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Haselsh1
08-10-2011, 16:49
http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab240/Haselsh1/SkeltonTowerTMax100.jpg

Just over a week ago I was lucky enough to experience a truly stunning morning so I thought I would take a drive onto the North Yorkshire Moors to a place called Skelton Tower. The shot here is what resulted and was shot using a vintage Nikon F3/MD-4 combo fitted with a 17mm ultra wide angle lens. Film was Kodak T-Max 100 which was developed in Ilford ID-11 at 1+3. The negative was scanned using an Epson V700 scanner and was then converted using Photoshop CS2. I used a deep orange filter and had a truly blessed day.

The Vinyl Adventure
08-10-2011, 19:44
Did you see my shots from Wales Shaun?
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=11849
Similar feel!
I have one printed on fine art rag... It's lovely! :)
Very nice btw, just my cuppa that!

Beechwoods
08-10-2011, 19:56
Gorgeous! What a shot...!

The Vinyl Adventure
08-10-2011, 20:18
Actually ... These were the final versions

This one for me

http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/houseandwallb.jpg

This one was my first "fine art" image that i sold to someone else

http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/housesticksandwall-editb2.jpg

Taken with my d3 but not posted as any kind of evidence of te potential of digital!! ;) hehe

Reid Malenfant
08-10-2011, 20:24
Sorry to tell you this Hamish, but the film shot photo by Shaun does look noticably less grainy & more detailed imho.

I must be coming down with the same disease as Marco as i to can see the difference now ;)

Beechwoods
08-10-2011, 20:27
I think that's intentional Mark!

Reid Malenfant
08-10-2011, 20:29
I think that's intentional Mark!
Oh, ok ;) I didn't realise :scratch:

Your surname isn't Spielberg is it Hamish?

The Vinyl Adventure
08-10-2011, 20:32
Mine have grain added to them as part of the process... ie. That grain is part of the look I set out to create!
People should realise that comparing images on a forum is daft ...
The process, the jpeg compression the service used to host the photos will all make a difference ...
As I've said, I couldn't give a monkies for any comparison ... It's just not a sensible playing field for such a thing ...
The only near sensible comparison would be 2 shots taken by the same photog (an unbiased one) with the same lens and processed with a comparison in mind! Even printing on different papers will make cast difference ... It's just not a comparison that is easy to make even in highly controlled circumstances ... It's like trying to compare vinyl to high res digital ... There are too many variables to come to any really sensible conclusion!

Reid Malenfant
08-10-2011, 20:41
Mine have grain added to them as part of the process... ie. That grain is part of the look I set out to create!
Ah, so you surname is Spielberg or you are related to him :eyebrows:

Sorry, i just don't get it & i'd kick that bloke about the room for his so called artistic merits when i look at films (sorry for the drift) like War Of The Worlds, Minority Report & Saving Private Ryan on blu ray :steam:

Would you believe the an old film like Kelly's Heroes looks better in HD :confused: I purchase a film to look at the picture, not the grain ffs...

Apologies for going off topic & not understanding your intension with the picture Hamish. All i can say is i prefer it as clear as possible...

You are undoubtedly correct about viewing any pictures on forums as they are compressed to buggary with native 12Mp + cameras ;)

Welder
08-10-2011, 20:53
Well I’ll be buggered. I knew things were different up North and technology took its time to filter up that way along with money but I didn’t realise nature favored down South as well. So when are you guys expecting colour? :eyebrows:

Rare Bird
08-10-2011, 20:56
Dont talk so ridiculous

The Vinyl Adventure
08-10-2011, 20:57
Funnily enough I was going to mention war of the worlds when you said speilberg ... I like the Gradeing used on that film!

Even more odd, I e spent a portion of my week chatting to a film maker who made the video in this site (one of my clients)http://www.hilliergallery.co.uk/ ... Convo often drifted toward film grading and it's relationship to photo pp and how I am influenced quite a lot by movies and the effects in my work!

Clarity is not of great interest to me ... Emotional response triggered by the feeling the director was trying to achieve is! (not saying you shouldn't feel the way you do, different strokes and all that)

You will hate this I'm sure ... But this is the extreme end of my editing ... Not a spec of sharpness in it! But I love it!

http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/intothelight-1.jpg

Reid Malenfant
08-10-2011, 20:59
Actually Hamish you are quite wrong, i really like that picture! :)

I just don't like grain, haloes or other crap in moving pictures. I can see the emotional thing about the above pic, it's fabulous!

