Preamplifier for Croft Series 5 Power Amplifier.

[southall-1998]

Have just bought an MK1 Croft Series 5 Power Amplifier. (Thanks Matt)

Next, I need a Preamplifier that will work nicely with the Croft series 5. I also want the Preamplifier to have a very good built in (MM) phono stage. (I have an old Shure M3D waiting to be used)

Not sure on the budget? Some recommendations will be good for now.

This is my first time with Croft. I have a huge lack of knowledge with Croft gear.

Regards.

[jon1]

Have just bought an MK1 Croft Series 5 Power Amplifier. (Thanks Matt)

Next, I need a Preamplifier that will work nicely with the Croft series 5. I also want the Preamplifier to have a very good built in (MM) phono stage. (I have an old Shure M3D waiting to be used)

Not sure on the budget? Some recommendations will be good for now.

This is my first time with Croft. I have a huge lack of knowledge with Croft gear.

Regards.






Well Shane you might as well have a matching pair..micro25 pre;)




jon

[hifi_dave]

I don't think there is any viable alternative to a Croft pre-amp from £400..:scratch:

[DSJR]

You ARE going to keep this for a good while aren't you Shane? These products are far too good for two month dems and then sell on 'cos you're bored ;)

[southall-1998]

You ARE going to keep this for a good while aren't you Shane? These products are far too good for two month dems and then sell on 'cos you're bored ;)


YES & YES:)

[jon1]

YES & YES:)






Nice to hear:D


jon

[bluenose24]

Having heard jons setup Shane you can't fall off with Glenn croft pre n power hope to be getting them myself in the coming months oh yers!

Cheers

Nev

[southall-1998]

Sound good, Nev.

[southall-1998]

What speakers did Glen use when he built the Series 5 amps?

[bluenose24]

Sound good, Nev.

Definitely mate! Will have to let me no how u find it :cool: can't go wrong with some mark grant inters also mate :eyebrows: what speakers u got ATM?



Cheers

Nev

[southall-1998]

Definitely mate! Will have to let me no how u find it :cool: can't go wrong with some mark grant inters also mate :eyebrows: what speakers u got ATM?



Cheers

Nev

11 ohm Rogers LS3/5a.

[worrasf]

I echo all the comment regarding the 25 /25R I have a 25 R and Series 4s myself and the combination sounds superb. You might also consider getting a GC preamp of the same vintage as the power amp in which case the Vitale or Vital would be excellent choices. I had a Vitale for a while and although there is no doubt the 25R is "better" you could argue it's not £1000 better (because the Vitale is so good). The mm phono stage in the Vitale is brilliant every bit as good as the 25(R) IMHO. Aesthetics are a little "challenged" in that it looks like the case was built from discarded ammunition boxes but it partners the S5 well I think. Just a thought as they come up on eBay every now and again for not a lot of dollar.

Steve

[hifi_dave]

What speakers did Glen use when he built the Series 5 amps?

Harbeth and stacked Quad ESL57 I believe.

[Marco]

Yup, and the original design was likely also listened to extensively at Matt's place, with his modded Spendor SP1s :)

I think the Croft Series 5 will work very indeed with Shane's Rogers LS3/5as. Good luck with what you go for, preamp-wise, Shane. The suggestions here so far have been very good.

Marco.

[southall-1998]

Yes, suggestions have been second to none here.

Regards.

[Elephantears]

I love the Series 5 with Micro 25, and even more with 25R. With 25RS the level of tonal colour is just stunning, as I've said many times. But the lower models are just great too.

[jon1]

I love the Series 5 with Micro 25, and even more with 25R. With 25RS the level of tonal colour is just stunning, as I've said many times. But the lower models are just great too.





+1;)



jon

[southall-1998]

Tomorrow I want to quickly try the Croft Series 5 with Magnepan MG.17 speakers.

With the volume on a sensible level, will the Croft cope with the maggies?

Regards.

[hifi_dave]

It copes with stacked Quad ESL57's so it should be OK. Trouble is, the Maggies need plenty of watts and current, not so much to make them play but to control those panels.

[southall-1998]

Thanks, Dave.

S.

[DSJR]

Shane, the only other thing you could do to be totally different, is to ask Anthony TD VERY nicely about his "Grounded Grid" preamp in a simple box like he made for Hamish a year or two ago.....

By the way, wasn't the Vitale preamp a similar model to the 25 Basic internally, which I think is directly descended from it?

[hifi_dave]

Shane has the pre-amp sorted..:thumbsup:

[Marco]

Yes, I've just heard... Nice one, Shane, and welcome to the Croft club! :cool:

Marco.

[DSJR]

T'is good to know and I hope Shane likes it :D

[IHP]

Shane has the pre-amp sorted..:thumbsup:

When's he having it upgraded ? :)

[southall-1998]

Never :)

[IHP]

Never :)

How many times have I said that ! Enjoy it Shane.

[jon1]

Never :)

:eek::D



jon

[southall-1998]

My Croft Micro Basic 25 arrived yesterday. Thanks HiFi Dave & Glen.

