View Full Version : NVA 'TFS': 'The Future Statement' lands at Marco Towers...
Figlet108
29-02-2012, 23:29
...
I haven't quite sorted the usability side out. What I'd like to be able to do is to sit with a tablet in my hand and control the set from there. There are quite a few ways to skin that cat but I just haven't settled on one yet.
Terry, what tablet options have you tried with the TFS booted into Linux?
With Win7/JRiver I've recently adopted JRemote (http://www.jremote.net/) to use with iPhone/iPad. It's become my remote of choice...
Figlet108
29-02-2012, 23:36
Indeed :)
Btw, now that I've got the TFS head unit and PSU suitably spaced apart (rather than just sitting on top of each other, as we first had it), I'm going to have to reassess how good the in-built DAC actually is, which is much better than I'd first thought - and that's just with 'ordinary' music rips! :eek:
Marco.
Do you still have the TFS plugged into your filter?
If so that's another difference. We didn't have it plugged into the filter when we first listened to the TFS DAC.
Yup - that's another difference... It's still plugged into the filter.
Rather good that filter, isn't it? :)
Perhaps you can appreciate what I've been describing about the removal of distortion caused by 'digital switching noise'? ;)
Marco.
Figlet108
29-02-2012, 23:43
Ooo...get you with your fancy new automated features...!
;-)
Ben, if you feel brave I can talk you through updating the sound driver - it's pretty easy actually.
docfoster
29-02-2012, 23:48
Ben, if you feel brave I can talk you through updating the sound driver - it's pretty easy actually.
Thanks.
I'm game.
Aye, that's what your namesake 'Dover' said! :eyebrows:
;)
Marco.
To my mind the great thing about file based audio and servers such as this, assuming the reported performance is accurate, is the cost v performance ratio.
I've seen thousands of pounds chucked at vinyl replay and later heard it demolished by a few hundred pounds worth of computer bits. This for me anyway is one of the great things about file based audio you can achieve stunning sound at a fraction of the cost of a top performing record player and this puts high quality audio within reach of a great many people who just couldn't afford the equivalent sounding record setup.
It really doesn't matter whether vinyl or file gives ultimately the best replay, what matters is a greater number of people can have access to excellent sound quality at an affordable price.
Nicely put, John. I completely echo those sentiments.
However, out of interest, let's put my own situation into perspective, as a comparison: to date, the Techy (including the price I originally paid for it, brand new) has cost me around £5.5k, and sonically, it's currently roughly 3% ahead of the TFS/Sony DAC, which as a combo costs just under £5k. For reference, the Sony DAC, in total, with all the mods, has cost me £3k. The X-777ES CDP, including mods, has cost me £1.5k.
I'd say that the TFS/Sony combo was roughly 5% sonically superior to the X-777ES/DAS-R1 combo, which I guess is how close a top CD player (transport) gets to producing a 'bit-perfect' music signal.
So what does that tell us, in terms of what you're referring to? I'm not quite sure... Certainly, as far as I'm concerned, one thing is definite: it takes a certain level of quality for me to be entirely satisfied with digital music replay.
I had arrived at that happy situation before the TFS came along, but since its arrival, at the level my system is at, the extra 5% performance jump it has given over my CDP, has had a very significant impact on the pleasure I derive from listening to my favourite digitally recorded music.
What price can you put on that? :)
Marco.
P.S Some feedback on the results of listening to HR recordings, using the in-built DAC of the TFS, and also my conclusive thoughts on how the DAC inside the TFS compares to the Sony, will be coming later!
Oh, and as an aside, I'm currently listening to a vinyl recording of Stevie Ray Vaughan's 'Texas Flood', which Snapper did for me a while ago, taken from his LP12 and transferred to CD, which I've since ripped to the TFS - and it sounds f*cking STUNNING!! :eek: :wow:
Now *that* puts and interesting spin on things... Ripping your vinyl to the TFS and streaming it directly from there. This does sound markedly superior than most CDs (taken from a digital music source) do when subjected to the same treatment.
Thoughts, anyone?
Mmm... I must start doing this with my own T/T! :exactly:
Marco.
Stratmangler
01-03-2012, 13:28
Oh, and as an aside, I'm currently listening to a vinyl recording of Stevie Ray Vaughan's 'Texas Flood', which Snapper did for me a while ago, taken from his LP12 and transferred to CD, which I've since ripped to the TFS - and it sounds f*cking STUNNING!! :eek: :wow:
Now *that* puts and interesting spin on things... Ripping your vinyl to the TFS and streaming it directly from there. This does sound markedly superior than most CDs (taken from a digital music source) do when subjected to the same treatment.
Thoughts, anyone?
Mmm... I must start doing this with my own T/T! :exactly:
Marco.
Done quite a few myself, and I really like the results I'm getting :)
Rare Bird
01-03-2012, 13:42
Oh, and as an aside, I'm currently listening to a vinyl recording of Stevie Ray Vaughan's 'Texas Flood', which Snapper did for me a while ago, taken from his LP12 and transferred to CD, which I've since ripped to the TFS - and it sounds f*cking STUNNING!! :eek: :wow:
Now *that* puts and interesting spin on things... Ripping your vinyl to the TFS and streaming it directly from there. This does sound markedly superior than most CDs (taken from a digital music source) do when subjected to the same treatment.
Thoughts, anyone?
Mmm... I must start doing this with my own T/T! :exactly:
Marco.
:lolsign:
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=4543
bobbasrah
01-03-2012, 13:55
And note your observations on that concept in the “Which would you keep” thread..... http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?p=298845#post298845
At the end of the day, there are a myriad of choices available.....
:lolsign:
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=4543
Lol, dude... It certainly seems to be demonstrating something about the quality of very good original digital recordings vs. very good original analogue ones.... ;)
Enlightening stuff!
Marco.
I've yet to hear a vinyl rip that out performs the same master in digital format.
Rare Bird
01-03-2012, 14:25
Nothing to do with outperforming.
Perhaps not, John - but it certainly seems to be knocking spots of the recordings on most of my CDs! And what about if the original master was analogue, like in my experience the finest sounding recordings often are, such as the 1950s jazz ones, on the likes of Columbia or Capitol?
Snapper's vinyl rips are unquestionaly sonically superior, so far, to the rips I've made from my CDs - and by a notable margin... Not bad for an old fruitbox, I guess :eyebrows:
Marco.
Slippershod
01-03-2012, 14:27
Now *that* puts and interesting spin on things... Ripping your vinyl to the TFS and streaming it directly from there. This does sound markedly superior than most CDs (taken from a digital music source) do when subjected to the same treatment.
for sure, it does, given a good pressing etc,etc, of course.
I was doing this until recently at 24/96 (at least) but... and here's the rub, it can become an awful time-sink..., particularly if you get into using vinyl 'restoration' software (and the current progs, as discussed on here courtesy of Alex, are very cheap and amazingly good).
in the end it can become a bit self-defeating, I think.
Rare Bird
01-03-2012, 14:28
Snapper's vinyl rips are unquestionaly sonically superior - and by a notable margin...
O yes
for sure, it does, given a good pressing etc,etc, of course.
I was doing this until recently at 24/96 (at least) but... and here's the rub, it can become an awful time-sink..., particularly if you get into using vinyl 'restoration' software (and the current progs, as discussed on here courtesy of Alex, are very cheap and amazingly good).
in the end it can become a bit self-defeating, I think.
That's a very good (and valid) point, Marc. However, being semi-retired and working from home, time is not generally something I'm too short of ;)
Marco.
Anyway Marco, stop pissing about with the gadgets and get on with making the comparison between the on-board sound card and your Dac! :D
Aff, forgot, he's prolly got Hi Def porn running in the Blue Ray and 24 bit orgasms going.:lol:
Ali Tait
01-03-2012, 14:48
In 3D!
Lol - aye! Have you got a spy hole drilled into the wall in my room? :eek:
Marco.
Aff, forgot, he's prolly got Hi Def porn running in the Blue Ray and 24 bit orgasms going.:lol:
:lolsign:
Who'd have thunk dat de TFS would've had a salacious influence! :eyebrows:
Off now to rip some choons, then waffle more pish here later...
Marco.
Ali Tait
01-03-2012, 15:09
Aye well, we're used to that. :lol:
The Black Adder
01-03-2012, 16:43
Looks like a right beast. Bet it sounds great too.
Mad design but mad is good... :)
Hang on, I need to sit down, did Marco just say . . .
Off now to rip some choons ;)
Glad to see you enjoying these new fangled streaming devices Marco and have caught up with the rest of us at last :lol:, just need to change your avatar to complete metomophosis :D
terrybooth
01-03-2012, 17:42
Terry, what tablet options have you tried with the TFS booted into Linux?
With Win7/JRiver I've recently adopted JRemote (http://www.jremote.net/) to use with iPhone/iPad. It's become my remote of choice...
I'm experimenting with Banshee and Banshee remote (Android). I did have it working but when I tried to set it up again last night, I couldn't get the catalogue side to work.
Now that I've recovered from the tiring upheaval (but fun) of the Scalford show, I'll be adding some more thoughts about the TFS, as my ears have become fully attuned to its music-making abilities - including what happened when I returned to using my Sony CDP, in place of the TFS, in order to conclude its appraisal...
In that respect, swapping back to one's previous reference, in these situations, is always rather enlightening - and this time it was no different! :cool:
Marco.
So you are keeping the Sony then, despite my generous offer? :;
Lol... Yes, but the TFS isn't going anywhere yet either :)
Marco.
Okay - I will wait with baited breath.
Ali Tait
16-04-2012, 19:54
MARCO! C'mon dude, whaddaya think of it then??
It's complicated! :D
Marco.
Ali Tait
16-04-2012, 19:56
Complicated? It sounds good or it sounds bad. What's complicated? :lol:
Oh it most certainly doesn't sound bad, as I've already outlined - far from it.
However, on revisiting my usual benchmark (the modded Sony CDP, as my DAC was in the equation with both), after a period of 'acclimatising' myself to the sound of the TFS, it became clear that, as good as it is, it still needs a little more work done on it to fully compete with the former, which proves just how cruical that switch back is to a known reference, during any equipment assessment process......
When I get a chance, I'll write up my full findings :)
Marco.
Ali Tait
16-04-2012, 20:05
Okeydokey.
Ian Walker
07-06-2012, 18:09
Jason and Marco paid me a visit yesterday and brought with them the TFS.
This is the same one Marco has had at home now for some time now so its well run in.
My present steamer is a PS3/Rega dac,which i feel is pretty good now since adding the dac but still not quite were i want to be.
The sound still not having the weight and scale i know my system is capable of.
The TFS addresses this issue bringing these attributes to the party big time.
Along with this though the TFS has far more refinement, detail,instrument separation and attack to notes making the system sound miles more dynamic and hear through.
All sorts of music was played during a four hour session,the TFS/system sounding great with everything we played.
We were all particulary impressed with the sheer stop start speed of the bass now coming from the Tannoys,Jason having a large satisfied ear to ear grin on his face!.
Ive had a number of streamers here in the past including a linn Akurate ds and i'm pretty sure that this machine is up there with that.
Its far better than the PS3 combo i use and any of the squeezebox things ive heard.
I had set my mind on a Linn Akurate but after hearing this(its less than half the price) i'm having to think again.
Ian.
Figlet108
07-06-2012, 21:31
Hey Ian, it was a great listening session - really enjoyed it.
Your system sounded truly awesome (even without the TFS in the chain :) )
I loved the sound of your Tannoys - they owned the room.
This evening my wife and I have been listening to Marco's very fine music collection that he kindly left on the TFS. And in particular love the Sunhouse CD you ripped when we were together - very fine indeed.
Many thanks for your hospitality.
Ali Tait
07-06-2012, 21:40
Hi Jason, any ETA on the streamer?
Reid Malenfant
07-06-2012, 21:40
When I get a chance, I'll write up my full findings :)
Marco.
So is that before or after you get it back :lol:
Marco, it looks like you have a good few people waiting for some kind of finale, I wish you luck fella, all the best :)
Perhaps a change is as good as a rest, I'm assuming you'll get it back & then I guess your second session might get the memory cells going again & you can reach some kind of conclusion :cool:
Just doing Alis' job for him :D
Ali Tait
07-06-2012, 21:42
:lol: Cheers mate!
Lol, guys....
The TFS sounded superb in Ian's system, and as he rightly says, totally outclassed his PS3, as I'd have expected.
There's nothing wrong with the PS3, in terms of its overall functionality and ability to stream music. It is, quite frankly, amazing for the money, especially when used in conjunction with Ian's rather good Rega DAC. However, the PS3 is undoubtedly hobbled by its cheap switch-mode power supply, which is where the TFS, with its high-quality linear PSU, comes into its own.
The music we were listening to with the TFS, in Ian's system, all of which I own on CD and am very familiar with, sounded superb, and I think exceeded Ian's expectations of what the TFS was sonically capable of.
It may not be (in its current guise) quite up to the sonic standard of my highly-modified Sony CDP and DAC, which one must bear in mind cost nearly £4k, and so represents a different price level, from the TFS, but I stand by every word I've written before, in that for the price, the TFS is undoubtedly the best music streamer I've heard - and from memory, at least as good as the (much more expensive) Linn Akurate DS, which Ian and I both heard in his system!
Ian doesn't normally write hi-fi appraisals, so for him to be suitably motivated to put 'pen to paper', as it were, and praise the TFS, as he did, is testament to its undoubted sonic abilities, and how much he was impressed when he heard the unit last night in his system.
If any of you have questions on specific aspects of the audio performance of the TFS, or how I rate it in the grand scheme of things, then please just ask. I think it's best to handle things that way, than for me to go on further, perhaps missing areas that you wished to go into in more detail :)
Jason, it was a pleasure meeting you again last night, as always. All the best for the future, matey! :cool:
Marco.
The Grand Wazoo
07-06-2012, 22:38
This evening my wife and I have been listening to Marco's very fine music collection that he kindly left on the TFS. And in particular love the Sunhouse CD you ripped when we were together - very fine indeed.
Aha! Just as I thought - this whole dastardly tale has just been a ruse for you to travel round the country, harvesting free music. And you would've got away with it, if it hadn't been for those pesky......
Figlet108
07-06-2012, 23:22
Aha! Just as I thought - this whole dastardly tale has just been a ruse for you to travel round the country, harvesting free music. And you would've got away with it, if it hadn't been for those pesky......
Actually you wouldn't believe how much music gets aquired from shows and demos.
Unfortunately my strict code of ethics and chivalry dictate that I must delete all music I haven't paid for (as soon as I make a list of the good stuff I need to buy or spotify)
It's a nice bonus, matey! Glad you liked my choons :)
It must've been satisfying hearing the TFS sound so good at Ian's, in another top system. It's hard to beat the sheer effortlessness of big Tannoys, driven by a valve amp, with near unlimited headroom, isn't it? :D
Marco.
Figlet108
08-06-2012, 10:02
It's a nice bonus, matey! Glad you liked my choons :)
It must've been satisfying hearing the TFS sound so good at Ian's, in another top system. It's hard to beat the sheer effortlessness of big Tannoys, driven by a valve amp, with near unlimited headroom, isn't it? :D
Marco.
It's always very interesting for me to hear the TFS in different systems and rooms, especially very well put together systems like yours and Ian's that will reveal all strengths and weaknesses.
Obviously the TFS was tuned using my system and in my room so hearing it sound so good in Ian's system on Wednesday was very satisfying. In particular the balance of weighty bass, sweet mid and crisp and revealing treble is exactly what I was aiming for and what I get at home.
In fact I had to rush home and check that the TFS sounded as good in my system as it did in Ian's - (you'll be relieved to know that it did :) )
Ali Tait
08-06-2012, 12:18
Hi Jason, any ETA on the streamer?
:)
Figlet108
08-06-2012, 13:27
Hi Ali,
sorry I didn't reply before.
I'm still looking for the right motherboard to use to base the new design on. It needs to be powerful enough, passively cooled, have the right ports and most of all sound good.
I also need to get my test rig set up which means finding and buying as reference a DAC as I can afford.
I like the Antelope Zodiac Gold, but I've taken my eye off the DAC market for a while and need to get back into it and see what else competes at the high end.
So the short answer is no, no ETA right now - sorry.
Ali Tait
08-06-2012, 14:03
Ok thanks Jason.
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