The Vinyl Adventure
08-10-2011, 21:09
Thank you! :)

What about in saving private Ryan, the bleach bypass sorta look in that has basically changed how war films/tv shows are made!
The bits where you are supposed to feel the shock of the event has that sorta smearing lens flare thing going on ... It's superbly done!

Thing Fish
08-10-2011, 21:15
I don't want to hijack this thread but, speaking of black and white pictures and the photoshop manipulation thereof.

This is a short video of the approach I use to obtaining black and white images. Its only 5 mins long so stick with it. The results are quite surprising (its not my video by the way) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzP2tHMiP2g&list=PL9E98DB0049BFDDF6&index=2

The pics below are mine though. Taken on an old battered Canon G5...:)

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_hZnWAaRKSns/SsOzHvU2ldI/AAAAAAAABJU/LlKeRh9EcRw/s400/stage+door+night.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hZnWAaRKSns/SpZEwhO4wlI/AAAAAAAABFY/Gf3_I1Moau4/s400/berwick+street.jpg

Reid Malenfant
08-10-2011, 21:18
To me it's a different thing with a "motion" picture & not a still... A still captures an instant that may never be repeated (& probably won't) where as with motion i find i'd like the detail more than the arty side of things. With a photograph i can certainly go with the arty thing.

While i think the last photo you put up was quite stunning in certain respects i'm not so enamoured of adding grain to images like your two earlier pictures :scratch:

Each to there own m8, i'm not sure where i stand but i know what i like the look of & what i don't. I wouldn't be the best at explaining it either as i'm not much of a photographer :eyebrows:

Sorry :)

The Vinyl Adventure
08-10-2011, 21:27
You don't need to justify our self to me mate! We likes what we likes ... And that's fine by me!

You would love sliver efex Dave ... You can get thatsort of result with a lot less faffing!

Haselsh1
09-10-2011, 09:24
Of course in truth with digital you are not adding grain, you are adding a grain effect which is not the same thing. This brings me right back to my statement about digital merely being a facsimile of the real thing. With software like Silver Efex Pro and Colour Efex Pro you are merely doing what the software programmer allows you to do and you are only using an effect. The grain effect added by such software has little similarity to true film grain which can be changed and manipulated by a whole host of factors.

Haselsh1
09-10-2011, 09:58
Just as an aside to this post, I'd like to draw your attention to an exhibition of photography that is taking place in the education centre on Pickering Station which is part of the North Yorkshire Moors Railway. The exhibition is to be held from the 4th August 2012 until the 11th. Images will be from the archives of myself, Shaun Haselden and fellow photographer, Rob Passey. They are by no means going to be all railway based as I have a distinct passion for derelict empty wide open spaces like disused airfields whilst Rob has a love of industrial dereliction.

All of Rob's images will be shot on film and printed in a darkroom to produce genuine photographs some of which will be framed and some of which will just be mounted whereas my work will be all scanned and then printed Giclee style onto fine art cotton fibre paper. I tend to use Somerset Enhanced Velvet paper or Hahnemuhle Albrect Durer paper to get the effect I am looking for.

If you happen to be in the area during that period of time why not call in and have a coffee. Entry to the exhibition is free and entry to the station is free. I look forward to meeting new friends.

Mark Grant
09-10-2011, 10:13
This brings me right back to my statement about digital merely being a facsimile of the real thing.

I see what you are saying but if the real thing is like real life then in real life there is no grain, looking out of my window I dont see any film grain with my eyes.

Film grain is very arty though and I can see why you like it.

Maybe see if you can borrow a high quality DSLR with a high quality lens one day as you will surprised at the quality improvements in the last few years.

Most compacts and 'bridge' cameras are no comparison at all.

Mark Grant
09-10-2011, 10:16
The exhibition is to be held from the 4th August 2012 until the 11th. Images will be from the archives of myself, Shaun Haselden and fellow photographer, Rob Passey. .

Excellent :)

I will probably forget about it by then, could you bump this thread up next year or start another next August to mention it as Pickering is a lovely place and there will be people here that would visit if they know about it :)

Haselsh1
09-10-2011, 10:20
I see what you are saying but if the real thing is like real life then in real life there is no grain, looking out of my window I dont see any film grain with my eyes.

Film grain is very arty though and I can see why you like it.

Maybe see if you can borrow a high quality DSLR with a high quality lens one day as you will surprised at the quality improvements in the last few years.

Most compacts and 'bridge' cameras are no comparison at all.

'The real thing' is a true silver based photograph not a digital interpretation of a silver based photograph. Maybe as with CD and vinyl we should learn to accept that there are now many different forms of making recordings of imagery. I simply know that from an 'art' perspective, silver based imaging produces a much higher technical quality print than does digital and that this is especially true when discussing monochrome.

The Vinyl Adventure
09-10-2011, 10:47
In your subjective opinion?

Stratmangler
09-10-2011, 10:50
Shaun/Hamish

Give it a rest will you ?

The Vinyl Adventure
09-10-2011, 11:03
I dont even know why I start ... I feel like I'm fighting the corner of digital photogs everywhere ...
Ironically there are plenty of things that I prefer about film photography generally ...
I'll not say any more

Stratmangler
09-10-2011, 11:13
I liked using 5x4 plate cameras - it's surprising how having one shot can focus one's efforts.
Using 10x8 plate cameras up the ante on that.

Anything less is playing with toys.

However, it's not very practical to lug plate cameras around, so toys tend to rule the roost ;)

The Vinyl Adventure
09-10-2011, 11:33
Interesting reading on how close 22mp relatively small format phase one back gets get 4x5 ... And that's a few years old

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/Cramer.shtml

Of course there is always the tactile joy and excitement of shooting film ... Somthing digital can't live up to ... But that's a different argument altogether!

The Vinyl Adventure
09-10-2011, 12:06
84 million pixel large format "better light" scanning back

http://www.betterlight.com/superModels.html

More

http://www.betterlight.com/fullRes_zoomifyLIST.html

Not a replacement for analogue, but an interesting alternative should you have a few quid spare!

synsei
09-10-2011, 21:46
They are by no means going to be all railway based as I have a distinct passion for derelict empty wide open spaces like disused airfields whilst Rob has a love of industrial dereliction.

I can relate to this Shaun. I live in Northamptonshire and we are blessed with many disused WWII airfields and I find they have an ambience about them which is difficult to explain. I find myself becoming very reflective and emotional whenever I visit the two closest to me (Harrington (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Harrington) and Deenethorpe (http://www.controltowers.co.uk/D/Deenethorpe.htm) airfields.)

Up until recently the remaining runway at Deenethorpe was designated for emergency use by Harriers from RAF Wittering. A little further afield is RAF Polebroke where Clarke Gable was stationed during WWII.

Haselsh1
10-10-2011, 08:59
I can relate to this Shaun. I live in Northamptonshire and we are blessed with many disused WWII airfields and I find they have an ambience about them which is difficult to explain. I find myself becoming very reflective and emotional whenever I visit the two closest to me (Harrington (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Harrington) and Deenethorpe (http://www.controltowers.co.uk/D/Deenethorpe.htm) airfields.)

Up until recently the remaining runway at Deenethorpe was designated for emergency use by Harriers from RAF Wittering. A little further afield is RAF Polebroke where Clarke Gable was stationed during WWII.

Dave, I absolutely adore old disused airfields. I am originally from Lincolnshire and there were just so many to choose from. I often go back there for a drive just to visit some of them but my favourite is Kelstern which has the most amazing 'haunted' atmosphere to it. Near to my current home is RAF Wombleton which is very much intact thanks to the current owner. I love taking photographs there.

synsei
10-10-2011, 13:29
I love disused airfields too Shaun, all my friends think I'm a bit touched :lol:

My favourite is Deenthorpe as it is so complete. Up until around 2002 the control tower and all the ancillary buildings were still standing but unfortunately the farmer who owns the land had them pulled down :(

The main runway is still in use by a flying club and they are somewhat spoiled in having access to 5670ft of usable runway complete with working lighting. The USAAF 401st Bomb Group flew B17 Flying Fortresses out of the field during the war and whenever I'm up there visiting I can almost feel the B17's rumbling along the taxiways and servicemen and women bustling about their duties. It is a truly magnificent and moving place to spend a warm summers afternoon :)

