Rega DAC USB input.

[Martinh]

Hi all,

Has anyone compared the Rega DAC USB input against the SPDIF inputs?

I'm getting a rega and would like to use it direct from my PC via USB, if possible. I only listen to std res music and spotify premium.

I have a v-link but would like to reduce the box count on my rack if the SQ is the same.

Cheers,

[purite audio]

I would stick to the s/pdif input, USB is limited to 48khz and sounded poorer to me ,but obviously compare yourself.
A simple USB s/pdif converter will give you 24/192 from your USB port, reclock and galvonically isolate.
Keith.

[Martinh]

I would stick to the s/pdif input, USB is limited to 48khz and sounded poorer to me ,but obviously compare yourself.
A simple USB s/pdif converter will give you 24/192 from your USB port, reclock and galvonically isolate.
Keith.

Thanks Keith,

When you say a simple USB s/pdif converter, do you mean something decent like the v-link or m2 tech product or something cheap from ebay/amazon etc?

AS you say, the proof is in the listening.

cheers,

[Gazjam]

Listened to the Vlink2 (I have one) compared to an a mates Ebay special.
The Vlink was much better, more of everything.

Proved that they can sound better and the Vlink was a great bang for buck solution.

I'd go for one of those.

[roob]

Hiface 2 is very good and according to users on the CA forum better sounding than the MF offering, I am sure Keith will lend you one.

[purite audio]

Martin Hi, naturally I would recommend M2Tech, but best to get hold of both and compare in your own system.
KR Keith.

[Martinh]

Thanks chaps,

Sounds like the consensus is with the usb/spdif converter.

I have a V-Link II, so will try that first.

Cheers,

[RichB]

As a rega dac owner I'd say give it some time before spending money on converters, i appreciate these are good but find the usb presentation on the rega dac to be a bit smoother and more laid back sounding than the spdif.

Everything I've tried through spidf is very lively (a dvd player and a pc with digital audio out), full of excitement and quite forward in the presentation. Without doubt it is the better input and I suppose if you've got a load of hi-res downloads then its a necessity but the usb input is none too shabby and seems well isolated and noise free.

Perhaps when I've got some spare cash I might get a converter and have a muck around with it.

[John]

Think the V-link fine: I like to add is you putting another chip so if running USB I would rather go for a DAC that runs better using USB
When I listened to Clive do a review the Rega worked better with a converter in USB mode but was still not as good as the DACs that did not need this

[Martinh]

Think the V-link fine: I like to add is you putting another chip so if running USB I would rather go for a DAC that runs better using USB
When I listened to Clive do a review the Rega worked better with a converter in USB mode but was still not as good as the DACs that did not need this

Hi John,

Yes, I've seen that review (i think) and can see what you are saying there.

However, as well as SQ, I have to select products to fit into my system and also the need of my family to use it easily. I have 3 or 4 spdif + 1 USB source to convert.

So, it's going to have to be a bit of a compromise somewhere :(

The Rega seems to do everything (except maybe remote control) and has a warm-ish and appealing sound in my system.

Have bought one at a good price and will collect it tonight :)

Gonna try it with and without the v-link to see which one I like best.

Cheers,

[John]

The Rega nice and versitle and will still sound great with the V link When we tested the rega in USB mode there was a big difference using the JKenny mod HiFace

[DSJR]

I'm not as fussy it seems than many others here, and I found the USB input, fed by FLACs on one of Alex's laptops, very pleasant indeed. I understand the main reason for not wanting a direct electrical connection between computer and DAC is the possibility of nasty things being transmitted down the wires from one to t'other (appreciating the Rega USB input is galvanically isolated).

[bobbasrah]

I find the same David but that is with my kit and others where it has been trialled.
Please correct me if I am wrong, but as I understand it there are so many implementations of spdif and usb on both the computer/CDP and DAC, that trial and error is the only solution. JK's usb converter is excellent, but is only part of the chain.

[John]

It when you compare it to what other USB based DACs do you notice the difference I was quite suprised how big this was

[Martinh]

Got the Rega last night and it turns out that USB may not actually be an option. I'll try to explain why...

Unless I keep the Rega powered up 24/7, when you switch on the PC, it defaults back to the internal sound card.

Are you with me?

Put another way, the Rega needs to be on when I boot up windows, otherwise it can't find it and defaults to the inboard sound.

Setting it back to the Rega setting is a PITA indeed.

My v-link is USB powered, so it comes on automatically when the PC is started, so no problemo.

Anyway, had a good listening session this afternoon, with the Rega and Hafler power amp and its really good.

The combination of the warmish Rega and lush Hafler is giving me the full bodied sound that I was after. Very pleased.

Any thoughts on the USB?

Cheers,

[StanleyB]

The Rega is supposed to use the same USB chip as was used on the Caiman. I once published a link to a software patch that allows you to switch in and out the USB connection between PC and DAC from an icon on your PC screen. I can't remember where I filed it or if I still got the patch, but with a bit of luck someone else might have downloaded the file and still has a copy to share.

[Tim]

Well I guess as a very happy Rega DAC owner from its inception I should pipe up.

First off Martin, I have never once had the Rega not recognised by Windows 7 from my streamer and it makes no difference which is powered on first and I turn everything off at night, so that's a first for me - I have it configured as the default player in the Control Panel > Sound > Playback options, which I did configure manually the first time round, as I like to change icons and name the device, since then it defaults to that for playback every time - is it configured as your default device and what O/S are you using?

