View Full Version : Another Rega Rp3 vs Technics SL-1210 thread
Hi everyone!
Just wondering, I have the opportunity to get a new RP3 with an Ortofon 2M Bronze for €699/£550.
Or I could get an used Technics SL 1210 for £200, spend another £150 in a Denon Dl-110 and a Sumiko or Ortofon headshell and another £200 in an Achromat mat, Vantage feet and Cardas rewire, spending a total of £550 too.
Both tables will get future upgrades, the Rega a TTPSU, subplatter and acrylic platter; the Technics an external PSU, an Oyaide platter and maybe a new tonearm, a Jelco or an Audiomods or Audio Origami, making all those upgrades a much more expensive investment than the Rega, but hopefully a better table overall too.
So, which path should I take?
And how should a good upgraded Technics compare to a Michell Gyro?
Stratmangler
04-08-2012, 14:42
After running belt driven decks for many years I have ended up with a SL-1210, and I'm getting better sounds from my vinyl than ever before.
Audioman
04-08-2012, 22:32
Hi everyone!
So, which path should I take?
And how should a good upgraded Technics compare to a Michell Gyro?
They are quite different sounding. A Technics will never soundstage like a Gyro. A Gyro will have more space and air to the music, the Technics a more precise punchier sound. You will have to spend a lot on moding a Technics to outperform a Gyro with upgraded power supply IMHO.
The Rega is NEW and CURRENT, with a strong warranty and after sales care potential. Set up right (their own wall shelf is now expensive but works!), it'll involve you in a ligtning-fast and tactile presentation and last for decades...
The Techie is now well discontinued and NEW spares won't be around for much longer (I get the feeling that some of these companies junk unused spares after a few years to make room...). Little to no dealer/warranty backup and I doubt there are more than a very few hundred tweaked ones out there (how many of these fancy supplies and upgrades have actually been sold I wonder?). Having said that, you have "the family" here to help with fettling, and a host of third-party upgrades at various prices, as well as currently, a huge used market for parts and future donors...
Since many/most? on this forum are inveterate tweakers :lol: the Techie is probably the way forward for you :)
krugdoktor
05-08-2012, 10:48
They are quite different sounding. A Technics will never soundstage like a Gyro. A Gyro will have more space and air to the music, the Technics a more precise punchier sound. You will have to spend a lot on moding a Technics to outperform a Gyro with upgraded power supply IMHO.
But no amount of upgrades will make a Gyro better than a fully fettled Technics!
No, but it'll look way cooler! :D
Stratmangler
05-08-2012, 13:21
No, but it'll look way cooler! :D
Ah, so you express a liking for jewelry :eyebrows:
RobbieGong
05-08-2012, 14:11
No, but it'll look way cooler! :D
Depends on what you do with the Techie, Some of the mods make it look very cool indeed ie: Issonoes and some of the upgrade platters also a Techie never looks fragile :eyebrows:
krugdoktor
05-08-2012, 14:20
Pedro is right! The bling-factor of a 12xx is quite low, but I listen with my ears and maybe it also helps that my audio system is located behind my listening seat and so the appearance of my gear does not detract from musical pleasure.
Many here seem to love the Gyro, but I always thought it messy and, well, wayward, all the atmosphere smearing it all up. I did hear several examples set up and listened to in various dem rooms, so I don't think setup had a huge amount to do with it. The fact the Orbe is far more stable in sonics to my ears (again, one or two different samples), backs it up for me, if noone else. To me, a Spacedeck is a far better turntable than the Gyro sonically, if not in fine finish, but then, I seem to favour solidly mounted decks overall, even of many of the ones I've used over the years have been springy belt drives..
If you buy a techie, leave out the DL103 until you can get an arm to do the thing justice. Far better in the standard arm would be the Ortofon 2M Bronze you mentioned, or even a black if funds allow. The cartridge would then easily withstand upgrades made to the deck itself IMO.
I was joking about the Gyro. As much as I love its looks, I really can't afford it and do prefer spend a lot less in a better sounding table. After all, we're here for the sound, even if our eyes eat too... But the question was honest, I was curious about the comparison on both tables. The Gyro is an incredible piece of design, though.
Well, I guess a DL-110/160 or even a 103 is much cheaper than a MM Bronze. I could try an AT-440 but my dealer only supplies MCs from Audio Technics. They are Sumiko distributors also, but I think Denon are better value for money. Or I can get online but wouldn't be having the bonus of having all professionally set up.
