Lightweight stand filling material

[walpurgis]

Just spotted this on eBay.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/190704243440?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&trksid=p3984.m1423.12649

Talc filled polypropylene granules. Should be ideal for stand filling as polypropylene has good self damping.

[overtsi]

Seems rather expensive, the talc element veers towards the pervy, these work, I use them in Skylan stands.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2KG-3KG-4KG-4-9KG-PELLET-Weighted-Filling-Beads-PelletsTeddy-Draft-Excluder-Doll-/130723652593?pt=UK_Crafts_Beads_CA&var=&hash=item1e6fbca3f1#ht_1502wt_1123

[DSJR]

You're going to hate me for this, but I'm going to say it - UPGRADE YOUR SPEAKER STANDS!!!!!

Harbeth's Alan Shaw has done a huge amount to try to debunk the speaker stand "thang" yet "those wot know" these things with Harbeth often recommend the custom Something Solid XF open-frame stands for them, as THEY SOUND BETTER with these speakers and have been preferred to Skylan in direct comparison - oh yes indeedy!!!!!

Put it this way, the "Number two" at Harbeth uses them :lol: I have no idea if Alan himself has a domestic setup or whether he's listened out after a hard day working on his products... He's probably only too happy to give his ears a rest quite frankly :)

[realysm42]

What do you mean "thang" David?

[Stratmangler]

Think Texas - think drawl.
Think "Sweet Little Thang".
Thang is the same as thing.
Fanny is a different matter :eyebrows:

[realysm42]

That helps a lot.

I'm asking about the context of the sentence "Harbeth's Alan Shaw has done a huge amount to try to debunk the speaker stand "thang""

[Tim]

I think what Dave was alluding to is that Alan Shaw (Harbeth's designer) often goes to great lengths telling people you don't need bespoke or specialist stands for his speakers. He claims they will sound just as good on Ikea Lack tables or plant stands. You can view pictures of his development room (not much more than an extension to his house), where he has his speakers setup on Ikea low tables, like the Lack.

Its the cause of constant discussion on the Harbeth forum, which can get heated at times. The majority seem to favour a dedicated stand and the Something Solid stands (open frame) are very widely regarded as being the best for Harbeth speakers, which allow the cabinets to flex.

These are Something Solid stands supporting a Harbeth SHL5. No filling needed here ;)

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/greatgig/solid.jpg

[overtsi]

No Dave,I don't hate you, I just choose not to take your opinion and am unlikely to be persuaded by a random sprinkling of capitalisations. You have certainly misrepresented the views on the HUG about the supremacy of Something Solid stands.

Alan Shaw does not manufacture amplifiers and no longer produces loudspeaker stands.It is a perfectly reasonable marketing position for him to suggest that his products will work on a wide range of supports and can be successfully enjoyed when powered by an equally broad range of amplification.

I have found something that works for me, in my room with my partnering equipment, I'm sure that you will allow me that choice.

Back at the original posting: plastic beads are useful in adding damping without weight, I don't know how successful they would be as a filling in metal stands.

[DSJR]

No probs, but it wouldn't hurt to try some XF stands at some point, if you haven't already done so. They're not pretty, although better than when I used to sell them, but they do work, especially on C7's which can sound "thuddy" if not properly mounted I found...

Anyway, the filling you suggest should work well. As long as the stand is inert and supporting the speakers at the corners, fine :)

P.S. You're new here and maybe misinterpreted my enthusuasm and the way it's expressed. I hope you stay and can get used to it :)

[chelsea]

Seems rather expensive, the talc element veers towards the pervy, these work, I use them in Skylan stands.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2KG-3KG-4KG-4-9KG-PELLET-Weighted-Filling-Beads-PelletsTeddy-Draft-Excluder-Doll-/130723652593?pt=UK_Crafts_Beads_CA&var=&hash=item1e6fbca3f1#ht_1502wt_1123

But it is £3 cheaper.

[overtsi]

Stuart, Not here as a shill for mandy, am I misunderstanding your post? 2kg at £7.00 for plastic pellets is cheaper than 2kg at £11 for the talc-filled, I did not look at postage: the eBay listing I quoted has a pull down menu which allows you to choose the weight. I am, however, intrigued by the concept of talc filled plastic beads, I would be pleased to know what was their original purpose.

Dave, I am new here, but not new to the planet.Neither am I a shill for Skylan. Many people who look at the design without actually ever actually touching them will not realise, as I am sure you do, that they appear to be massive but actually weigh less than than the Something Solid stands.The top plate and base are coated MDF and the legs are plastic - which is why plastic pellets are a suitable filling, adding damping but very little extra mass.In effect they support the speakers on four threaded steel rods which run down the legs from top to base and, because of this, they are more like an open frame than a massy steel box-leg frame. I appreciate that sometimes it is better to buy a product which does not need 'tweaking' but the interface between speaker stands and the floor is one which I believe can be tuned at very little cost but considerable benefit,

[chelsea]

Was just pointing out as postage is £7 and the £11 ones are Free p&p.

[overtsi]

Stuart, I thought it might be that. It can be difficult to calculate volume/weight needs, but 4 pillar 40 cm stands take approx 5kgs of plastic pellets to 75% fill, so with postage fixed at £7, in those terms, it does work out less expensive. Although if you spend £350+ on stands it should not be such an issue.

I still want to know what is the advantage of talc fill over other PTFE pellets for injection moulding.There must be a specialist forum for that, although I am reluctant to Google it in case I get drawn into an unsavoury world.

[realysm42]

The unsavoury world of plastic filled pellets, terrifying :eek:

You reckon this stuff would work better than (kiln dried) sand?

[bobbasrah]

The unsavoury world of plastic filled pellets, terrifying :eek:

You reckon this stuff would work better than (kiln dried) sand?

Not sure my maths are ok Martin, but that's...
Plastic Beads 5 Tonnes/m3 ? @ 3.50/kg:scratch: 17.500 quid/m3
Sand 1.6 Tonnes/m3 @ ? No idea of sand prices nowadays, but think it should be a bit cheaper than that...:mental:
The chalk filled beads are certainly a curiosity...
How long before some nugget drops you in it for dealing wil pre-packaged coke pellets though....?:eek:

[realysm42]

I think I might have misunderstood you here, are you talking about filling a set of speaker stands? If so, I did my Atacama 5i's for about a fiver, I don't know why we're talking tonnes of anything?!

[bobbasrah]

I think I might have misunderstood you here, are you talking about filling a set of speaker stands? If so, I did my Atacama 5i's for about a fiver, I don't know why we're talking tonnes of anything?!

Sorry Martin, just relative pricing mate nothing more.;)
Bloody expensive and heavy filling compared to sand though in terms of whatever volume :eek:

[walpurgis]

Hello all,

I originally drew attention to the polypropylene pellets on eBay as a LIGHTWEIGHT stand filler with potentially good self damping properties. The use of sand sort of misses the point.

Incidentally, if you do want an effective heavy filler, one which I've used is the decorative crushed stone chips available at garden centres, once in the stands the small stone pieces interlock and damp the stand very well. Less messy than sand too, which likes to leak out at every opportunity.

[realysm42]

I don't know if it misses the point as I was just asking for a comparison between the two; I wasn't making any sugegstions.

I'm interested to know if it's 'better' is all.

[Tarzan]

You're going to hate me for this, but I'm going to say it - UPGRADE YOUR SPEAKER STANDS!!!!!

Harbeth's Alan Shaw has done a huge amount to try to debunk the speaker stand "thang" yet "those wot know" these things with Harbeth often recommend the custom Something Solid XF open-frame stands for them, as THEY SOUND BETTER with these speakers and have been preferred to Skylan in direct comparison - oh yes indeedy!!!!!

Put it this way, the "Number two" at Harbeth uses them :lol: I have no idea if Alan himself has a domestic setup or whether he's listened out after a hard day working on his products... He's probably only too happy to give his ears a rest quite frankly :)

Er, have to disagree there David, l had the Something Solid stands under me Harbs, they looked er- ugly, ordered the Skylans sounded quite a bit better and looked really cool, all in my system, room, etc.

[bobbasrah]

Seem to recollect polyurethane/? foam or kitty litter being previously suggested as a lightweight alternative to sand but not sure if it was trialled and what the effect was.... Litter can be dusty stuff compared to chalk filled pellets, but if the stand were big enough it could be sealed in bags I guess....
It certainly appears a lot cheaper than the eBay options.

Regarding the (heavy) eBay solid plastic pellets, do any of you know if would this be feedstock for plastic extrusion machines ?
Simply curious what it's original purpose would be that's all...

[Tim]

I know the maker of Skylan stands has used kitty litter and reported good results. He recommended no filling them completely with filling.

[Tarzan]

l had my Skylans fully filled with sand, then l after reading on the Harbeth User Group that this was wrong, l emptied all the sand out, ready to fill with Kitty Litter, but l have not got round to this as this as the change in sound was so dramatic, so for the time being l am playing them like this and me Harbs have never sounded better-result:)