View Full Version : Record Deck advice needed
Hello reader of this post.
I'm currently in a dilemma of what record deck to get a friend. I'm looking for an entry level deck and really not sure the what to get for the money.
I visited a local shop which has two project turntables for sell both Project Debut I believe one costing £230 and one costing £350(this with the carbon arm).
When I first set out on my venture I was trawling through ebay looking at decks and to no avail have I got a deck to this day.
Value for money do you think these decks are worth it or what would you recommend?
Many thanks for replies in advance!
The best and safest low cost deck to buy new in my opinion is the Rega RP1, which is available for not much over £200. I personally feel it's better developed than the cheaper Pro-Jects, comes with an upgradable Ortofon cartridge (just buy a higher model stylus) and it performs better than the P2 it effectlively replaces. I've been put off a bit by the little Debut II I had for a while. Loads of motor noise being transmitted into the cartridge and tightening/loosening things, changing mats etc made no difference. Adding the SE upgrade kit cured one issue but did nothing for the upper bass/lower midrange whine this motor in stock form put into the speakers. I appreciate the later Debuts are better here if not totally cured, but since I sold the Rega brand for twenty five years or so and never had less than excellent service and spares backup, it's a no brainer IMO...
Of course, there's the HUGE rats nest of the used market, and £200 could buy you quite a nice turntable, including a Techie, Lenco or good condition Rega 3, as well as a host of springy belt drives from Thorens, AR and so on. But that's the hobbyist in me coming out :lol:
Beobloke
18-05-2012, 11:45
I've not heard an RP1 but it's difficult to go wrong with a Pro-Ject. That said, I still think the Genie is a better deck than the Debut.
hifi_dave
18-05-2012, 11:53
I've stocked Project off and on.
I would recommend the Rega RP1. It sounds truly excellent, totally reliable, no set up issues and holds it's value if your friend gets hooked and wants to upgrade. Nothing comes close at the price IMO.
I've stocked Project off and on.
I would recommend the Rega RP1. It sounds truly excellent, totally reliable, no set up issues and holds it's value if your friend gets hooked and wants to upgrade. Nothing comes close at the price IMO.
Thank you to all so far. Ah it's a shame because the local shop only stores the projects and they weren't as convinced with the Rega.
Does the performance pack seem worth it?
Included in the pack
Bias 2 moving magnet cartridge
Upgrade drive belt
100% natural wool turntable mat
Still open for suggestions or more people fighting the Project's corner.
Get a used Technics sl1200 or 1210 - fit a Sumiko headshell, cork/rubber mat and a cheap Nagaoka cartridge. Will make the Projects and Regas sound like child's toys and there are plenty of mods that can be done to improve the set up further in the future.
RobbieGong
18-05-2012, 12:24
Get a used Technics sl1200 or 1210 - fit a Sumiko headshell, cork/rubber mat and a cheap Nagaoka cartridge. Will make the Projects and Regas sound like child's toys and there are plenty of mods that can be done to improve the set up further in the future.
I Agree !! - Shop carefully for a tidy non dj'd one and once you hold one of these in your hands you'll realise what a very well built turntable it is - as solid as solid can be :) and will put some tension on your biceps as you hold it - trust me :lol: It also sounds good stock and very good with a decent cart on board. Speed stability like no other and sooo easy to use.
Haselsh1
18-05-2012, 14:36
I have a Project RPM-4 with SE upgrade kit and it completely annihilates the SL1210 I had in 2010. OK so the SL1210 was a stock machine but there was simply no comparison. The detail that comes from the Project is just so far in advance of the Techie. I also use a cork mat not a wool or felt one.
Can open, worms everywhere
northwest
18-05-2012, 15:00
Can open, worms everywhere
Perzackly!
prestonchipfryer
18-05-2012, 15:23
:exactly:
Let's just say I don't feel any better suited to making a decision.
The budget is £300 max I would prefer to be paying under £250.
I'm not technically savvy as I sadly don't own a deck myself I'm moving out of home soon and won't be able to use the one here.
If I was to choose between the Rega RP1 and Project Debut which would be the best way to go?
Would it be worth getting the performance pack for the Rega, or getting the Debut with the Carbon arm?
Any alternatives would be great i.e. this one on ebay but I really want to get this in the next 3 weeks and as I don't know the value of some of the decks hinted around it's hard for me the gauge. (all the better for the seller)
Thank you all for your help so far ;)
Beobloke
18-05-2012, 15:52
If I was to choose between the Rega RP1 and Project Debut which would be the best way to go?
GENIE GENIE GENIE!!!!
Honestly, no-one listens to me. Then they moan that I was right all along and they should have listened to me.
Stuff this, I'm going home for a beer.....
:cool::cool:
:ner:
Hi Karl,
The question you have to ask yourself is: do you want a 'plug & play' solution, with decent sonic performance, so you can just sit back and enjoy the music?
Or...
Do you mind doing a little bit of tweakery, for minimal outlay, with the potential for reaping some significant sonic rewards and hearing your favourite records like never before (grossly outperforming the results provided by the going the other route, above)?
If it's the former, buy the Rega or Pro-ject. If it's the latter, buy a good second-hand Technics SL-1200/1210.
A lightly-modded Technics will make either of the belt-drive T/Ts mentioned sound broken, and also provide the potential of slowly building something very special indeed, whereas the Rega or Pro-ject will always simplly be a 'dead end' budget T/T.
The decision is yours! :cool:
Marco.
GENIE GENIE GENIE!!!!
Honestly, no-one listens to me. Then they moan that I was right all along and they should have listened to me.
Stuff this, I'm going home for a beer.....
:cool::cool:
:ner:
I noticed someone from the Private Exhibitions was selling one although that might not be up to the same standard as these?
This is also a deck for home use only.
Sorry for my flippant earlier post. I'd go with a Technics, they not only sound better than the Project but are easier to set up & live with day to day. I have a Project essential that I've currently shelved, sounds ok but everytime I breathe heavily on it a bit falls off and I always manage to pull the belt off when changing a record, they just don't feel that solid.
hifi_dave
18-05-2012, 16:08
Thank you to all so far. Ah it's a shame because the local shop only stores the projects and they weren't as convinced with the Rega.
I'd love a Pound for every time I've heard that over the past 38 years from dealers who can't stock Rega. What sane dealer would turn away Rega ? It doesn't happen but there are plenty of dealers who can't get the Rega agency for one reason or the other.
If you want a £200 ish one stop, no mess turntable, there isn't anything to equal a Rega RP1. IMO
Hi Karl,
If it's the former, buy the Rega or Pro-ject. If it's the latter, buy a good second-hand Technics SL-1200/1210.
A lightly-modded Technics will make either of the belt-drive T/Ts mentioned sound broken, and also will give you the potential to slowly build something very special indeed, whereas the Rega or Pro-ject will always just be a 'dead end' budget T/T.
The decision is yours! :cool:
Marco.
Hmm a tough one. When you speak like this I am tempted to just go bottom of the road project at £250 as an extra £300 seems hardly worth it for a Carbon arm if I will be wanting to move this deck on for better performance in a few years.
I'd love to bother with it and get the best deck knowing what I am looking at is the biggest problem obviously the cartridge/arm is making a big difference on the price of completed listings. :doh:
Decisions are not my forte when one thing makes sense but out of depth also springs to mind.
I first started the search looking for a Rotel RP3300 before I came here there were quite a few since then the markets really dried up. Rebel revolvers I've been keeping an eye out for or a sansui triple but to no avail.
In the last month I have started looking at the new models as I want to just move on and get a deck! :mental:
I'd love a Pound for every time I've heard that over the past 38 years from dealers who can't stock Rega. What sane dealer would turn away Rega ? It doesn't happen but there are plenty of dealers who can't get the Rega agency for one reason or the other.
If you want a £200 ish one stop, no mess turntable, there isn't anything to equal a Rega RP1. IMO
Something to do with Project making too many models than it's worth but they try to cater everyone's need.
Rega on the other hand moving production to China? I expect you'll be expecting another £1? I have no idea where the production of any of it is i.e. Projects.
Wakefield Turntables
18-05-2012, 16:18
Rega / 1210 - Both offer great value for money. I'd go for the 1210. Even stock 1210's can sound great.
If you want a £200 ish one stop, no mess turntable, there isn't anything to equal a Rega RP1. IMO
As a new option, I can't argue with that, and suspect that this is the way Karl should go :)
Marco.
Rega / 1210 - Both offer great value for money. I'd go for the 1210. Even stock 1210's can sound great.
1200s are better ;)
hifi_dave
18-05-2012, 16:39
Something to do with Project making too many models than it's worth but they try to cater everyone's need.
Rega on the other hand moving production to China? I expect you'll be expecting another £1? I have no idea where the production of any of it is i.e. Projects.
Rega have always taken great pride in the fact that everything they make is made here, in Southend on Sea.
They are a great success because of the value for money, reliability and service second to none. So much so that they have now taken on 17 more staff to manufacture turntables and cartridges on the night shift.
Haselsh1
18-05-2012, 16:58
GENIE GENIE GENIE!!!!
Honestly, no-one listens to me. Then they moan that I was right all along and they should have listened to me.
Stuff this, I'm going home for a beer.....
:cool::cool:
:ner:
I'd love to join you with the beer, preferably Old Speckled Hen please. I feel like getting so pissed right now.
Rega have always taken great pride in the fact that everything they make is made here, in Southend on Sea.
They are a great success because of the value for money, reliability and service second to none. So much so that they have now taken on 17 more staff to manufacture turntables and cartridges on the night shift.
I did make a faux pas. The store does have a Rega RP1 in stock. Although he wasn't impressed saying it was "shamed older Planar 2".
Not that it's really relevant to this though, but clears up why he wasn't selling it to me. Then again the Project is more expensive maybe that may be his bias.
Haselsh1
18-05-2012, 17:00
LOL, my ears tell me the truth.
Haselsh1
18-05-2012, 17:01
I did make a faux pas. The store does have a Rega RP1 in stock. Although he wasn't impressed saying it was "shamed older Planar 2".
Not that it's really relevant to this though, but clears up why he wasn't selling it to me. Then again the Project is more expensive maybe that may be his bias.
Bias...! Love it...! LOL
Wakefield Turntables
18-05-2012, 17:21
1200s are better ;)
I would agree but the guys on a budget hence my bias to Rega.
Rega have always taken great pride in the fact that everything they make is made here, in Southend on Sea.
They are a great success because of the value for money, reliability and service second to none. So much so that they have now taken on 17 more staff to manufacture turntables and cartridges on the night shift.
Again another reason I mentioned Rega. I've probably got one of the most pimped 1210's around but its cost money to get it. Rega is proper budget value for money. I'd be quite happy to have one in a 3rd system.
I'd love to join you with the beer, preferably Old Speckled Hen please. I feel like getting so pissed right now.
May i humbly recommend Tiger Bitter http://shop.everards.co.uk/collections/tiger this is a proper glugger. Myself and several friends have snaffled many pints of this and after a couple it becomes easier and easier to sink. A true session ale.
I did make a faux pas. The store does have a Rega RP1 in stock. Although he wasn't impressed saying it was "shamed older Planar 2".
Not that it's really relevant to this though, but clears up why he wasn't selling it to me. Then again the Project is more expensive maybe that may be his bias.
Me thinks he was trying to get more wonga from you:scratch:
Beobloke
18-05-2012, 18:09
I'd love to join you with the beer, preferably Old Speckled Hen please. I feel like getting so pissed right now.
Funnily enough I got dragged to the pub on the way home and put myself outside a pint of Old Speckled Hen. Now I'm home and just about to crack open my second Sam Adams.
Sorry, what was the question again?
:drinking:
Spectral Morn
18-05-2012, 18:10
I'd love a Pound for every time I've heard that over the past 38 years from dealers who can't stock Rega. What sane dealer would turn away Rega ? It doesn't happen but there are plenty of dealers who can't get the Rega agency for one reason or the other.
If you want a £200 ish one stop, no mess turntable, there isn't anything to equal a Rega RP1. IMO
Might be Dave, because at one time (maybe still the case) that Rega required a new dealer to take a demo item of everything they make. Now that is the ideal but most dealers want to, or have to (costs a great deal to buy in a whole range) at least cherry pick the best items from a brand/range and leave the ones that don't fit their profile best out of an initial purchase.
I think Project make great decks and I agree with Adam the Genie is a fantastic wee deck.
The Technics is also a great item but it requires additional money to be spent on it to get the best from it and the days of getting one cheap are long over.
hifi_dave
18-05-2012, 18:59
Might be Dave, because at one time (maybe still the case) that Rega required a new dealer to take a demo item of everything they make. Now that is the ideal but most dealers want to, or have to (costs a great deal to buy in a whole range) at least cherry pick the best items from a brand/range and leave the ones that don't fit their profile best out of an initial purchase.
As with most companies, Rega want a dealer to stock a 'representative range' because they don't want a customer turning up to find that they have only one turntable on demo when they are looking for an amp or CD player. Or whatever.
They are quite flexible and understanding, never forcing a dealer to take tons of stock. However, they are picky about the dealers they take on. Hence the number of dealers who claim that they don't want to stock Rega, when the truth is that Rega will not work with them for whatever reason.
It has been this way since 1973.
Might be Dave, because at one time (maybe still the case) that Rega required a new dealer to take a demo item of everything they make. Now that is the ideal but most dealers want to, or have to (costs a great deal to buy in a whole range) at least cherry pick the best items from a brand/range and leave the ones that don't fit their profile best out of an initial purchase.
I think Project make great decks and I agree with Adam the Genie is a fantastic wee deck.
The Technics is also a great item but it requires additional money to be spent on it to get the best from it and the days of getting one cheap are long over.
The genie does look pretty fantastic. What is the reasoning behind it being smaller? I am new to the record deck's therefore I am airing on the side of caution. This is also for someone else hehe... Who is in a similar position and may just wonder where the rest of it is.
I'm surprised if they had the Rega in why they would push me to Project unless it is for the Wonga.
My previous message about what he said didn't make for very easy reading. He said the "RP1 was shamed older Planar 2".
The Technics is off the cards they seem to be taking a lot of work/hassle which I know would be worth it but as Dalek said they are not so cheap as when you purchased yours. :rolleyes:
hifi_dave
18-05-2012, 19:22
Probably meant 'the RP1 shamed the older RP2' which was a more expensive deck and the RP1 is better. I believe that is mentioned in a couple of rave reviews.
If the dealer is not a Rega dealer, the RP1 might be there to 'justify' wild statements. I've seen it all over the years.
As I said, the RP1 is unbeatable if you are looking for a new, no fuss turntable package. IMO but hey ho, it's your money.
Margins are about the same I think, but if they have an RP1, are they actually Rega dealers, 'cos if they really were, there'd be other things as well? I don't think the RP1 is available to non Rega dealers as a new stock item as the P1 might have been.
Adam, Pro-jects are fine, but as you know, Rega don't volunteer product for review, or didn't a few years ago, so that may account for why you haven't had the pleasure of a long term review one :) I wouldn't bother with the "upgrade" kit either apart from possibly the belt.....
In fairness to the techie, I'm not going to have that one slagged off either, as I know a stock one will perform with a decent cartridge, as K Kessler found long before the hoo-ha really started on it. It's not made now, I don't know how many new boxed ones exist now and for how long spares will be supported though.
If the dealer is not a Rega dealer, the RP1 might be there to 'justify' wild statements. I've seen it all over the years.
Aye aye. Well I checked the rega site and he's not listed. Do you think I should just say I thought about it and after all your advice I would like to purchase the rega?
I'm looking forward to for someone to enlighten me on the genie.
hifidave it's not that I don't believe you, it's just that I don't like you. :ner: hehe I just want to make the right decision and I am very grateful of your replies.
I'm feeling the rega is looking likely to be the one then. I do really like the look of the project in red.
hifi_dave
18-05-2012, 19:55
Maybe I'm labouring the point but I've been selling Rega turntables since 1973 and in all these years I've never found any deck at anywhere near the price which is competition.
Not only that but they are totally reliable and right from the very first model in 1973, they can all be serviced or repaired at minimal cost. How many other turntables can that be said of ?
Maybe I'm labouring the point but I've been selling Rega turntables since 1973 and in all these years I've never found any deck at anywhere near the price which is competition.
Not only that but they are totally reliable and right from the very first model in 1973, they can all be serviced or repaired at minimal cost. How many other turntables can that be said of ?
I understand Dave. It looks as though I'll be going for that as most people seem to be saying that is the logical choice. Without discounting project's array of colours offered haha...
Thanks for your help. ;)
Anyone want to debate the colour of which one to get? :eek:
I like the yellow ones...........
I'm feeling the rega is looking likely to be the one then. I do really like the look of the project in red.
And yet it's not for you? Why can't your friend choose?
Do they do the Rega in St.Georges flag livery?, a unique selling point of my Pro-ject, patriotic but oh so frail
http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss68/Lodger56/P1020005.jpg
I like the yellow ones...........
>.< haha I am going for the rega after my arm was twisted to see the light!
Webby it is a present therefore that is why I am trying to make the right choice. Or you are for me... :) I think the red would have appealed but I think the rega is the choice of deck.
Roy I or the person receiving is not jingoistic by nature so that I am afraid wouldn't be an option. :eek:
Am I missing something - can this dealer not let you listen to the Rega vs. the Pro-Ject, and then you buy the one that you prefer the sound of? ;)
Am I missing something - can this dealer not let you listen to the Rega vs. the Pro-Ject, and then you buy the one that you prefer the sound of? ;)
It took me till page 5 to realise this. :eek:
I'm not giving up on the Techie ;)
The Technics SL 1200/1210's sound great in standard form. Yes they can be modified to sound really, really special but this is an option, not a necessity. As well as excellent sonic performance, the Technics also offers unrivalled ergonomics. Most of the controls are micro switched so we're talking instant start/stop and push button speed change from 33 1/3rd to 45 rpm. On the fly VTA adjustment on the standard arm (believe me this is worth its weight in gold), interchangeable headshells (buy a spare headshell to make cartridge comparisons a breeze) backed up by rock solid build quality and all the back up and advice you could ever need via AoS. What's not to like? :)
Incidentally Karl, I moved from this:
http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af316/Sgtgrash/Hifi%20Stuff/AoSComp1-1.jpg
To this:
http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af316/Sgtgrash/Hifi%20Stuff/IMAG0074.jpg
Sure, the Thorens looks lovely but the Techie wee's all over it for sound reproduction... :cool:
Stratmangler
18-05-2012, 23:21
http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af316/Sgtgrash/Hifi%20Stuff/IMAG0074.jpg
AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!
Get those godawful technics feet replaced - they're dreadful, and hold back the sound of the deck quite a bit :doh::doh::doh::doh:
It has VA feet now Chris, I just haven't gotten around to taking more recent piccies :ner:
Stratmangler
19-05-2012, 00:09
It has VA feet now Chris, I just haven't gotten around to taking more recent piccies :ner:
At least we're in agreement over the feet :eyebrows:
The intended next step was to be an external PS but the deal I had with another member has fallen through and besides, cash is so tight just now I really can't justify spending any more money on the system. Still, the Amptastic Mini T I acquired recently is a step up from the Hafler (whodathunkit?) so I'm happy for the moment... :)
Beobloke
20-05-2012, 09:29
Adam, Pro-jects are fine, but as you know, Rega don't volunteer product for review, or didn't a few years ago, so that may account for why you haven't had the pleasure of a long term review one :) I wouldn't bother with the "upgrade" kit either apart from possibly the belt.....
Not sure where you got that idea from. I have reviewed the P3-24 and the RP3 in the last couple of years, simply by ringing up and asking for them.
As an aside, I felt that the P3-24 was finally the wonderful deck that everyone else seemed to think the P3 had been for years, and the RP3 was even better, although I consider the TTPSU to be mandatory for top performance - the bass is definitely a bit wayward without it.
As mentioned, I can offer no comment on the RP1 as I've not heard one (I know this is an unusual stance to take on an internet forum, but hey...;)), but I have heard a Debut III and a Genie, and thought the Genie was surprisingly capable.
Stratmangler
20-05-2012, 09:32
The intended next step was to be an external PS but the deal I had with another member has fallen through and besides, cash is so tight just now I really can't justify spending any more money on the system. Still, the Amptastic Mini T I acquired recently is a step up from the Hafler (whodathunkit?) so I'm happy for the moment... :)
Have you tried removing the PSU from under the platter and rehousing it in an external box?
It's very cost effective - it cost me under £20 for parts from Maplin (never the cheapest of places) to do this.
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