite emerges as sonically superior to slate.

The SME 3012 was a pretty recent purchase too, when it was first offered to me I turned it down --- why get one when I already have the Schick, which is supposed to be superior? But I changed my mind later on as it really was in mint condition - it's an original Series II, probably from the late 60's or early 70's. Apparently it had 15 years of careful use, then spent 25 years in a wardrobe in its box. It has a lovely organic quality to it but of course it still has the original 40 year old wiring and interconnect, so I don't think I'm hearing what it's truly capable of at the moment. I probably need to talk to Audio Origami about a rewire and getting an up to date connector on the bottom --- they all seem to put RCA's there but surely a 5 pin modern SME type would make more sense?

Wakefield Turntables

26-11-2012, 18:41

i got jonny to put a 5 pin connector on mine and have never looked back, it does open up access to a whole list of tonearm cables which use the 5 pin connector. I have a Nordost TYR strapped to mine. :)

synsei

26-11-2012, 20:49

:wow: That's just pure sex... :drool:

301's look mean and moody in black :D

jason

27-11-2012, 08:16

Very nice Dave..

Marco

27-11-2012, 09:30

Hi Dave,

Welcome to AoS :)

Your 301 looks fantastic, and no doubt sounds the same! I think that I recognise the cartridge too, as I use one myself... The Royal GM (or is it a Gold?) should sound superb on the end of your 3012, as it's a classic combo. The 3012 is just so much more musical and 'alive' sounding than its modern magnesium counterparts, from SME.

Having just recently purchased a Royal GM, I'm astounded at how much of an improvement the 'Replicant' stylus provides over the conical and elliptical models I've used before (Classic GM and Classic GM E). The clarity and insight the Royal GM offers, coupled with the SPU's traditionally addictive musicality and 'soul', makes it a stunning and emotionally involving listen!

I may have missed it, but what phono stage and/or SUT are you using with it?

Well controversially it's actually polished granite!

Yes, you can tell by graining and intense sheen to the finish that it's not slate.

I questioned Shaun @ SMD about this, as the received wisdom generally holds that slate is the best material to mount these things in because its structure is similar in principle to the popular CLD wood plinths. Years ago I had a Slatedeck 401.

SMD have researched this quite thoroughly, and it turns out that there is a dependence on how it's coupled to the stand. If it's hard coupled, i.e. spiked, then slate does indeed edge ahead of granite. However, the situation is reversed if you decouple and damp out the top layer by placing it on sorbothane spheres (a bit like what Loricraft do with their squash balls, and in fact the SMD sorbothane spheres are the same size as a squash ball and will fit a Loricraft plinth). With this decoupling in place (which is itself beneficial), granite emerges as sonically superior to slate.

That's interesting, and something I hadn't thought of before. Another factor in all this, of course, is that there are varying qualities of granite and slate, all with different sonic signatures, so it's never a case of 'all things being equal', even when the same basic plinth material is used and the method of coupling is the same! ;)

It has a lovely organic quality to it but of course it still has the original 40 year old wiring and interconnect, so I don't think I'm hearing what it's truly capable of at the moment. I probably need to talk to Audio Origami about a rewire and getting an up to date connector on the bottom --- they all seem to put RCA's there but surely a 5 pin modern SME type would make more sense?

It would be interesting comparing the Schick with the 3012, using your SPU. Have you tried that? I'd be curious to know what the result was, as I admire (and rate) both tonearms. Quite simply, they tick all the right boxes for me, sonically and aesthetically.

As for getting Johnny to rewire your arm, I'd consider it a must, as I'd expect its performance to move up several notches, as a result. In terms of a suitable tonearm cable, you may wish to consider trying one that quite a few of us on AoS have been using to great effect, from a chap in Greece, called Yannis Tome. When you've got some time, pour yourself a nice glass of wine and devour the contents of this thread:

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=17071

More info here on his website: http://www.back-promo.co.uk/html/intro.html

You may find it interesting reading. His cables certainly come with my highest recommendation.

Enjoy the forum! :cool:

Marco.

