View Full Version : Shure M91ED/SAS vs. M97eX?
Light Capture
11-10-2012, 22:27
I have a Shure M91ED cartidge.
Is it more advantages to upgrade the stylus to a Jico SAS for $140, or upgrade the whole cartridge to a stock M97eX for $70 from Amazon? I read one review say the M97eX is as good as a V15 III.
Has anyone actually compared the sound of a M91ED/SAS to a M97eX stock?
M91 SAS every time for me!
The original M91-ED for some obscure reason, sounded slightly better to me than the M75-ED. I have no idea why, since mechanically they were all but identical inside, but i hold that assertion :scratch: In stock form, with the original rough-polished stone on the end, it sounded very good. The Jico replacement stylus seems to offer more modern touches to this, but the SAS is something else entirely IMO.
As for the Me97XE - the DESIGN is bang up to date, Shure-wise, but some have commented the quality control can vary occasionally. An SAS stylus should take this even further I believe.
Both cartridges at their best, should offer great bass tracing and definition, a clear un-exaggerated midrange but with a treble that's totally dependant on loading and the quality of the diamond used. I thought the M75 and 91ED would sound very old fashioned, but they don't. They just sound restrained in the treble and any "spatial flatness" in the mid is phono stage and arm/deck dependant IMO. The 97 series are warm toned (actually a slight treble rolloff) but to me, offer the sonic picture in a smaller package than exalted expensive pickups, but it's all there and in the right proportion - IMO.....
Good luck :)
M91 SAS every time for me!
The original M91-ED for some obscure reason, sounded slightly better to me than the M75-ED. I have no idea why, since mechanically they were all but identical inside, but i hold that assertion :scratch: In stock form, with the original rough-polished stone on the end, it sounded very good. The Jico replacement stylus seems to offer more modern touches to this, but the SAS is something else entirely IMO.
As for the Me97XE - the DESIGN is bang up to date, Shure-wise, but some have commented the quality control can vary occasionally. An SAS stylus should take this even further I believe.
Both cartridges at their best, should offer great bass tracing and definition, a clear un-exaggerated midrange but with a treble that's totally dependant on loading and the quality of the diamond used. I thought the M75 and 91ED would sound very old fashioned, but they don't. They just sound restrained in the treble and any "spatial flatness" in the mid is phono stage and arm/deck dependant IMO. The 97 series are warm toned (actually a slight treble rolloff) but to me, offer the sonic picture in a smaller package than exalted expensive pickups, but it's all there and in the right proportion - IMO.....
Good luck :)
Spot on. I've had a few M97xe carts through my grubby mitts and all were slightly different. One had an out of alignment cantilever from new, another sounded as dull as ditchwater.
SAS stylus for $140? that's a stone cold bargain. However, just to throw an alternative into the mix and IHMO something better for the same money would be a good used M95HE. Rarer but to my ears, one of the best carts bar the V15III/Mxr or V15/V Shure ever made. I don't know if the SAS stylus for the M95 is the same, but it's a cracker by all account. I have a few Shures knocing about, some M75's. M91's and the 95HE. The 95 beats the others into a cocked hat in my system.
I also much prefer the 95 to the 97xe. Its a better cartridge in every area. The later M97 wasn't really an upgrade on the 95, if anything the reverse is true. The M75 and 91 may have been almost identical in some areas but I always found the M75 to be less refined and darker sounding. Great bass though!
That's good to know Paul, I have an M95 without a stylus stashed away in my bits 'n' pieces draw and I was considering pressing it into service once the stylus is shot on my 900IGC. I wonder how they will compare?
Interesting re M95 series. At the time, I hated the M95ED, finding the brightness and hardness just too much, even then, the V15III still sounding rather more subtle than this. having said that, the HE stylus transformed the V15III, so I'd expect the HE and SAS stylus should do the same for the 95 body as well.
By the way, Vinyl Engine has a thread or two about the SAS stylus and I believe the SAS styli measure better than the original HE and MR versions at high frequencies.
A favourite M97 model was the original M97HE. Warm toned with a lovely friendly balance, there was still plenty of mid and treble and the damper arrangement made use in massy arms no issue at all. They're fetching silly money now though, but I maintain my fondness for it, as I had a delightful record playing session with one recently, the Croft 25RS obviously helping no end :lol: Lovely sound though....
Interesting re M95 series. At the time, I hated the M95ED, finding the brightness and hardness just too much, even then, the V15III still sounding rather more subtle than this. having said that, the HE stylus transformed the V15III, so I'd expect the HE and SAS stylus should do the same for the 95 body as well.
By the way, Vinyl Engine has a thread or two about the SAS stylus and I believe the SAS styli measure better than the original HE and MR versions at high frequencies.
A favourite M97 model was the original M97HE. Warm toned with a lovely friendly balance, there was still plenty of mid and treble and the damper arrangement made use in massy arms no issue at all. They're fetching silly money now though, but I maintain my fondness for it, as I had a delightful record playing session with one recently, the Croft 25RS obviously helping no end :lol: Lovely sound though....
The 97 is getting quite rare and you're right, the HE stylus is a cracker. The performance in the 95 with the HE stylus is a big improvement on the ED. Its not overly bright but detailed. It is more refined than the ED and a better tracker too. Both the 95 and 97 with SAS stylus I reckon would be a V15 beater and head and shoulders above the M97xe.
The 97 is getting quite rare and you're right, the HE stylus is a cracker. The performance in the 95 with the HE stylus is a big improvement on the ED. Its not overly bright but detailed. It is more refined than the ED and a better tracker too. Both the 95 and 97 with SAS stylus I reckon would be a V15 beater and head and shoulders above the M97xe.
The M97HEII was the pick of all of them, with the best tracking ability of any 90 series Shure. It was so close in sound to the V15IIIHE that it was hard to justify the extra cost of the latter, which was 66% more expensive.
The strenght of these carts. is in their tracking ability & the sound of the midrange, as for bass, it is slow & not very extended. Treble is retiring, which is usefull if used in a bright system.
The bass of the M97HE hifi dave had in his TD124 with SME S2 (detachable) improved arm was no slouch I promise you ;)
The bass of the M97HE hifi dave had in his TD124 with SME S2 (detachable) improved arm was no slouch I promise you ;)
Sorry Dave we'll just have to disagree, it is a Shure characteristic.
I've been fitting Shures to God knows how many t/ts since 1974 ,with the last being about 2 weeks ago when I fitted an M97HE on a Luxman.
It is not a fault but a characteristic, as is the excellent midrange, uniform seperation & the slightly rolled off HFR.
If you ever get the chance to hear a Stanton 681EEE or Pickering XEV/3001 in a similar set-up & you will hear immediatly what I am talking about.
Having said that, when looking at what is available new today, the M97 is a match for the 3009R.
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