Putting Linn springs on my Thorens

[Dingdong]

I've noticed things have been sagging a bit recently. I'd give it a bit of a tweak only for it to go a bit saggy again a week or so later.

New springs I thought. Googled Thorens springs and found some nice, triple chromed, ones from Phonosophie. Got in touch with the UK agent for a price. £170. I asked them if they had misplaced the decimal point. They didn't reply.

Maybe Linn springs was my next thought. While at Whittlebury I found Russ wotshisname selling them for a tenner. That tenner was originally destined for some nice vinyl at Stamford Audio, but I thought this was a good investment.

Once home I eventually set about replacing the springs and the new rubbers. I left the nuts right at the end of their travel as I'd read that the Linn springs are a bit stronger. I read somewhere that the Thorens ones need 4lbs for compression were the Linn ones need 7lbs.

Did it bounce? Did it f**k!! Okay, time for a rethink.

A bit of investigation revealed that the Linn rubbers are a fair bit thicker than the Thorens ones and compress the springs on the Thorens bolts too much.
So I swapped the rubbers back after a cleaning. While doing this I noticed that the black plastic washers are actually wedge shaped. I think to compensate for the Thorens springs not being flat at the top. I left these out.

Yeah!! Bouncy bouncy time.

Getting the spring closest to the motor is always a bit of a bugger. I ended up replacing the smaller rubber with the Linn one to get it just right. The other springs I just used to level things up. I then went back and gave everything a slight tweak to get the fine balance of bounciness and being level.
I put the mat, clamp and a record on for the last tweak.

After a couple of days of running I gave it another tweak as it had settled slightly.
The bounce with the Linn springs is not as soft as it was with the Thorens springs, but it has remained stable for a while and I'm very happy with that.

There may be a bit of bracing epoxied on to the sub-platter in the not too distant future. So I'll be doing all over again. Yeah!!

I've got some tonearm wire on order (vdh mss-7) so that can be done at the same time.
Now back to experimenting with resistors for my diy supply. And listening to the odd bit of vinyl as well, as that's what it's all about isn't it?

[DSJR]

The LP12 springs work with the heavier TD125 I understand, although I gave mine to a mate before I'd used them on mine.. All you're doing is altering the frequency of bounce and nothing more, so don't waste your time here, as there's much more important issues, like the PLINTH for instance!!!

The Thorens decks never suffered sagging springs as the LP12 did at one time and they also got their rubber grommets right too, so IMO no need to replace them unless the suspension just cannot be gt to bounce piston-like. There are holes in the platter-toplate and sub-chassis to enable you to adjust the cam-washers to centre everything up and this is easily done with practice. Only about one in twenty TD160's I set up were almost impossible due to a bad spring.. I wish Linn had such an arrangelemt on their early decks, as before they finally got the plinths better in the late 80's, no two Lp12's were ever the same.

So you've removed the cam washers? Ah well, if it works for you... As I said above, with the deck mounted high so you can get underneath it with a small socket-spanner and with belt and outer platter on, these make it a doddle to adjust the suspension up - something that couldn't be done as easily on the Td150 and very early 160's and is a right PITA with the TD125 - and one of my 125 springs is iffy as well :(

[Rare Bird]

I can't remember what i did to get those springs to work on the TD.. i think i fitted extra weight by bolting a custom made Brass weight to the sub around the bearing housing!

[DSJR]

A shame you can't remember how heavy it was, as re-inforcing the bearing housing to the sub-chassis was a recommended upgrade back then, especially with non Thorens and SME tonearms. Adding mass as well would better sort the Linn springs too, although I don't see what's wrong with the originals, as any "sagging" would have happened decades ago and not recently - these things are nearly 40 years old now you know...

[hifi_dave]

Yeah, I've got a bit of sag too..:doh:

[Rare Bird]

:lolsign:

I much prefered the cradle type suspension of the Logic '101'.. Nowadays if i were to go back to vinyl i wouldnt touch a springy deck with a barge pole nor would i entertain belts.

[DSJR]

Yeah, I've got a bit of sag too..:doh:

A BIT???? :D

[Dingdong]

I can't remember what i did to get those springs to work on the TD.. i think i fitted extra weight by bolting a custom made Brass weight to the sub around the bearing housing!

They work alright at the moment. I'm quite happy with the results of my fiddling about. Might add some sort of mini girders accross the sub platter. Bit of stiffening could hurt.

[Rare Bird]

They work alright at the moment. I'm quite happy with the results of my fiddling about. Might add some sort of mini girders accross the sub platter. Bit of stiffening could hurt.
I had some brass turned which slipped over the bearing housing, i bolted that to the sub chassis adding more weight, i had a couple hole drilled throught each side of the piece tapped for grub screws, tigtening the grubs into the bearing housing as i wasnt happy the housing just being pressed into the sub..The idea was adding weight to the sub but also clamping the bearing housing at the same time..

[Dingdong]

That's sounds like a reasonable idea. I've always thought it would be a good idea to make replacement Thorens sub-platters. I'm sure they would make a big improvement. Something a bit more substantial would be nice.

I'm almost at the point were the next step would be to bin the tt and put the Hadcock and Shure onto something else. Not sure what yet. Maybe it's time to play with idler drives next year. I've always liked Gyro's as well. Then there is always that pig ugly monstrosity of a dd that everyone keeps banging on about. What's its name again?

[DSJR]

Look. The TD160 is still cheap and excellent value as the TD150 (mini-me LP12) is going up in value now because Lenco's are through the roof. With an arm like a Hadcock, you're not going to over-stress the sub-chassis unduly I feel.

My mate at work back then, jigged out some templates to fully damp the sub-chassis and outer platter with sound-deadening panels. His efforts were superb and far better than other attempts, including the basic stamped out panelling of the 160 Super. We were able to charge a modest fee for this work, but in all honesty, there was little in it sonically. The next step was a wooden sub-sub-chassis, which was a tight fit around the bearing housing, made even more so by bolting it (with around five or six bolts) and epoxy glueing it in place. This "beam" went out to the arm end, where it was bolted and glued there, the final part acting as a platform to accept the tonearm mount, another wooden piece. Now this upgrade ("designed" by Robin Marshall no less while he was still at Audiomaster) did make for an improvement at the time, but the price suffered a bit and the few Rega 3/R200's we traded in against LP12's were still embarassing to the TD160, whatever form it took.

Be warned, any excessive modding to the basic deck will all but destroy its value. keep it pretty original, GET A PROPER THORENS BELT!!!, put it in a nice Russ Collinson plinth (beautifully made and available for £160 or so on ebay), set it up properly with original bits set correctly, use some viscous (gear, not engine) oil in the main bearing (EP80 is so cheap and works well, although there are designer lubes around now claiming all sorts) and you'll have an endearing old deck that should see you out. By the way, the mat on TD160's and most 125's is awful and easily bettered IMO. The old multi-rib TD124 style mat is better to my ears and the 160 Super heavy rubber mat was ideal I remember. These sometimes come up if you're lucky. I haven't yet tried one of my cork ones, but a "rubberised" cork mat may be ok, if a little "bright" in balance - possibly....

[Dingdong]

Got the new belt. Got the Blue Horizon mat. Got a nice record clamp. Even got the motor noise right down with a psu.
As I was saying it might be time next to just get something else. I've always fancied a Gyro. Pretty, pretty thing.

[vinylspinner]

401 my boy, 401:lol:

In one of my slate plinths of course!!

Nigel

[Dingdong]

I have thought about that. Was going to ask you about it. Haven't you got a 401 knocking about cheap somewhere?
Your old DM2's are bloody lovely. Big old lumps, but they do produce a very pleasing sound.

[vinylspinner]

Hi Mark,

I have several, but not going cheap, have you anything to barter with?

Also letting go of my last set of DM2 speakers, interested?

Nigel

[Dingdong]

sent you a pm.

[DSJR]

Sounds like some good ideas brewing there :lol:

[Rare Bird]

Noce old 401's.. i can only spare £16 tho :)

[stewartwen]

www.theanalogdept.com
This is the place for all of your questions regarding Thorens T/Ts
S

[Dingdong]

Noce old 401's.. i can only spare £16 tho :)


I've got a Garrard you can have for £16. Very nice turntable with a lovely wooden arm. Would suit you down to the ground.

[DSJR]

Which one is that? I'm looking for a Lab 80 headshell...

[Dingdong]

I might be able to help you out. What's it worth;)