View Full Version : hifi emporium
barry-potter
30-11-2011, 21:00
here is my story. there were some speakers i quite fancied trying out that i was alerted to on ebay (alison ones). so i phoned them up to ask more about them. i was told that apart from refoaming one woofer they could be plugged in and work straight away. so i bought them on the strength of this knowledge. from then on it was all downhill. firstly they didn't contact me for a delivery date until i sent them an email. oh they replied, delivery is tomorrow.
so i had to get someone in at short notice because i can't get a day off work just like that. so for £60 delivery i am expecting fully boxed and well transported speakers. what i got was unboxed speakers slung in the back of a trailer (with possible implications). anyway so i come home and eagerly plug them in . er, one speaker has a muffled noise emanating from a woofer and nothing else and the other one blew a monoblock up. probably the reason for this (supposition i know but makes sense to me) is that the speaker had been buffeted to buggery in its' journey causing the inductor to break apart from the gluey mooring and create a short circuit.
am hoping that the other speaker might work because the wire connecting the tweeter had come loose, but i'm not plugging them in to my good amps. will have to try them with a cheapo amp.
southall-1998
30-11-2011, 21:12
Did you buy them from Nick? (Suffolk Branch)
I've bought a few items from Hughie (Kent Branch) Always had decent service from him.
Have you contacted them and given them the opportunity to make good?
Dont you think you should before you plaster it all over the internet?
julesd68
30-11-2011, 21:58
A very similar discussion was had on Wigwam not so long ago ...
I bought a new-old-stock Shure VN15E stylus from them for a good price and it was exactly as described - as perfect as Shure could make it back then and sounds/tracks great for the type. I'm well happy.
Did you buy them from Nick? (Suffolk Branch)
I've bought a few items from Hughie (Kent Branch) Always had decent service from him.
Seconded - I am detecting a worrying trend here to flame traders and I for one am uncomfortable by it.
I have bought several items from Nick at Emporium HiFi - indeed one arrived today (Quad 33 disc amplifier board) which is what prompted me to respond - and I have always found the service excellent. Regarding this item I spotted it on their website - wasn't sure it was what I was after so sent an email - Nick replied within an hour and the deal was done. Arrived today exactly as described in perfect order and at a very reasonable price.
My concern is that this forum and hence the posts are read by many folk all over the world and this sort of "attack" can have a very negative impact on their business. Traders should be extended the right of reply IMHO and from just the few responses to the initial post would indicate that Jonny's experience is not typical.
I think this post needs moderator input - my personal opinion is that it should be taken down - and no, I have no conflict of interest in Emporioum HiFi but I do have an interest in fairness and right-of-reply.
Steve
Have you contacted them and given them the opportunity to make good?
Good point.
Sorry, Jonny, until you can provide some evidence of the above, I have removed your opening post and locked the thread.
Once done, and if The Emporium haven't addressed your concerns satisfactorily, PM me with some form of relevant evidence and I will restore your opening post and re-open the thread.
Ta! :cool:
Marco.
After some investigation into this situation, and having spoken with Nick, from The Emporium (yes it was him, and the Suffolk branch, that Jonny bought the speakers from), to get his side of the story, I can provide the following additional factual information:
1) The speakers bought from The Emporium's advert on eBay were clearly marked as 'spares or repair'.
2) Nick offered to deliver the speakers to Jonny, who lived some 100+ miles away from his premises, on a trailer in order to prevent them being mishandled by couriers, and has fulfilled that delivery, for the sum of £60.
3) Nick has since offered Jonny a full refund and to take the speakers back, and therefore has attempted to 'make good' his complaint.
I'm now awaiting Jonny to contact me to provide more details from his side of the story, and those will of course be taken into consideration.
I understand that Jonny is claiming that the speakers were insufficiently packed and transported by The Emporium, and that the damage quoted was caused as a direct result of this, and that he was told that despite the speakers being sold as 'spares or repair', he enquired if they could still be used, and was told that apart from re-foaming one woofer, that they could be plugged in and work straight away.