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/greatgig/rega.png

Regarding the inputs the Rega does work in different ways depending on which input you use. I have absorbed a lot of the articles regarding it and paid particular attention to anything said by Paul Gandy. Unless I have this wrong and perhaps Stan would know if I have, the input via USB uses a Burr-Brown PCM2707 USB receiver chip which limits the data transfer rate to a maximum of 16/48kHz. Comment has been made about it not being an asynchronous USB connection, but Rega made this decision deliberately and basically the PCM2707 reclocks the incoming data stream "on the fly," in order to avoid data loss and reduce jitter. They wanted to keep things simple by not processing the USB data stream up to 24/192 which the S/PDIF and TOSLINK inputs can handle, if you need it.

The S/PDIF and TOSLINK inputs use a Wolfson WM8805 transceiver chip, which will handle data with sample rates of up to 192kHz. The net result of this is that the two inputs have been reported to have different sonic characteristics and as noted here, the comments made are the same as have been made elsewhere by reviewers and other users. Not my words but generally the S/PDIF and TOSLINK inputs are described as sounding 'brighter and more forward' than USB and the USB 'a warmer more organic and valve like sound' From what I have read, in the main most users seem to prefer S/PDIF over USB, but this is obviously very subjective and I have only read a handful of reviews and there are a lot a Rega DAC owners out there.

From my own personal perspective I have tried a V-Link II and a SB Touch via S/PDIF and I didn't like the Touch at all, far too aggressive sounding which after awhile became fatiguing, the V-Link was more refined, but still bright. The Touch with EDO mod via USB sounded far superior to my ears, but still not as good as my server, so that's gone back.

The long and the short of this, is that I much prefer the USB input and as I am content with Red Book 16/44.1 I'm sticking with it and never bought the V-Link. I seem to like a pipe and slippers warmish sound it seems, in fact I totally bloody love it as I can play music all day long, with not a hint of fatigue. I guess a lot may depend on your choice of music, but as I mainly listen to female vocal and acoustic, the USB input coupled with Harbeth's stunning midrange makes my girlie's sound silky smooth, which makes me very, very happy. I've got the best sound going on now than I have ever had and listen to more music than I ever have, so job done for me (YMMV but try them both).

:)

PS. Rich, I have managed to try a Klotz clone too now and prefer the MG G2000, so many thanks for the offer of a trial, but not now required.

[RichB]

Yes, Tim has summed it up pretty well. The usb input is definately different sounding and a bit warmer, sounds pretty good streaming some blue note jazz via spotify on my old laptop.

Sorry I never got round toi sending that cable mate, been so busy going back and forth to the smoke. I even had it boxed up but kep forgetting to send it.:doh:

Anyway I'm pleased you got a chance to try it out and now i'm wondering what the MG cable could bring to the party as it really was night and day when i comapred the klotz to the others.

[DSJR]

Stereophile did an excellent (IMO) technical appraisal of the Rega DAC and bearing in mind Rega's long-standing love of vinyl, I'm not surprised that the design was tweaked to favour warmth over "etched clarity" as I suspect the M-DAC does. Which one's right? I haven't a clue really, since one would have to reference these two DACs to the DAC's that were used in the mastering (if from analogue sources) or at least the playback on mixing.

It's my current view that for long term listening AT HOME, the Rega does brilliantly, since one forgets its presence very quickly. I do appreciate, at least I hope I now do, that owners of big-n-beefy speakers and systems may prefer a more delineated approach to digital. In that case, I reckon I'd look at the Benchmark DACs as true references I think, since they don't seem to have a character at all, letting the recording mix and venue tell the story instead..

[Tim]

Indeed Dave, which one is right?

It all depends on what you favour and just as music tastes differ, so does our preference to how its delivered. I didn't enjoy the sound of the M-DAC at all but I do know its very popular..... now where did I put my pipe and slippers :scratch:

[DSJR]

Not at all, but purely the NECESSITY to "suspend disbelief" where domestic playback is concerned. We don't have the musicians to see recording a take through a window, and we're not at the mixing desk either. All we can do is to listen to the final mastered product as presented to us by the mastering engineer and try to use gear that reproduces it as accurately as reasonably possible, but in a way that helps us to enjoy the music.

[Martinh]

Thanks chaps,

The USB does sound quite a bit different to the spdif - USB is winning at the moment.

@Tim, thanks for that. I'm using Windows 7 64 bit.

My setup is a bit complicated :scratch:, since I use JRiver and spotify together.

JRiver exclusively uses the Rega USB and spotify & windows uses the PC's built-in sound card/optical out. Therefore, the windows default is the built in sound card/optical out and JRiver is configured to use the Rega USB exclusively.

When the PC boots up, both JRiver and Spotify auto start. I then control each one with it's own app on my iPad. The PC is headless (i.e. no display or keyboard).

I need to play around with it a bit, but I'm 90% sure that if JRiver can't find the Rega USB on boot up, it defaults back to the onboard sound/optical out.

Maybe I could use JRiver and Spotify both using the Rega USB and not use the JRiver exclusive mode? Would the sound quality drop?

I hope this makes sense :scratch:

[Tim]

I'm doing the same thing here Martin, but only JRiver starts at boot. If I want to use Spotify I just shut-down JRiver and open Spotify, both use the Rega as the default player. As I only use Spotify around 10% of the time, its no hassle to shut-down JRiver from my tablet and fire up Spotify. As soon as JRiver lets go of the DAC, Spotify defaults to it, works perfectly for me :)

I tend to listen to Spotify at work mostly on headphones for discovering new music, I don't normally use Spotify for general playback.

I have never tried to boot and start both applications at the same time, as I assumed there would be a conflict, which you have confirmed.

[Alex_UK]

The only times I have had problems is with Spotify/Jriver running at the same time - as long as only one is running it is fine. :)