Utterly Stupid Pricing......

[Lodgesound]

Three weeks ago the first listing for this machine was around $3500 (which is acceptable - almost).


For this kind of money in the professional field (this machine is NOT intended for the home user - it needs setup, calibration, full metering and analysis apparatus installed at it's place of operation and support that simply is not available now) you would not ureasonably expect:

Full 3 month warranty including all parts and labour charges.

Crating cost INCLUDED in the price

An engineer PROVIDED once the machine arrives to install and calibrate it for you

ALL manuals, extender cards and full service history details


To give you an idea these machines are now a quarter of a century old and their price new was £22 000.

The only good thing here is that this level of sheer greed and utter stupidity will actually collapse the market to sensible levels for this kind of machinery.

An acceptable price for this unit given that you will not be able to get support or spares and that when it does go wrong you will have to pay a professional engineer a minimum of £500 to even walk into your house or studio to start looking at it is £2500 - £3200.


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/STUDER-A-820-A820-MK-II-1-4-2-TRACK-MASTER-RECORDER-4-SPEED-WORLDWIDE-SHIPPING-/380471825353?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item5895e353c9

[realysm42]

I don't know what machine you're talking about?

[Lodgesound]

Sorry - link added...

[WOStantonCS100]

Yes, yes, yes... high priced... BUT... this is just the machine to make a copy of the 6.4 million dollar Gershwin: Strike Up the Band CD that is also available.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gershwin-Strike-Up-the-Band-Rhapsody-in-Blue-Girl-Cr-/130454367511?pt=Music_CDs&hash=item1e5fafad17

[Macca]

He is including set up and calibration if you read the blurb. Implied, anyway.

[goraman]

I know someone with one of these, he is the guy who recapped a NAD amp for our store.
$20.000 is what they are worth and there pretty hard to find.
There are hifi at it's best. There is also a Dolby system that needs to be matched with it.

[Sonority]

Anything is only worth what 'someone' is prepared to pay?
If this is not worth the price then it will remain unsold?
If you can find another and it's cheaper then you could buy that one I guess.
Otherwise rock & hard place spring to mind.
I detest paying as much as I do for diesel..

[Lodgesound]

Sorry but no way are they worth anywhere near £20 000 - they match with a Dolby 363 which can be bought for around £400 now.

The last one of these to come up for sale from a studio was £2600 which is fair and reasonable.

They are'nt HiFi you are absolutely right - they are professional and that puts them in a completely different league. They cannot be used practically in the home as they need full monitoring facilities and line up / calibration each time they are used.

As has also been said - the market will adjust in time as these prices are just far too high.

[goraman]

In the U.S. my friend paid over
$18,000 several years ago and it came with the floor stand and all the Dolby filtering.
They go for big bucks in the U.S. when you can find them and there play back is very hifi.
I'll see if Paul will send me a picture. of his set up with the big Studer.
His was freshly serviced with records.

[Nick_G]

Someone's selling an Audiolab 8000T tuner on eBay Germany and asking 1800 Euros for it:

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Audiolab-8000T-Tuner-8000-Empfanger-T-/300786301093?pt=DE_Audio_Hi_Fi_Weitere_Hi_Fi_Kompo nenten_Surround_Decoder&hash=item460842b8a5#ht_987wt_1849

That's what I call silly money. Can't see anyone biting...

[DSJR]

These things are now bought as male jewellery for collectors and I'd be very surprised if it was ever used in all honesty. Pros wouldn't pay this kind of money in any case, assuming they wanted an analogue machine in the first place.

What happens to these mastering studio's with analogue playback gear? Is there a team of engineers around the country who can service these things, or is it less necessary as these surviving machines aren't used 24/7 any more?

[nat8808]

Poeple probably use them without set-up or servicing and tell everyone how great it sounds, how the treble loss from poor set up is warmth etc.

Relisted due to a non-payer... no shit !

[Lodgesound]

There are still a few engineers who will travel to repair these things but they are becoming increasingly rare now.