Additionally, just found out that the Mission 774 arms are being sold for peanuts, likewise for Rega, so no worries for changing the arm. Just not sure if it is worth, lots of people don't dislike the Technics arm, specially with Cardas rewire. I could later place a better one. And a Dynavector 10x5 or a Benz Micro, funds allowing.
So.... Questions now!
1. which should be the best cart to start off on the Technics? Denon, AT or Ortofon (MM Blue I guess)
2. What is the best headshell for the Denon Dl-110, should I decide going for Denon, or any other cart, for that matter? Ortofon of Sumiko?
3. How does the Mission 774 Jelco arm work with the Techie?
Depends on what you do with the Techie, Some of the mods make it look very cool indeed ie: Issonoes and some of the upgrade platters also a Techie never looks fragile :eyebrows:
Yes those are cool. Not so fond of the Isonoes though. But it's like comparing a Honda with golden weels to a Jaguar... :D
But a Techie with an SME 309 and the Oyaide platter does look bloody great though!
WOStantonCS100
05-08-2012, 18:32
Ahh, the slug-fest continues... :lol:
When I first got a serious income I was looking for a real TT. After all, I had grown up with my dad's Garrards and Techies. I went to the only high end store in the area with the idea of securing a P3. Being absolutely honest, I really wanted the P3 to wipe the floor with the Techies, especially since I do like a minimalistic presentation. Everything I read in the "hi-fi" journals (1990's) said it would. After a couple of hours of annoying the salesperson, I walked out disheartened. Thus began my skepticism with "hi-fi" journals and a full scale return to what had gone before; old was new again. I had considered a Thorens; but, there was not a local dealer as far as the eye could see.
Audioman
05-08-2012, 18:56
I was joking about the Gyro. As much as I love its looks, I really can't afford it and do prefer spend a lot less in a better sounding table. After all, we're here for the sound, even if our eyes eat too... But the question was honest, I was curious about the comparison on both tables. The Gyro is an incredible piece of design, though.
It's also an Incredibly fine sounding deck for the money. Not just looks as some still appear to think though that was a more popular misconception when Linnology ruled and Chris Frankland and his cohorts reckoned it was rubbish. It's not smeary and very good speed stability at least from the intro of the QC onwards. (No wobbly piano notes).
I think you will have to spend a lot more buying and modifying a Technics to the required level to beat it given the rising price of decent used examples. The Orbe is even better and with decks such as Notts Analogue Hyperspace and Oracle provide a ready made competitive sound for those who are not compulsive tweakers. Also parts and service readily available.
Listen to a Spacedeck in comparison and then you may get an idea of my vibes on the Gyro - then listen to the Orbe.. Nuff said by me on this..
The Sumiko Blue Point is still under £200 I believe, so should be in the rinning. I really don't think the DL110 and 150 offer too much over decent mm types in this price range (2M Blue?). This was the certainly case comparing the likes of the 520 with the DL110 way back, and the 2M Blue and maybe even the Red should be at least as good I reckon.
Stratmangler
05-08-2012, 19:53
Listen to a Spacedeck in comparison and then you may get an idea of my vibes on the Gyro - then listen to the Orbe.. Nuff said by me on this..
The Sumiko Blue Point is still under £200 I believe, so should be in the rinning. I really don't think the DL110 and 150 offer too much over decent mm types in this price range (2M Blue?). This was the certainly case comparing the likes of the 520 with the DL110 way back, and the 2M Blue and maybe even the Red should be at least as good I reckon.
The 520 was a fierce fecker if ever there was one.
The 110 is much better balanced tonally, if a little plummy and monotone.
My dealer has the DL-160 for €120. That's £95! I will check later if he didn't make any mistake. Also, fono.de (http://www.fono.de/Tonabnehmer/Denon/Denon-DL-110-MC-Tonabnehmer) has the DL-110 for around same price.
The AT-440MLa costs in Germany €160.
Now which headshell should I get for either or how can I set these carts up in Technics original tonearm?
Ortofon LH-2000 (at 16,2g) or Sumiko HS-12 (11,4g)?
I'd really like to keep the headshell and cart under €200...
Hi Pedro
I've compare the stock shell with the Sumiko using the same cart and the Sumiko gives a large improvement. That's bass, top, mids, and overall solidity of the sound. Not tried the Ortofon shell. Either will be fine I suspect, the important thing is to ditch the stock shell for a quality item. You will need the additional screw in counter-weight to balance them out though, so if you've lost it order one now ;)
With the stock shell the unmodded Teccy sounds very ordinary except for its timing and I wonder how many people have dismissed it for that reason?
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