Whilst that may be true, in the absence of factual evidence to prove Jonny's claims, it is simply hearsay (and his word against Nick's). And so I'm afraid that, whilst we sympathise with his predicament, in such circumstances we cannot allow Jonny's original accusations to stand and potentially unfairly damage the reputation of a well-established and respected business.
If, however, circumstances change and evidence is provided which proves that The Emporium were guilty of negligence and/or of providing false information, then the matter will be revised accordingly.
Jonny's original post has now been restored, with the currently unproven allegations removed, and the thread re-opened to invite any of your comments.
Marco.
Haselsh1
02-12-2011, 08:31
Traders should be extended the right of reply IMHO and from just the few responses to the initial post would indicate that Jonny's experience is not typical.
I think this post needs moderator input - my personal opinion is that it should be taken down - and no, I have no conflict of interest in Emporioum HiFi but I do have an interest in fairness and right-of-reply.
Steve
Traders are given same right of reply through this forum as anyone else is. With this in mind maybe traders should be a little more careful about the products they sell and this way negative comments could be avoided. They, the traders, are responsible for how we perceive their products. My personal opinion is that they should excercise more care.
worthingpagan
02-12-2011, 08:39
I don't think it's fair to degrade someone's reputation with or without evidence by posting on an internet forum. There are civil courts available. I think marco has done the right thing.
Marco - suggest you change your forum tag to Solomon :lol:
Good call
Steve
Sorry, but i don't like trial by forums.
If blatent scams are happening then fair enough.
Traders are given same right of reply through this forum as anyone else is.
True, but only if they register/join and I know of one dealer who I have done extensive business with who told me he is reluctant to do so as doesn't want to appear to be advertising but I take your point - nonetheless we should avoid the temptation to be a kangaroo court
:nono:
Steve
StanleyB
02-12-2011, 10:10
If the items were advertised as For Spares or Repair then the buyer is trying to push his luck with his expectations. It seems he was expecting an item in working and near mint condition, even though the item was not sold as such.
julesd68
02-12-2011, 10:23
Does anyone remember "Crown Court" from the 70's?? I remember watching it as a youngster and always being a bit dissapointed if the accused were found to be not guilty. It would be great if we could avoid doing "Audiophile Crown Court" but at the same time people should feel free to express their opinions and experiences - I think most of us want to know which dealers are offering good service and which aren't. As I pointed out earlier, there had been a similar thread on Wigwam a while ago which Hughie from Emporium responded to on-line and that was the end of it - I don't think the subject was re-visited.
Two of my amps were bought from Hughie with excellent service - I have not dealt with Nick much, but am sure that if the guys have made a mistake, they would stick their hands up - anyway, if they have offered to take the amp back with a full refund, they can't do much more than that can they?
If the items were advertised as For Spares or Repair then the buyer is trying to push his luck with his expectations. It seems he was expecting an item in working and near mint condition, even though the item was not sold as such.
That's true, Stan, but if he takes the time to contact the seller and is assured that the speakers in question are usable (if indeed that actually happened), then I guess that it was reasonable to assume that what the seller told him was accurate.
However, as the speakers were for 'spares or repair', and therefore imperfect, the problem is that there is no way of knowing for sure if the condition that the speakers arrived in was the same as it was when they left the shop.... It would thus be very difficult to quantify what damage (if any) had occurred in transit, in the trailer, to their destination.
Marco.
It's unfortunate if the speakers were further damaged by transporting them on a trailer, I expect the suspension on a trailer would be quite unforgiving. If there's been a problem here it sounds like a one-off and not something to draw general conclusions about the Emporium.
A trailer to deliver any HiFi gear is not a satisfactory way to deliver. (Put politely) If no additional damage at all happens it is a miracle. £60 too for this service.
Why do they have used a trailer? Are the speakers THAT large? No van?
Bad service at the minimun.
For all those who jump to their defence make sure your next purchase is delivered by trailer. That is not a joke just a reality check for you.
I think the OP has every right to expose this aspect of service
worthingpagan
02-12-2011, 11:48
A trailer to deliver any HiFi gear is not a satisfactory way to deliver. (Put politely) If no additional damage at all happens it is a miracle. £60 too for this service.
Why do they have used a trailer? Are the speakers THAT large? No van?
Bad service at the minimun.
For all those who jump to their defence make sure your next purchase is delivered by trailer. That is not a joke just a reality check for you.
I think the OP has every right to expose this aspect of service
Yeah, in a court, thereby allowing for both sides to be heard
Yeah, in a court, thereby allowing for both sides to be heard
Whats to be heard they used a trailer? No dispute.
So are going to demand trailer delivery until a court case.
A trailer to deliver any HiFi gear is not a satisfactory way to deliver. (Put politely) If no additional damage at all happens it is a miracle. £60 too for this service.
Why do they have used a trailer? Are the speakers THAT large? No van?
Bad service at the minimun.
For all those who jump to their defence make sure your next purchase is delivered by trailer. That is not a joke just a reality check for you.
I think the OP has every right to expose this aspect of service
Yes the OP may very well have a totally genuine issue but the internet is full of postings where people complain, this can give a misleading view of the company involved. Are all their transactions problematic? The thing is that people tend not to post when they are satisfied so these threads are usually very unbalanced. I'm not saying that hasn't been a problem here, I am saying we need to keep a sense of perspective.
Spot on (as usual) Clive!
Marco.
I don't want to cross swords with anybody here but surely a customer is entitled to get the best service the seller can provide. It should not be a reason for extolling their praises - the exception I would make is when you buy from an individual, be it on eBay or a forum.
It follows from that that, when the service is not what it should be you are entitled to complain - some would say you have a duty. Keeping quiet about any dealer not fully honouring his side of the deal only encourages them to do it again to another undeserving customer.
IMHO the average buyer has enough 'oil in his lamp' to form his own judgement about 1 bad deal amongst thousands or 10 bad deals amongst a couple of dozen.
Keeping quiet does no one any favours in the long term.
On the other hand, heartfelt apologies and efforts to put the situation right should also be publicly acknowledged.
Dave.
I don't want to cross swords with anybody here but surely a customer is entitled to get the best service the seller can provide. It should not be a reason for extolling their praises - the exception I would make is when you buy from an individual, be it on eBay or a forum.
It follows from that that, when the service is not what it should be you are entitled to complain - some would say you have a duty. Keeping quiet about any dealer not fully honouring his side of the deal only encourages them to do it again to another undeserving customer.
IMHO the average buyer has enough 'oil in his lamp' to form his own judgement about 1 bad deal amongst thousands or 10 bad deals amongst a couple of dozen.
Keeping quiet does no one any favours in the long term.
On the other hand, heartfelt apologies and efforts to put the situation right should also be publicly acknowledged.
Dave.
If there were an avalanche of fellow complainants showing up as a result of this thread then it would be something to take notice of. As it is it's a one-sided (plausible) story of events. It is statistically insignificant, to think otherwise on the the data available would be an elementary error that GCSE maths students would not be expected to make. It doesn't pass the "fair test" aspect either. The OP was offered a refund I believe, is there really anything much of interest going on here for the wider community?
Hi Dave,
I think what we're saying is that complain to the dealer, or to whoever it was you bought something faulty from, by all means, but when incidents are reported on a popular forum, such as AoS, read every day by thousands of people, it's important to keep things in perspective and stick to the facts. It's also courteous to allow the dealer (or whoever) the chance to rectify the complaint, before going public about it.
Otherwise, the good reputation of a perfectly decent dealer, who may have simply made a mistake or misjudgement, could end up being unfairly (and perhaps even irreparably) damaged. Our stance on AoS in these matters is that we will allow genuine (provable as possible) grievances to be aired by members, but we cannot host unjustified and damaging negative remarks, based simply on hearsay.
Of course I'm not saying that this applies in John's case, as I simply don't know. I suspect that, as usual, there was some fault on both sides. However, it's important that people have their say on the matter, within reason, as we don't believe in gagging, which is why the OP's thread was reopened :)
Marco.
If there were an avalanche of fellow complainants showing up as a result of this thread then it would be something to take notice of. As it is it's a one-sided (plausible) story of events. It is statistically insignificant, to think otherwise on the the data available would be an elementary error that GCSE maths students would not be expected to make. It doesn't pass the "fair test" aspect either. The OP was offered a refund I believe, is there really anything much of interest going on here for the wider community?
Yes there is.This supplier delivers goods in an unsuitable way that can almost ensure damage of some form. If you are buying something small or that they are used to fine. Check their delivery method for your purchase.
Why does everone play down what in any other sales/delivery environment is disgracefuuly poor service, like it or not
Yes there is.This supplier delivers goods in an unsuitable way that can almost ensure damage of some form. If you are buying something small or that they are used to fine. Check their delivery method for your purchase.
Why does everone play down what in any other sales/delivery environment is disgracefuuly poor service, like it or not
Because as far as we can tell it's a single incident. Have you ever made a mistake or misjudgment?
If there were an avalanche of fellow complainants showing up as a result of this thread then it would be something to take notice of. As it is it's a one-sided (plausible) story of events. It is statistically insignificant, to think otherwise on the the data available would be an elementary error that GCSE maths students would not be expected to make. It doesn't pass the "fair test" aspect either. The OP was offered a refund I believe, is there really anything much of interest going on here for the wider community?
With the exception of the last sentence I would not disagree with a word of the above - I am not in a position to comment on that aspect - but I did make the point about an apology and attempting to put it right.
IMHO the facts should be made available to other potential customers to enable them to make up their own mind - without the facts no one can make any informed judgement. You used the term 'statistically insignificant', I made the comparison between 1 bad report in a thousand and 10 in a couple of dozen - are we not actually saying the same thing?
Imagine how you'd feel in a few months time if you posted a similar comment as the OP and he then posted, "Yes, the same thing happened to me a few months ago but I kept quiet about it".
'Buyer beware' and 'Caveat emptor' spring to mind (which you are more able to do when you are informed).
Another point: in this day and age in particular any buyer needs to feel that he or she is spending their money wisely and any seller should be even more determined to properly service their customers, there's too few customers out thers for a seller to do otherwise.
For the record I have nothing against the seller involved - neither I nor anyone I know has ever done business with them, to the best of my knowledge :) .
Dave.
'Buyer beware' and 'Caveat emptor' spring to mind (which you are more able to do when you are informed).
We're in danger of doing this to death so hopefully 'll keep out after this! We are as you say close to agreement. As for people being informed....I'm not sure that we are properly informed. We've only heard one side of the story. I know of people who have dealt with Nick, I've not heard any negative comments in the past. I may have spoken with him once, I'm not sure. I don't know the OP at all and have not heard any comments about him.
southall-1998
02-12-2011, 15:27
Be good to see the ebay advert. Does the guy remember the item number?
Regards.
Indeed. I tried to find it but couldn't :)
Marco.
jandl100
02-12-2011, 15:56
Sorry, but i don't like trial by forums.
I agree.
This thread should not be happening.
Sorry, Jerry, I disagree. This thread should not be happening if it merely served to denigrate a perfectly respectable dealer. However, surely you can see that this isn't the case and it exists simply as a public information service? People are entitled to their constructive opinions.
I've spoken with Nick, from The Emporium, who is fully aware of the thread's existence, and I can assure you that he doesn't have any problem with it whatsoever, in fact he may be commenting later himself :)
Marco.
southall-1998
02-12-2011, 16:14
Sorry, Jerry, I disagree. This thread should not be happening if it merely served to denigrate a perfectly respectable dealer. However, surely you can see that this isn't the case and it exists simply as a public information exercise? People are entitled to their constructive opinions.
I've spoken with Nick, from The Emporium, who is fully aware of the thread's existence, and I can assure you that he doesn't have any problem with it whatsoever, in fact he may be commenting later himself :)
Marco.
:popcorn:
Audioman
02-12-2011, 16:34
The only comment that I can make is that if the OP is genuine then there has been a misunderstanding. I think dealers who have 'spares or repair' items might be wiser not to sell them through their normal ebay shop. These are for the experienced self builder / repairer or possibly fit for the skip. Frankly if Nick has to refund the price (which we don't know) plus the £60 he would have been better off doing the latter. Perhaps the cabinets might make some nice shelves.:)
I am puzzled by the delivery method and the amount charged. For this I would have thought a courier service could deliver with insurance. Of course the item might be of little value anyway but doesn't excuse a lack of protection in transit.
Because as far as we can tell it's a single incident. Have you ever made a mistake or misjudgment?
Well if you are neutral as I am, and interested in all the anti OP postings here, you may search beyond AoS and discover.....
worthingpagan
02-12-2011, 17:08
Whats to be heard they used a trailer? No dispute.
So are going to demand trailer delivery until a court case.
Sorry mate, I would like to reply but can you run that by me in a language I can understand please ;)
Someone has just emailed me a link to The Emporium eBay sale, and the speakers bought by John:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/alison-one-speakers-pair-spares-repair-/300605112127#ht_3774wt_1187
It would be interesting if John could take some pictures of what they look like now, presuming that he still has them, so we can compare the speakers now to what they looked like originally on the eBay ad.......
Come on, John, we're trying to help you here, mate! :)
Marco.
Audioman
02-12-2011, 17:35
Someone has just emailed me a link to The Emporium eBay sale and the speakers bought by John:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/alison-one-speakers-pair-spares-repair-/300605112127#ht_3774wt_1187
It would be interesting if John could take some pictures of what they look like now, presuming that he still has them, so we can compare the speakers now to what they looked like originally on the eBay ad.......
Come on, John, we're trying to help you here, mate! :)
Marco.
EEK - £200 no way. They look bad enough in the ebay add. From their appearance I would not be expecting much. Potential I suppose if drive units can be repaired and cabinet tarted up. Is it worth it ? They look big I suppose. Still no excuse not to pack properly.
Lodgesound
02-12-2011, 17:42
Quite detailed pictures that seem to portray quite an honest view of the speakers ie. they are obviously in quite a state and in need of some TLC and repair and indeed that is stated in the ad.
Seems these went new for around $800 in 1978 and in good condition would maybe fetch about 400-500 pounds now. A new driver and grilles coupled with some crossover repairs and general checkout would probably come to around £120.00 making them a fair deal but not for the faint hearted. A lesson in why one should always do a basic resistance test on any speakers of unknown condition to avoid possible amplifier damage.
I am puzzled as to why your monoblock burnt out when connected to the shorted one - does it not have protection ie. a fuse or a breaker?
I am puzzled as to why your monoblock burnt out when connected to the shorted one - does it not have protection ie. a fuse or a breaker?
:eek: :eek: :eyebrows:
ATTENTION!!!..... World War 3 alert!! DO NOT GO THERE!!!! :oops: :whistle: :wowzer: :wowzer: :no: :trust:
;)
Marco.
Reid Malenfant
02-12-2011, 17:54
:lolsign: Mark gets his coat 5673
Lodgesound
02-12-2011, 18:03
Whoops...........yes I remember.......!!
(Heads for bunker...)
Audioman
03-12-2011, 08:48
Quite detailed pictures that seem to portray quite an honest view of the speakers ie. they are obviously in quite a state and in need of some TLC and repair and indeed that is stated in the ad.
Seems these went new for around $800 in 1978 and in good condition would maybe fetch about 400-500 pounds now. A new driver and grilles coupled with some crossover repairs and general checkout would probably come to around £120.00 making them a fair deal but not for the faint hearted. A lesson in why one should always do a basic resistance test on any speakers of unknown condition to avoid possible amplifier damage.
I am puzzled as to why your monoblock burnt out when connected to the shorted one - does it not have protection ie. a fuse or a breaker?
I agree that the advert does a reasonable job in portraying the condition. I thing $800 33 years ago would suggest a max of £200-£300 in minty condition. Probably cost that to repair to an acceptable standard subject to parts availability. To put into context some minty Mission 752's or 753's would cost less and likely sound better. The OP's blown monoblocks might have also been a dodgy epay buy for all we know! Looks to me there is fault on both sides here. The buyer would do well to be more aware of value v quality. The seller should ensure electrical safety of the item sold irrespective of the 'spares or repair' description.
Mission 752's and 753's would have "attitude" certainly, but "better?" - Not to these ears methinks - I loved the early to mid 70's AR speakers and the Allisons are an interesting direct descendant of these I think, judging by some of the drive units used. I don't think this range was marketed in the UK for long :(
I heard Allison Ones at the end of Albarry amps and a Trio L-07D at an early 80's hifi show: it absolutely blew me away, the memory of the sound quality achieved in that room lived with me for years. A poor student then, I aspired to that system. It took me 30 years to buy the Trio!
Those speakers are stunning, and, nostalgia aside, if there are ever a pair in the UK in good condition, I'd seriously look at buying them. I looked at those Allisons on eBay: they were in poor condition and I didn't want to take a risk on them, certainly not at £200. I certainly wouldn't have plugged them in without getting them fully serviced/rebuilt beforehand, but that's just me. Absolutely no excuse for trailer delivery though, unless that method was agreed beforehand.
The OP's blown monoblocks might have also been a dodgy epay buy for all we know! Looks to me there is fault on both sides here. The buyer would do well to be more aware of value v quality. The seller should ensure electrical safety of the item sold irrespective of the 'spares or repair' description.
Me thinks you presume a hell of a lot with " The OP's blown monoblocks might have also been a dodgy epay buy for all we know!"
They werent! How do I know, guess you are good at that?
So the fault one sided.
Get your facts before insulting people.
Are you the OP?
Please explain in language we can understand.
Audioman
03-12-2011, 11:55
Me thinks you presume a hell of a lot with " The OP's blown monoblocks might have also been a dodgy epay buy for all we know!"
They werent! How do I know, guess you are good at that?
So the fault one sided.
Get your facts before insulting people.
If the OP is unhappy with my comments I am happy to appologise. Just speculating that he may be accumulating equipment based on ebay 'bargains'. He certainly got it wrong with the speakers but I have said that the seller has some if not equal responsibility for the situation. He has offered a refund which is correct practice under 'the customer is always right' rule.
Frankly you are also making presumptions and I dislike your rather rude manner in the above post.
Paul.
Audioman
03-12-2011, 12:00
I heard Allison Ones at the end of Albarry amps and a Trio L-07D at an early 80's hifi show: it absolutely blew me away, the memory of the sound quality achieved in that room lived with me for years. A poor student then, I aspired to that system. It took me 30 years to buy the Trio!
Those speakers are stunning, and, nostalgia aside, if there are ever a pair in the UK in good condition, I'd seriously look at buying them. I looked at those Allisons on eBay: they were in poor condition and I didn't want to take a risk on them, certainly not at £200. I certainly wouldn't have plugged them in without getting them fully serviced/rebuilt beforehand, but that's just me. Absolutely no excuse for trailer delivery though, unless that method was agreed beforehand.
If this was an Albarry dem I may have heard the same set up. The sound of the Albarrys remains firmly imprinted in my mind but don't remember the speakers used. Certainly one of the best solid state amps I have heard irrespective of price.
worthingpagan
03-12-2011, 12:07
Me thinks you presume a hell of a lot with " The OP's blown monoblocks might have also been a dodgy epay buy for all we know!"
They werent! How do I know, guess you are good at that?
So the fault one sided.
Get your facts before insulting people.
Are you going to reply to my previous post or not? :scratch:
barry-potter
03-12-2011, 12:17
if people are allowed to praise the service that they get from the likes of stan b (who incidentally offered me fantastic customer service with my beresford caimen) and nva then why is the inverse not true? i am simply recounting my experience and if you had a different level of service from emporium then i am pleased for you.
i was offered a refund but had to transport the speakers back myself, so i would have to pay 2 lots of delivery charges and the cost of getting the amp fixed and end up with nothing. my last email informing him that i wanted the cost of the amp repaired (with all the logistics that entailed) was ignored. hence me losing patience
It helps that you now make your gripes clear, we only had your original post to go from.
If this was an Albarry dem I may have heard the same set up. The sound of the Albarrys remains firmly imprinted in my mind but don't remember the speakers used. Certainly one of the best solid state amps I have heard irrespective of price.
Yes it was Albarry amps: I'm a bit puzzled by your observation that you remember the "sound" of the Albarry's but cannot remember the speakers involved?:scratch:
If it was the same show (the Bespoke Audio room at the Harrogate and Swiss Cottge shows - I was at the former), and if my memory is functioning correctly, the system was Trio/Albarry/Allisons. Bl**dy wonderful :)
southall-1998
03-12-2011, 12:41
I'd love to hear some Allison 1 speakers.
Are these speakers fussy with what amp you use with them?
Regards.
Sorry mate, I would like to reply but can you run that by me in a language I can understand please ;)
Yes , if one looks/searches beyond AoS one finds reason to believe this is not a one off for poor service from Emporium.
Or was it the trailer post?
If any one thinks it is acceptable to deliver HiFi by trailer then they should demand their orders are delivered that way.
Audioman
03-12-2011, 13:28
Yes it was Albarry amps: I'm a bit puzzled by your observation that you remember the "sound" of the Albarry's but cannot remember the speakers involved?:scratch:
If it was the same show (the Bespoke Audio room at the Harrogate and Swiss Cottge shows - I was at the former), and if my memory is functioning correctly, the system was Trio/Albarry/Allisons. Bl**dy wonderful :)
Probably because impending senility prevents accurate recall of an event 30 years ago. :) Just remember the Albarry due to the great sound and unusual appearance. It was certainly at a different show as I never attended Harrogate or Swiss Cottage. So I would guess Bristol/Heathrow or possibly the Paul Roberts show that used to be at Weston-Super-Mare.
Frankly you are also making presumptions and I dislike your rather rude manner in the above post.
Indeed. Alan, please tone down your language and stop being so tetchy and somewhat confrontational. Cheers!
Marco.
It helps that you now make your gripes clear, we only had your original post to go from.
Quite.
John, it's a pity you never thought of photographing the condition the speakers arrived in before returning them, as then we could've compared those to what was on the eBay ad, and if they were significantly different (i.e. even more 'shagged' looking), your position of complaint would've been much stronger.
I agree that under any circumstances the speakers should not have been transported in a trailer. I really have no idea why it was felt necessary to use one... :scratch:
Marco.
If any one thinks it is acceptable to deliver HiFi by trailer then they should demand their orders are delivered that way.
__________________
It does say economy delivery in the ad.;)
worthingpagan
03-12-2011, 18:47
It does say economy delivery in the ad.;)
:D:peace:
A trailer to deliver any HiFi gear is not a satisfactory way to deliver. (Put politely) If no additional damage at all happens it is a miracle. £60 too for this service.
If it is a 200 mile round trip as indicated in Marco's post that's about £30 quids worth of petrol straight away! Let alone wear and tear on the vehicle and the guys time.
I've used the Hifi Emporium in the past and been very satisfied with the service.
Regards
Neil
Audioman
05-12-2011, 20:20
If it is a 200 mile round trip as indicated in Marco's post that's about £30 quids worth of petrol straight away! Let alone wear and tear on the vehicle and the guys time.
I've used the Hifi Emporium in the past and been very satisfied with the service.
Regards
Neil
Would have thought a courier service would be cheaper and added to that no packing/protection was provided.
Would have thought a courier service would be cheaper and added to that no packing/protection was provided.
If they are big and without the original packaging then courier service is not an option. From my reading of the posts the buyer knew they were getting them delivered in person so I don't see a cause for complaint there. Had the OP collected them in person he could have asked for a quick demo that they were working.
Given they were clearly marked on the eBay listing as spares or repair by the vendor then I can't see too much of an issue with the way they were transported. If they had been sold as being in full working order then it would be different but from the facts that can be established that is not the case.
The issue with the amp is very unfortunate but a simple conductivity test would establish a short on the speaker and avoided the problem (if the speaker is the cause of that problem, it could be unlucky coincidence).
If I bough a car with no MOT and sold as spares or repair I wouldn't jump in it and go for a high speed spin before getting it checked out by somone who knows about cars (as I don't).
Regards
Neil
Hi Neil,
I'm completely neutral in this matter, so don't feel that I'm 'challenging' you in any way. However, just a few observations...
From my reading of the posts the buyer knew they were getting them delivered in person so I don't see a cause for complaint there.
Indeed, but did the buyer know that they would be getting bumped about in an open trailer for 100+ miles, or did he presume that they'd have been delivered more securely in a van? We simply don't know what delivery method had been agreed between both parties, after the sale had been made.
However, it seems fairly certain to me, given John's comments, that had the seller told him that the speakers would be getting delivered in an open trailer, John would not have agreed to it.
Given they were clearly marked on the eBay listing as spares or repair by the vendor then I can't see too much of an issue with the way they were transported.
Yes, but did the seller take sufficient care in ensuring that the speakers arrived at their destination in exactly the same condition (internally, as well as externally) as advertised and was shown in the pictures on the eBay ad? Anything less than that, I would consider as unacceptable.
I get the feeling (perhaps wrongly?) that, in the eyes of the seller, because the speakers had been sold as 'spares or repair', it didn't really matter how they arrived at their destination. Quite simply, even if one has bought something that is imperfect, one doesn't expect it to be even more imperfect when it arrives, than it was before it was delivered....
The issue with the amp is very unfortunate but a simple conductivity test would establish a short on the speaker and avoided the problem (if the speaker is the cause of that problem, it could be unlucky coincidence).
If I bough a car with no MOT and sold as spares or repair I wouldn't jump in it and go for a high speed spin before getting it checked out by somone who knows about cars (as I don't).
I completely agree. This is where the behaviour of the buyer was rather foolish (given that the speakers had been advertised for sale as 'spares or repair'), even if he'd been advised by the seller that they were still ok to use. If indeed that did happen. In such situations, it's always better erring on the side of caution, and being safe rather than sorry.
Marco.
The Grand Wazoo
06-12-2011, 18:12
I'm very uneasy about this thread - it's sole purpose seems to be to inflict damage on the vendor. It's now running at 60+ posts with only two of those submitted by the OP. He hasn't mentioned to us anything about how things have developed.
However, I agree completely with Marco's comments above - when I buy something I expect to get it in the same condition as it was at the moment the deal was done. Even if you are only buying something as rough as a bag of spanners then it should remain in that same condition. Whoever delivers it has no right to decide which parts are expendable and which are not - it should be treated it as if it were in pristine, new condition unless agreed otherwise.
It doesn't sound like either party has done themselves or each other any favours. Perhaps this is a good reason to keep things between vendor and buyer until they have been fully resolved.
Hi Chris,
I'm very uneasy about this thread - it's sole purpose seems to be to inflict damage on the vendor. It's now running at 60+ posts with only two of those submitted by the OP. He hasn't mentioned to us anything about how things have developed.
I agree. I'm always reluctant to lock threads, but in terms of this dispute, I don't think there's much more left to say.
However, I agree completely with Marco's comments above - when I buy something I expect to get it in the same condition as it was at the moment the deal was done. Even if you are only buying something as rough as a bag of spanners then it should remain in that same condition. Whoever delivers it has no right to decide which parts are expendable and which are not - it should be treated it as if it were in pristine, new condition unless agreed otherwise.
For me, that is the crux of the matter.
It doesn't sound like either party has done themselves or each other any favours. Perhaps this is a good reason to keep things between vendor and buyer until they have been fully resolved.
I think so. I'll leave the thread open for a little longer, in order to allow Neil to reply, then I shall close it.
Marco.
Well if I need to slag off a dealer I know where to come. :violin:
That's hardly the case, Robin. The actions of both the seller and buyer have been equally criticised, and rightly so. The dealer in question has the right of reply here, but has chosen so far not to use it.
All we're trying to do is allow people with different opinions to have their say, although that privilege in this instance is fast approaching its sell-by date.
Marco.
bogle111
07-12-2011, 09:31
I have looked but cannot find a sort of "Guideline" for purchaser complaint.
FWIW I think that the dealer should be contacted first by the purchaser. The complaint then the response should both be posted at the same time. If no response received within seven days, then the complaint should be posted after a second communication with the seller stating that the complainee is going "live" with this. Forum wise.
I think Forums are the replacement for newspaper articles, and carry too much weight for being played with.
If that makes sense.
Regards
Pete
Yep, I agree. And on that note, folks, I think it's time to call it a day. Thanks to all those who have contributed to the discussion :)
<Thread closed>
Marco.
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