The point is as has already been said these are not for home use and this price is just stupidly high......it will break and fault finding is a nightmare on these (I speak from experience).

They also have to be set up for EVERY TAPE that is used on them - that is a complete calibration as modern tape is so variable in quality.

Couple this with £100 an hour in running costs (that is what new tape stock costs running @ 15 ips) and it is simply not a viable option EVEN in most studio operations now given that clients now want everything for £10.99 or less.

This stupidity will stop and very soon (before the end of the year) as it is just being fuelled by chancers.

[nat8808]

What I see is people trying to influence the perception of high value of items by listing high-priced Buy It Now's on eBay that never sell.

People get used to the idea of seeing the high prices and start to think the items are actually worth that much.

One good example is with EMTs. I always used to see EMT 948s and 950 around the £700 - £1200 mark as auctions but Buy It Nows are up around the £3.5 - £5k mark !

I've not seen many as plain auctions recently but a nicely listed EMT 948 just sold for £680 or so which is what they were last time I saw a proper auction!

[Lodgesound]

Yes indeed Nat & I believe that this trend is totally unsustainable.

It is purely driven by folk who really know nothing about what they are selling - these prices will settle down in around 6 - 9 months time as no-one is buying and - most especially in the case of tape recorders - the cost of magnetic tape is so high now (£100 an hour!) that actually using a professional machine for home listening is entirely impractical.

Also as you say £600 - £700 is what an EMT in good condition is actually worth - no more.

To give you an idea these change hands for around £300 in the industry.

[WOStantonCS100]

Absolutely...

I found my first Revox PR99 for $50. This was great because I had already factored in servicing which ran approx. $500. Now, folks want $500 to $800 to $1400 for the unit without any real guarantees. Well, add in servicing/parts, which it probably does need and suddenly the machine is a lot more and not such a steal. Now factor in that it's a full Pro Studer... ...might want to have a whole lot of cash at your disposal over and above the selling price. I live 30 minutes away from the only factory Revox authorized repair person in the US. If I didn't, I would have also had to factor in shipping and insurance.

You can only say so much. The rest is letting folks figure it out (and/or take the hit). Not much else you can do.

[Beechwoods]

I agree, people seem to expect 'mint' prices for gear that has no guarantees whatsoever. If it spins, that's 'fully working'. I would never expect a machine to be 'calibrated' properly upon purchase unless it had had a reputable named service and setup beforehand.

I've had machines that were supposedly 'serviced' and still had shedloads (literally) of oxide on the rubbers and heads. A mate with a cotton-bud and some distilled water does not equal a service.

[nat8808]

I agree, people seem to expect 'mint' prices for gear that has no guarantees whatsoever. If it spins, that's 'fully working'. I would never expect a machine to be 'calibrated' properly upon purchase unless it had had a reputable named service and setup beforehand.

I've had machines that were supposedly 'serviced' and still had shedloads (literally) of oxide on the rubbers and heads. A mate with a cotton-bud and some distilled water does not equal a service.

What? It's not a proper "Service"? I'd better cross that "service engineer" bit off my CV then.

"Seller-Refurbished" catagory on eBay is always good for a laugh..

Plus that must be a very very tiny shed for it to be litterally shedloads. :)

[Beechwoods]

It was :)

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/11179333/mZbjZpiRqEkFAu6ld-2zOXA.jpg

[Lodgesound]

At the sort of prices being asked for these machines now at the VERY least in the same country you would expect:

1. Free delivery and installation
2. Full calibration to a relevant tape stock
3. At least 3 months full parts and labour warranty

Very few sellers can offer any of this.......getting the Pledge out and giving the surface of the machine a wipe over does not constitute a full service!

Any lesser deal then the machine is effectively being sold as vintage equipment which is now unsupported and on the understanding that you will need professional training and/or experience to use it properly or more importantly repair and calibrate it.

Folk need to be made aware of this.

[Lodgesound]

Looking at some ebay silly silly reel to reel prices today I can see they are already dropping the BIN prices as folk just are'nt biting (what a surprise!).

Give this a year and they will be back to sensible levels.