Clive

27-11-2012, 09:56

Thermionic Idler

27-11-2012, 20:22

Hi Dave,

Welcome to AoS :)

Your 301 looks fantastic, and no doubt sounds the same! I think that I recognise the cartridge too, as I use one myself... The Royal GM (or is it a Gold?) should sound superb on the end of your 3012, as it's a classic combo. The 3012 is just so much more musical and 'alive' sounding than its modern magnesium counterparts, from SME.

Thanks so much! The SPU is actually a 90th Anniversary, you can see by the Golden Horns of Gallehus emblem on the side. And yes, the SME really does have a lovely musical quality to it.

Having just recently purchased a Royal GM, I'm astounded at how much of an improvement the 'Replicant' stylus provides over the conical and elliptical models I've used before (Classic GM and Classic GM E). The clarity and insight the Royal GM offers, coupled with the SPU's traditionally addictive musicality and 'soul', makes it a stunning and emotionally involving listen!

Yes I have wondered about that myself, the 90th Anniversary is one of those with the elliptical stylus though it's no slouch when it comes to tracking. At the time I did wonder if I should have got one with the line contact stylus.

I may have missed it, but what phono stage and/or SUT are you using with it?

Whest PS30RDT, James Henriot at Whest actually set it up with a 50 ohm load setting for SPU cartridges as the standard minimum load setting is 100 ohms. That feeds a Modwright LS100 into a Transcendent 15W OTL (the new "Son of Beast" model, great amp, rubbish name) and Horning Aristoteles loudspeakers.

It would be interesting comparing the Schick with the 3012, using your SPU. Have you tried that? I'd be curious to know what the result was, as I admire (and rate) both tonearms. Quite simply, they tick all the right boxes for me, sonically and aesthetically.

Not on the same plinth yet. I have a feeling that the Schick may be more dynamic-sounding and the SPU seems to track better in it too --- BUT again, 40 year old wiring in the SME, plus I also think I need to revisit my setup --- there are no straight lines on an SPU and I'm unsure if I got the alignment quite right. I'm still waiting for the Schick armboard for this plinth, I had to have it made as a one-off as they're a lot rarer than SME's! So I'd only really consider the comparison valid when the SME is rewired and both arms are heard on the same plinth.

As for getting Johnny to rewire your arm, I'd consider it a must, as I'd expect its performance to move up several notches, as a result. In terms of a suitable tonearm cable, you may wish to consider trying one that quite a few of us on AoS have been using to great effect, from a chap in Greece, called Yannis Tome.

Thank you for the heads-up, I hadn't heard of him. I'll check out those links.

Thermionic Idler

27-11-2012, 20:42

The deck may not be authentic but it is beautiful! Given that these decks are re-sprayed in their original colour nowadays you've not been too sacrilegious and it can be reversed. I'm almost tempted to do it to mine...and the granite setup is interesting too.

Thanks! I purchased it from Ray Clark of Classic Hi-Fi nearly 3 years ago, it's actually the very first of his "solid chassis" rebuilds. The mechanicals had been transferred to a replacement chassis plate which was CNC milled from a solid piece of aluminium. It has significantly more structural rigidity than the standard cast aluminium chassis plate and that greatly benefits performance --- I wouldn't be surprised if it competed favourably with Loricraft's "Garrard 501" which I believe is built along the same principles --- yet it cost me a small fraction of what Loricraft charge for theirs!!

It's pretty much my dream turntable, I wouldn't want anything else.

Barry

27-11-2012, 20:50

Well controversially it's actually polished granite!

Nothing controversial about granite; it all depends how the deck is decoupled.

I thought it was granite but slate can have, if finely finished and 'oiled', a lovely smooth sheen.

Whest PS30RDT, James Henriot at Whest actually set it up with a 50 ohm load setting for SPU cartridges as the standard minimum load setting is 100 ohms.

Isn't that a bit low? With a 6 Ohm coil resistance, the miniumum ought to be 60 Ohm. Ortofon themselves recommend > 100 Ohm.

Thermionic Idler

27-11-2012, 20:59

Isn't that a bit low? With a 6 Ohm coil resistance, the miniumum ought to be 60 Ohm. Ortofon themselves recommend > 100 Ohm.

Well the published specs for the 90th Anniversary are here: http://www.ortofon.com/products/historical-products/meister-silver-gm-mkii (yes I know it says meister silver on the end but it does link to the 90th). That specifies an internal resistance of 2 ohms and a recommended load impedance of 10 - 50 ohms, hence that setting. I know there are other SPU's in the range with different electrical specifications.

Barry

27-11-2012, 21:06

Well the published specs for the 90th Anniversary are here: http://www.ortofon.com/products/historical-products/meister-silver-gm-mkii (yes I know it says meister silver on the end but it does link to the 90th). That specifies an internal resistance of 2 ohms and a recommended load impedance of 10 - 50 ohms, hence that setting. I know there are other SPU's in the range with different electrical specifications.

Fair enough. My SL15Es (both Mk.I and II) have 2 ohm coils, whereas my SPU has one of 6 ohms. I run the lot into 100 ohm.

Regards

DiveDeepDog

28-11-2012, 01:39

Looks fantastic, was the donor a 3, or 401, and have you upgraded the bearing??

Its given me enough encouragement to get one of my 401's painted black :eek:

walpurgis

28-11-2012, 11:31

That looks lovely.

Makes me wish I still had one of my Garrards.

I think the debate on slate versus granite is largely academic, the mass being great enough in either case for any resonances to be deeply subsonic and due to the inertness of the materials, very minor and probably irrevelant.

Anyway, very nice turntable!

Thermionic Idler

28-11-2012, 21:42

The 'doner' was a 301 --- I prefer to think of it as a re-body!

I am still on the original platter and bearing, upgraded platters/bearings are available but the jury is out on how far I'll go there... at the moment it's on the 'luxury list'. It's pretty damn close to reference quality as it stands. The combination of inert plinth and stronger chassis means you get what's on the record, nothing more, nothing less, no resonance or colouration. Rumble is non-existent, I've known some belt drive decks to be noisier than this one.

I'm reliably informed that the Schick armboard should be arriving in the next day or so, getting the Schick + SPU on there is something I've been itching to do for over a fortnight!

Thermionic Idler

02-12-2012, 00:35

The armboard arrived! Here it is with the Schick arm (I have one of the originals with the lacquered brass finish):

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8204/8236617992_ee011cbdd9_b.jpg

I dropped the stylus and immediately went "f**k that's good". As stated previously, the SME would probably need a rewire to make it a fair comparison --- but first impressions using the SPU seems to suggest the Schick takes the SME's strengths and builds upon them --- it just gives you more somehow --- more dynamics, more clarity, more detail --- without losing the music along the way which is the most important thing. It's a lovely arm and takes minutes to set up too!

As a bonus, here's also a pic of my power amp, which I finished building a couple of weeks ago, it warms your feet nicely when changing records:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8343/8235553519_bc414ca221_b.jpg

Marco

02-12-2012, 00:40

synsei

02-12-2012, 00:47

That is the nicest looking TT I have ever set eyes on Dave and the Schick arm could have been designed especially for it. I bet it sounds wonderful... :)

Ali Tait

02-12-2012, 00:55

Hope you're bringing that lot to the next Owston Dave!

Rare Bird

02-12-2012, 15:17

Apart from all the gold, loverly. Im more a chrome type of guy :eyebrows:

chelsea

02-12-2012, 16:13

Looks superb.
Can you tell me where the feet are from as i need some 75-80mm ones for my tt.

Rare Bird

02-12-2012, 16:59

http://www.smdacoustics.co.uk/pillars.shtml

chelsea

02-12-2012, 17:13

Cheers.
Sadly they look to small.
Will a friend to do som on his lathe i think.

Rare Bird

02-12-2012, 17:59

80mm are big un's, what we are short of on AOS is someone that can turn out one off engineering jobs :)

chelsea

02-12-2012, 18:04

Yes it is a single layer of slate and needs roughly 80mm to clear the 301 motor.
I'll get him to knock something up in ali or similar.

He has just made a couple of nice 3g anti skate weights for my fr arm.

Floyddroid

02-12-2012, 21:27

What a waste of jimmy Savile's grave stone. It would have made a great Garrard plinth. Very gothic!:eek: