Cartridge for SL1210 with stock arm

[Elephantears]

I've recently got a 1210 Mk3D for use in my office system. I'm using it into the MM phono card of an old Onix 21S (I have an MC card if necessary later), into some little Linn M109's. I'm not thinking of spending much on it just yet but I need a reasonable cart and headshell. I want it to cope well with surface noise on old classical records, but otherwise I'll play a lot of 60's jazz.

The question is which cart to start off with, using the standard arm?

My current short list is, in order of cost;

1) Try it out with the dj cart that came with the deck; an Ortofon Concorde with Elektra stylus. However I'd prefer to sell this unused.

2) AT 95E until I see how much I'm using the system, or preferably an AT95HE, since from previous experience I know a stock 95E is useless with classical records. Or an AT120E? Don't know how this would compare to a 95HE.

3) Something a bit better like a Dennon DL110, Grado Prestige Gold, or Ortofon 2M Blue.

4) Splash out a bit. Wait until my friend goes to Japan and ask him to get me a DV 10 x 5. But is the standard arm up to this?

Any general thoughts on where to go with a 1210 would be much appreciated. I know from old threads that new feet are a common first upgrade. What about clamps, fancy mats etc?

[Tarzan]

I use a Nagaoka MP110 on me stock Techie, sounds great and very quiet regarding surface noise.

[jostber]

I would go for the Ortofon 2M Blue. It's better than the Concorde, and plays very nicely.

[Elephantears]

I would go for the Ortofon 2M Blue. It's better than the Concorde, and plays very nicely.

I think that was on offer over Christmas, getting my interest, but its now about £150. That's climbing up towards second hand or bought from Japan DV 10 x 5, so I'm less keen now. A shame since I did fancy it.

I notice you have a very fancy headshell. Does this make a difference?

[jostber]

You can get replacement styluses for the Ortofon 2Ms so that might be good value in the long run. I use the stock arm so the Oyaide carbon headshell together with a Herbie dampener handles unwanted resonance better than the original setup.

[Elephantears]

Should I have put this thread in the analogue art section? Sorry I didn't realise there were lots of threads about the SL1210 already there. Mods, is it possible to move it?

I'm currently considering a moving iron cart - I've been offered a Grado Ref Platinum MI, which sounds very interesting.

[DSJR]

Cheaper grado's are very dull these days, but I think the wooden body ones are slightly livelier.

I find records need a bit of livening up (my take on vinyl) so in your shoes I'd look at an AT120E or better, a 440MLa to start with. This would almost certainly send the likes of Marco screaming out of the door :D, so a compromise could well be a Stanton 681EEE (still affordable) or one of the Ortofons (the 500 based Vinyl Master series is still current and cheaper than the 2M's) at around £100. The Denon DL110 is a popular recommendation, but I found it rather bland compared to the better MM types..

For pristine tracking and record safety, you could do a lot worse than a Shure M97XE for £70 or so.....

[Macca]

A fancy headshell is definately a worthwhile upgrade IMO

[Elephantears]

I find records need a bit of livening up (my take on vinyl) so in your shoes I'd look at an AT120E or better, a 440MLa to start with.

Really? I've always found the opposite. With just about all genres of music, but very much with the 60's jazz I love. Moving from a Coltrane cd to vinyl is like stepping into a sweaty room where you can hardly see for the extreme energy. Similarly with most of the rock music I listen to.

Mind you, I have always used AT carts! Perhaps the Grado would seem like a mellow cigar to me. Might be more appropriate for the office though. (I have an AT33EV in my main system on an LP12 - this is certainly lively)

[DSJR]

The OM20 stylus costs around a ton these days, maybe less, and will transform your Concorde into something sweet yet lively without emphasising surface noise. This should be excellent value for you until you decide where to take the deck - feet, mat, platter/bearing, external supply etc... The OM20 will reproduce all these differences and give you a solid reference for later on.

[Elephantears]

That's an interesting suggestion Dave. I had no idea you could use the Concorde for higher purposes, as it were. The temptation to just stick the Concorde on with the DJ stylus for a taste is growing anyway.

The question is whether this hybrid Concorde/OM20 is going to be as god as an AT95HE or AT120 for the same price or less.

I've also had a Goldnote Babele suggested for £85. I've been very impressed by Blacknote's digital sources, and although its a big leap to assume they can therefore make a decent cart, I do think they have their sonic priorities right.

Finally, its tempting to spend the extra on a Grado Ref Platinum MI, which might be all I'd want for a while.

Dave, you have heard the OM20 in a hybrid form with a DJ cart? It certainly has a nice plug and play appeal.

[freefallrob]

In my personal experience the AT120e/t works very well in the standard arm, it works nicely with the standard 5mm rubber mat too, nice and open, big soundstage, tracks very well.

The 2M Blue (don't bother with the RED, it's not good enough!) though more dynamic and solid on the bass but does sit as well in standard arm and sounds a bit 'uptight' if you get my drift.

The Grado Prestige Gold is a bugger to set up, and always seem to have tracking issues of one sort or another, it's a bit annoying....however it's great with jazz and has good midrange, the Black is less finicky but not as open sounding, solid core tonearm leads work well with these...

The Goldring 1012GX sounds dull in the technics arm, don't know why, just wasn't interesting.

The Goldring 2200 was good, plenty of pep, tracked well, tight bass and clear midrange, if a bit rough at the top.

AT95e, was okay and enjoyable, fun, bass wasn't that defined, detail lacking,
but you wouldn't miss it if you didn't know it was there, covers it's tracks well!

At110e, better than 95e, smoother, better top end, but still coloured, warm ish lower mid.

There are more I've tried but my minds gone blank now!:doh:

Rob.

[Elephantears]

Great, thanks Rob, that's a very helpful set of comparisons. I'm glad you've mentioned the set-up and tracking problems with the Grado Prestige Gold, because that was very appealing. A real shame though if its so good with jazz.

I do wonder if the Grado Platinum Ref might also be tricky to set up. Adrian at Audiflair has offered to do it for me but he's a bit far away.

AT 120E starting to look tempting. That and the Dennon DL110 seem to be the most commonly recommended safe bets for a budget cart with the 1210.

[Darren]

I have a Grado Reference Platinum and I assure you it's one of the easiest cartridges to fit and set up that I've ever had. Sounds good and has surprisingly low surface noise as well.

[Elephantears]

I have a Grado Reference Platinum and I assure you it's one of the easiest cartridges to fit and set up that I've ever had. Sounds good and has surprisingly low surface noise as well.

That's good to hear. My only reservations are whether its going to be compatible with an SL1210 - I've read one or two negative reports, but some good ones too. But I'm going to go for it anyway.

[freefallrob]

ANdrew (Elephantears) PM returned!

[jostber]

If you have elephant ears that should also boost the audiophile experience. :)

http://covers.allbookstores.net/c/1243961408/book/full/9780794412302

[Elephantears]

Yeah, they used me for all these book illustrations and stuff when I was a child, and then all these film extra jobs. I just got sick of it: leave my ears alone! It was a relief when I became an audiophile since I started to meet lots of other people with bizarre faces that made strange grunts.

We have very civilised burial practices you know. And we like jazz.

[gx502]

That's an interesting suggestion Dave. I had no idea you could use the Concorde for higher purposes, as it were. The temptation to just stick the Concorde on with the DJ stylus for a taste is growing anyway.


FWIW, I was using a Ortofon Concorde with a OM40 stylus, before I upgraded my arm to a Jelco SA-750D.

This combination worked very well indeed in combination with the KABUSA arm damper, which I feel is really mandatory if you wish to stay with the stock arm.

There is a review of this cart/stylus combo on positive feedback:

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue17/kaborotfon.htm

Getting the Concorde with the 20 is probably a good idea, since it gives a upgrade path via stylus upgrades. But on the other hand: perhaps not if you are the type of person who likes to chop and change (or you later expect to change the arm).

I also give a +1 to the recommendation of the Nagaoka MP110 as an affordable cart to use on the stock arm.

[Elephantears]

I've decided on the Grado Platinum Ref, but I'm also going to run a second cart for first plays of junk store finds and for playing old dance 12"'s. This was going to be an AT95E, but I could alternatively keep the Concorde and put on an OM10.