The finest memory I have of the airfield is from the the late 1990's. The nearest sizeable town to the airfield is Corby which is about 4 miles away as the crow flies. During the period I mentioned plans were quite advanced for a world standard racing oval on the outskirts of the town (Rockingham Motor Speedway). There were a lot of executives involved in the project visiting the town for various high level meetings and conferences at the time and most would either fly in by helicopter or executive jets. On the occasion I mention I was sitting on a low, steel barrier positioned at the northerly end of the runway at the turnout point. It was a beautiful day with an almost cloudless blue sky and as I stared down the runway I noticed a distant dot quite low on the horizon. The dot grew larger and resolved into an aircraft and suddenly it's landing lights came on. It was at this point that I became aware that it was a twin engined jet with the engines slung under the wings. I realised then that this was not a typical executive jet and was somewhat larger. I stood to watch it on its finals and began wondering whether I should vacate my position. Stubborn as always, I decided to stand my ground and took out my camera for what was shaping up to be quite a show. Just then a fleet of black cars entered the airfield via one of the access roads to my left and proceeded along the perimeter road to the opposite end of the runway from my position. As the cars traversed the perimeter road the Boeing 737 -200 touched down on the runway, approaching my position at a serious rate of knots. I hopped over the barrier and took a few more steps backwards as the pilot deployed the reverse thrusters. The noise was spectacular, as was the jetwash, and I managed to fire off a few snaps as the 737 slowed to taxiing pace. The 737 entered the turnout point and I ascertained that the pilot was probably going to perform an about turn and trundle back up the runway, so I stepped back some more so as not to be sucked into it's starboard engine as it swung about. By this time the old adrenaline was pumping through my body and I was pretty excited. Wondering who it was who might warrant such an arrival and reception committee, I hopped on my mountain bike and began to follow the 737 at a safe distance back down the runway. I was stopped by a couple of guys driving a black Mercedes about a third of the way down the runway from where I had been standing and they asked who I was and why I was there. I had nothing to hide so I told them I found the airfield a pleasant place to visit and that I had been totally unprepared for what was happening, and then I asked who was on the plane. They wouldn't say and told me to stay put, so I did.

I subsequently discovered a few days later that the pilot of the 737 had been non other than Michael Schumacher and I kicked myself that I hadn't been a little more determined to reach the other end of the runway :eyebrows:

Marco
10-10-2011, 16:51
Indeed... Disused airfields rock, and so do disused railway stations, and old trains (the ones with enclosed individual compartments inside the carriages, with sliding doors, lamps inside on the walls, and comfy old seats with headrests)!

Anyone remember those? :)

Marco.

Haselsh1
13-10-2011, 19:57
Indeed... Disused airfields rock, and so do disused railway stations, and old trains (the ones with enclosed individual compartments inside the carriages, with sliding doors, lamps inside on the walls, and comfy old seats with headrests)!

Anyone remember those? :)

Marco.

The heritage railway we have up here on the North Yorkshire Moors has those lovely compartmentalised carriages that you refer to. All of the tourists refer to them as 'Harry Potter' coaches but unfortunately I haven't a clue as I don't watch films and only watch very little TV. Up here we also have quite a few 'Gresley' teak coaches as well. Now they are a thing to behold. They are truly stunning.

Haselsh1
14-10-2011, 08:19
In your subjective opinion?

My subjective opinion and that of a few million other photographers worldwide. Don't forget that I am talking about photographers here and not computer users. There is a massive difference between photographers and digital image manipulators.

Vinyleyes
14-10-2011, 09:41
I love disused airfields too Shaun, all my friends think I'm a bit touched :lol:

My favourite is Deenthorpe as it is so complete. Up until around 2002 the control tower and all the ancillary buildings were still standing but unfortunately the farmer who owns the land had them pulled down :(

I subsequently discovered a few days later that the pilot of the 737 had been non other than Michael Schumacher and I kicked myself that I hadn't been a little more determined to reach the other end of the runway :eyebrows:

You should have ran him off the runway ... or parked something in his way so he missed his flying lap ........... :lolsign:

synsei
14-10-2011, 10:29
:D::clapclapclap:

The Vinyl Adventure
15-10-2011, 19:02
Every photo taken with a digital camera is in some way digitally manipulated ...
Digital cameras are computers
Are you saying that digital photographers are in fact not photographers, but should actually be called "digital image manipulators"?