I haven't set it up yet, but will later in the week.

And what a light preamp this is! I can carry the thing with one hand. This is a pure Valve preamp, no solid state in it?

Cheers.

[DSJR]

There might be a solid state regulator inside, but no transistors in the audio circuit.

[IHP]

My Croft Micro Basic 25 arrived yesterday. Thanks HiFi Dave & Glen.

I haven't set it up yet, but will later in the week.

And what a light preamp this is! I can carry the thing with one hand. This is a pure Valve preamp, no solid state in it?

Cheers.

Sell your Gran/kids/wife/car/soul/kidney and send it back to GC and 'R' spec. it.

Just an idea ;-)

[southall-1998]

Sell your Gran/kids/wife/car/soul/kidney and send it back to GC and 'R' spec. it.

Just an idea ;-)

Stop being fast:lol:

[jon1]

Sell your Gran/kids/wife/car/soul/kidney and send it back to GC and 'R' spec. it.

Just an idea ;-)





Ian Would trading in your soul count?:D




jon

[Covenant]

I asked Glenn about upgrading my Series 7 power amp. His reply suggested that he could replace it with monoblocks for £700....hmmmmm

[IHP]

I asked Glenn about upgrading my Series 7 power amp. His reply suggested that he could replace it with monoblocks for £700....hmmmmm

Hi Jerry,

Could we just go over that again ? The monos retail at £2800 the pair, the Series 7 £700, and GC can do the mono replacement for £700 with a trade in ?

Obviously not doubting you as such, but the numbers don't add up here ?

[Covenant]

Hi Ian,
Here is the email from the great man himself:

Hi Jerry,
if you want to stick with a stereo amp it can be upgraded to the 7R for £700. An upgrade to a pair of 7 monoblocks would be the same price and an upgrade to the 7R monoblocks would be £2100.
Cheers,
Glenn.
Do you think its a cock up?

[IHP]

Hi Ian,
Here is the email from the great man himself:

Hi Jerry,
if you want to stick with a stereo amp it can be upgraded to the 7R for £700. An upgrade to a pair of 7 monoblocks would be the same price and an upgrade to the 7R monoblocks would be £2100.
Cheers,
Glenn.
Do you think its a cock up?

Aaah, I didn't even know he did 7 monos, thought just the &R monos were available. All makes sense now.

Edit: Choosing between a 7R and a pair of 7 monoblocks would be a tricky call !

[jon1]

Hi Ian,
Here is the email from the great man himself:

Hi Jerry,
if you want to stick with a stereo amp it can be upgraded to the 7R for £700. An upgrade to a pair of 7 monoblocks would be the same price and an upgrade to the 7R monoblocks would be £2100.
Cheers,
Glenn.
Do you think its a cock up?





No jerry it is not a cock up:D he will convert your 7 amp to a monobloc and send another monobloc with your converted 7 amp..simples:D..i got my monoblocs upgraded to the 7r monoblocs

jon

[IHP]

No jerry it is not a cock up:D he will convert your 7 amp to a monobloc and send another monobloc with your converted 7 amp..simples:D..i got my monoblocs upgraded to the 7r monoblocs

jon

You bloody would John, obviously ;-)

[Covenant]

I imagine that the change to monoblocks is only a small improvement, it's the R designation that makes the difference.

[jon1]

I imagine that the change to monoblocks is only a small improvement, it's the R designation that makes the difference.





Yes:eyebrows::)



jon

[jon1]

You bloody would John, obviously ;-)





Well..some one had to do it:D



jon

[The Grand Wazoo]

You'll be surprised at what a difference an increase in power, a dedicated power supply and the total separation of each channel's signal will do. If you're only being charged the price of the new unit it's a bargain as you're getting the work required to convert your existing amp done free of charge.

[bluenose24]

Having heard the monos before the upgrade god only knows what they sound like now:eek:

Nev

[Covenant]

It's brilliant that there is an upgrade path (even if I can't afford it atm:().

[bluenose24]

It's brilliant that there is an upgrade path (even if I can't afford it atm:().

But once you can not like you will regret the relatively low outlay for the return of sound you'll get :)

I can't wait till I've got me pennies together :eyebrows:

Nev

[Covenant]

But once you can not like you will regret the relatively low outlay for the return of sound you'll get :)

I can't wait till I've got me pennies together :eyebrows:

Nev

It will niggle away at me now until I do it! :rolleyes:

[bluenose24]

Every upgrade I've heard in jons setup has blown me away from his micro r to rs and his monos as they were (nudge nudge) glens stuff for what you pay is a bargain!
When you consider what you could pay for the equivelant sound many thousands of pounds, I no where my cash will be going this year that's for sure :)


I've bought a eastern electric minimax dacs and now I have to decide what to buy next absolute nightmare all these things :)


Cheers
Nev

[jon1]

Every upgrade I've heard in john's setup has blown me away from his micro r to rs and his monos as they were (nudge nudge) glens stuff for what you pay is a bargain!
When you consider what you could pay for the equivalent sound many thousands of pounds, I no where my cash will be going this year that's for sure :)


I've bought a eastern electric minimax dac and now I have to decide what to buy next absolute nightmare all these things :)


Cheers
Nev






I have heard that one before:D


jon

[southall-1998]

Guys, sorry for the silly question.

Are the Croft (MK1) Series 5 & new Micro Basic 25 pure valve? No SS stuff inside?

DSJR, did you say the Croft Series 5 MK1 reminded you of the Quad IIs? Or was it all a dream :)

[DSJR]

There is the odd solid state regulator here and there I think (my own preamp has two ss regs in it as well as three valves in the power supply).

I was comparing the Series 5 to Croft-rebuilt Quad II's, which even in the original spec, were rather clearer than the originals, which can sound a touch too cuddly, even for me...

The Series 5 should be lively, quite delicate and with a huge-hearted soundstage. I think my memory isn't failing me here. It was the larger Series 4 that had more of a "trad valvey" kind of quality to it I think.

[southall-1998]

There is the odd solid state regulator here and there I think (my own preamp has two ss regs in it as well as three valves in the power supply).

I was comparing the Series 5 to Croft-rebuilt Quad II's, which even in the original spec, were rather clearer than the originals, which can sound a touch too cuddly, even for me...

The Series 5 should be lively, quite delicate and with a huge-hearted soundstage. I think my memory isn't failing me here. It was the larger Series 4 that had more of a "trad valvey" kind of quality to it I think.

But the Series 5 has no SS stuff inside?

[RobHolt]

The V is excellent. Parallel connected EL84s giving 2x25w and unusually it uses a 6550 as a valve regulator IIRC.

Wish I'd kept mine as it really let rip into Impulse H2s.
I also liked the looks - so many tubes adorning something the size of aQuad II. I think there were 12 tubes in all.

Rob

[DSJR]

But the Series 5 has no SS stuff inside?

Why so fixed on this point Shane?

I could spoil it and tell you that actually, the Series 5 has chip amps inside, like many Linn amps, which are carefully hidden in the transformer cases, and the EL84's are there just for show :lol: :eyebrows:

[southall-1998]

Why so fixed on this point Shane?

I could spoil it and tell you that actually, the Series 5 has chip amps inside, like many Linn amps, which are carefully hidden in the transformer cases, and the EL84's are there just for show :lol: :eyebrows:

Just curious, that's all. And it looks like your not answering my question. I'm very cross:lol:

[southall-1998]

Guys,

Is it OK to remove the metal cage that is covering the valves on my Croft Series 5? Or just leave it on?

Cheers.

[hifi_dave]

Leave it on because it won't sound any different but it will protect the valves and any prying fingers.

[rwacka]

Shane, What are your first impressions of the 25/5 combo?

[southall-1998]

Shane, What are your first impressions of the 25/5 combo?

Will let you know soon.

[southall-1998]

Apart from the Quad ESL 57. Which small speakers were typically used and worked well with the Croft Series 5 MK1?

[DSJR]

Pro-Ac Response 2's (not the ghastly stringy 1sc) were my speaker of choice every time I heard the 5. In fact, many vintage Pro-Acs - Mini Towers and Super Towers, squeaky Tablettes - were popular, but really, as long as it isn't stressed for power output, I'd say any reasonable speaker can be enjoyably used with a Series 5. HiFi Dave sold loads, so should be able to say what he sold them with.....

[southall-1998]

Pro-Ac Response 2's (not the ghastly stringy 1sc) were my speaker of choice every time I heard the 5. In fact, many vintage Pro-Acs - Mini Towers and Super Towers, squeaky Tablettes - were popular, but really, as long as it isn't stressed for power output, I'd say any reasonable speaker can be enjoyably used with a Series 5. HiFi Dave sold loads, so should be able to say what he sold them with.....


Good God DSJR:) Are they monitors with a clinical treble? Anyway, never heard them so I'll shut up.

[hifi_dave]

We sold loads of Croft amps, series V, Series IV and OTL's, mostly with various ProAc's (they were good then), SD Acoustics, JBL's, Heybrook and Epos ES14.

[DSJR]

Shane, the Response 2's were a 8" SEAS? Polyprop main driver and, I think, a Scan tweeter (the damped one as Spendor used) in a 25 - 30L box as I recall. The sound was really good, with no obvious issues or emphasis at any frequency. sadly, the Pro-Ac house sound seemed to deteriorate as time went on, the bass becoming boomy and ill-defined, the mid sucked out and the treble sparkly and exposed, the whole thing giving a very exaggerated soundfield. Don't know what the designer was trying to do, since he's made some classics in his time and with all manner of drive unit combinations...

By the way, I heard my then Epos ES14's with my Croft-rebuilt Quad II's, some croft re-built Leak TL12's (yummy) as well as EAR509's at Daves and my own Tube Technology Genesis mono's and short lived Croft OTL (lovely amp which ate fuses - obviously alergic to Tangerine Dream :)). The ES14's LOVE good valve amps and Naim A5 cable :lol: