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View Full Version : Album Club: 04.10.2011: Emerson, Lake & Palmer - Brain Salad Surgery (1973) (SHM-CD)



Rare Bird
04-10-2011, 12:40
Here's my first offering then, pretty much obvious that i was going to choose this one. :eyebrows:

'Brain Salad Surgery' was ELP's fourth studio album..recorded June - September 1973...Released on the 19th November 1973..Charted at No.2 in the UK.

An important move for the band at this point. The album was extremely advanced for it's time, absolutly top notch musicianship in every respect.

The BSS world tour to promote the album was of epic proportion with excess of 35 tons of equipment, and a proper quadraphonic sound system, they were the bees Knees for sure. This was ELP at their very very best.

To showcase this live tour you can't go far wrong giving the triple 'Welcome Back My Friends to the Show That Never Ends' a blast.

The album artwork is a talking point alone, a truly amazing piece of artwork commissioned from Swizz surrealist painter, sculptor, H.R.Giger, it was a perfect choice that would accompany the atmosphere of the album extremely well.. it has to be the greatest ever record sleeve imho

The album! well listern for yourself.

http://open.spotify.com/album/5usAkZunm7reU2vik0SFSG

Tim
04-10-2011, 12:43
:lolsign:

Well that was a surprise fella ;)
I shall spin it tonight whilst nursing my foot following an ingrowing toenail op, which is happening imminently :(

John
04-10-2011, 13:10
I have a listen tommorow, working late tonight so unable to listen to it

WAD62
04-10-2011, 13:15
Got this on vinyl Andre, will give it a fresh spin tonight, by far my favourite ELP offering...It's been a long time since I played it so we'll see how it's stood up to the decades, hopefully better than the vinyl itself ;)

Bazil
04-10-2011, 13:31
ELP were my "first grown" up group after growing up with The Beatles et al.
Always loved the hymn Jerusalem at school couldn't believe it when my then fav group did it.
Haven't played BSS in years looking forward to this, great choice of album.

Audioman
04-10-2011, 14:05
Ah the band responsible for the ultimate in prog excess along with Wakeman. Never a great fan but fine musicians. Listening to some tracks on Spotify. I've ordered new CD remaster of Amazon rather than pay more for knackered ebay vinyl. The new vinyl (digital source ?) is way too pricey.

Spectral Morn
04-10-2011, 14:40
Always preferred the first ELP album but I have this on vinyl and CD (as I do most of the other albums) so I will have a listen again.

This should be really interesting. Must apologise for not taking part in these threads before but I have been time poor recently. I will try to do so and maybe even for next time (next group) make my own suggestion.


Regards D S D L

MartinT
04-10-2011, 14:57
Brain Salad Surgery is my favourite ELP album and one of my all-time greats. Listening to it again is going to be no hardship at all. Great choice, Andr'e :)

Bazil
04-10-2011, 17:55
Now I've played it I realise it's something like 30 years since I last heard it.
Fantastic album, all sorts going on deffo 5/5.

DSJR
04-10-2011, 19:03
Tis good methinks, but trilogy is my favourite..

Always worth a spin for Benny the Bouncer :lol: :D

Tim
04-10-2011, 19:28
Well I have no need to dally over this one, played it once earlier and just about to play it again as I have two copies - the original Atlantic CD and a remaster as well. As André will know, the BSS tour was also the first concert I went too and recently bagged a ticket on eBay (lost mine somewhere :scratch:)

I bought this on vinyl when it was released as they were my favourite band at the time and I was in awe of the artwork, as well as (most of) the album. I love it all apart from BTB, which I never really got in 1973 and still don't now - it just doesn't work for me. However, Karn Evil 9 was a ground breaking piece of music, way ahead of it's time as were a lot of ELP's work. I shudder when some people write them off with other prog bands, as ELP were so different and IMO should NEVER be compared to Rick Wakeman! Still... You Turn Me On remains one of my all time favourite tracks as does Lucky Man and TBH I play the first album more than anything these days, so it was great to get this out again. In fact I am toying with ordering the vinyl again just to get the artwork :)

No brainier for me, a firm http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/greatgig/5-stars.png


http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/greatgig/elp1.jpg

£2.20 :stalks:

MartinT
04-10-2011, 21:26
I played it again just to remind myself what a towering achievement it was, possibly only matched by Tarkus in their output (I won't count Welcome Back... as that is a live album). The thing is, like all the best music, I keep getting more out of it. More recently, I've really appreciated KE9 2nd Impression, which could so easily form the basis of a piano concerto. Like Tim, I feel that BTB is out of place and wonder why they didn't put BSS on it :scratch:

A wonderful album, as progressive as they come and great because of it. 5 stars.

Alex_UK
04-10-2011, 21:32
Superb choice Andre - and an album I only discovered a couple of years ago because of you, so thanks for that. :) Have to confess that I love Fanfare for the Common Man which would have to be my favourite ELP track, but overall this is such a stonking album... I will give it a fresh "Album Club Ears" listen as soon as I can, and then score it accordingly - but thanks in the meantime for your selection. :)

Welder
04-10-2011, 22:01
Good choice Andre, even for a pop loving peasant like myself ;)
I’m not an ELP fan I have to admit. I like some prog but not the more common stuff.

Anyway, I have this and Tarkus on CD and I’ve given both a play today.
The CD is the re-mastered version with the bonus tracks.

Good things; Greg Lake and Carl Palmer. Bad thing, Keith Emerson.
My favorite tracks must be When Apple Blossom etc etc and Karn Evil 2nd.
I prefer Tarkus overall but I’ll probably give this another play over the next few days.
I had hoped you were going to go Gong and I could have given loads of fives but ELP is just a 3 for me.

griffo104
04-10-2011, 22:33
quite looking forward to trying this out. I really have no clue about these except for the doc on beeb4.

Rare Bird
04-10-2011, 23:23
My favorite tracks must be When Apple Blossom etc etc and Karn Evil 2nd.
I prefer Tarkus overall but I’ll probably give this another play over the next few days.
I had hoped you were going to go Gong and I could have given loads of fives but ELP is just a 3 for me.

Can i just stress that the album in question consists of the below:

1. Jerusalem
2. Toccata
3. Still... You Turn Me On
4. Benny The Bouncer
5. Karn Evil 9 (1st Impression - Part 1)
6. Karn Evil 9 (1st Impression - Part 2)
7. Karn Evil 9 (2nd Impression)
8. Karn Evil 9 (3rd Impression)

......................

Bonus Tracks:

''Brain Salad Surgery'' (Was an A Side single) Never appeared on the album but later appeared on the 1977 album 'Works Vol.2'

''When the Apple Blossoms Bloom in the Windmills of Your Mind, I'll Be Your Valentine'' (Was the B Side to the ''Jerusalem'' single) ''WTABBITWOYM'' again appeared on the 'Works Vol.2' album

''Excerpts from Brain Salad Surgery'' : This was a flexi Disc offered in conjunction with New Musical Express, the flexi included the single ''Brain Salad Surgery'' but also included excerpts from the album as the title says..

Tim
05-10-2011, 08:15
Ah, the NME flexi-disc.... whatever happened to mine :scratch:

aquapiranha
05-10-2011, 09:31
Brilliant album Andre, if not surprising as your choice. Musicians at the pinnacle of their prowess, with a stage show to match! I really like ELP, and remember watching a documentary that followed them on tour, might be available on youtube?

WAD62
05-10-2011, 16:50
Well despite my old album looking a bit worse for wear it still sounds pretty good, sound quality wise.

Now for the content...

I've got a couple of problems with listening to ELP in 2011, Carl Palmer's robotic drumming (more concerned with speed than rhythm), and Greg Lake's vocals, both content and delivery...he reminds me of someone singing in an early 70s rock opera, and as for his appalling mockney accent in 'Benny the bouncer' the less said the better.

Jerusalem works well, as does toccata, Karn Evil 9 (1st Impression - Part 1), Karn Evil 9 (1st Impression - Part 2), and Karn Evil 9 (2nd Impression)

But the rest do nothing for me, 'Benny the bouncer' & 'Still, you turn me on' being particularly cringe-worthy.

At times I was reminded of that famous John Peel quote that 'ELP are a waste of talent and electricity', perhaps a little harsh from uncle John. On balance, and given that it was an adventurous album for '73 I'll go for a 3, Emerson's keyboards in the better passages are worth that alone.

:)

lurcher
05-10-2011, 17:10
I have had a listen, and despite the clear quality of the playing I have a couple of reservations that means its somewhere between a two and three for me. There seems to be a lack of dynamic in the playing. Its seems to be either loud and fast, or louder and faster. Compaired to similar period King Crimson who were masters of playing very very loud and fast and then very very quiet, and playing off the contract between the two. ELP doesn't pull me into the music as say Larks Tongues. The other area I have a problem with is the rhythmic feel of it all, it is very "upright" maybe showing its european classical roots, no one seems to play against the beat. But again thats down to my preference for blues based playing instead of string quartet. I guess I am saying its got no soul.

Just my 2d anyhow.

Rare Bird
05-10-2011, 19:13
Would it suprise you lot if i admitted that i no longer own an issue of 'BSS' & don't plan in doing so

Tim
05-10-2011, 19:16
Would it suprise you lot if i admitted that i no longer own an issue of 'BSS' & don't pan in doing so
Not anymore André, I used to be constantly surprised by you, but now I always expect the unexpected ;)

But that's funny :lol:

MartinT
05-10-2011, 19:17
Would it suprise you lot if i admitted that i no longer own an issue of 'BSS' & don't pan in doing so

Ok, Tim wouldn't bite so I will. Why?

Audioman
05-10-2011, 19:25
Would it suprise you lot if i admitted that i no longer own an issue of 'BSS' & don't pan in doing so

So why the fook did you put it forward and persuade me and others to aquire it ? :mental: You can't think it's that good yourself or is this a practical joke. :doh:

Anyhow it's on order and listening to bits on spotify persuaded me to give it a go. Some truth in John Peel's view as I was listening to KC's Red today on DVDA and it's much more musicaly varied while a lot is still loud.

Spectral Morn
05-10-2011, 19:54
Going to have a listen now. The release I am listening to is the Sanctuary records one.



Regards D S D L

Reid Malenfant
05-10-2011, 21:01
Just listened to all of this from Spotify, i'll probably give a more accurate opinion tomorrow, so i'll do it then ;)

Kind of reminds me of Gong as John mentioned, but none of the chilled atmosphere. I can see the similarities, but there are more differences :scratch:

Spectral Morn
05-10-2011, 21:31
Ok finished.

Well my feelings have not changed re this album.

Jerusalem - Love this track great version of a classic Hymn all-be-it it is errant rubbish as Jesus never walked English soil and England is not the New Jerusalem, replacement theology there.....Sorry imho. Despite the annoyance I have with the lyrics (not ELPs fault) this is like Fanfare For the Common Man a wonderful example of Classical meets rock, electronica, prog.

Toccata - This track is trying way too hard to be clever and leaves me cold.

Still you turn Me on - Love this track one of my faves on this album.

Benny the Bouncer - Hate this and all the similar tracks they did. Chas and Dave styled rubbish yuck.....

Karn Evil 9 - Tour De force of light and shade. One of the best things ELP ever did imho.

The CD I have has the extra tracks Brain Salad Surgery - Not up too much and it was imho the right thing to leave it off the album. However if it was a toss up between Benny and this then I would rather have BSS.

When the apple blossom etc etc - Nice track.

I will give this a 4 out of 5 as despite the naff tracks (imho) the good ones shine forth as being excellent. For me ELP have always been a mixed bag of the good the bad and the plain silly (I.e Benny The Bouncer) The only album of theirs that ticks all the boxes for me is their first self titled album; which is near perfection.

This album was bought from Fopp and was one of their £5 specials. Tonight was the first time I had listened to it. Sound quality ok bit compressed and loud + sounds a tad phasee at times. Now listening to ELP -ELP


Regards D S D L

Beechwoods
05-10-2011, 22:02
I've never listened to this before. I have a couple of other ELP albums, their first, and Tarkus.

This reminds me of Egg. I particularly like the longer tracks... and the originals. I love Jerusalem, but don't like how it's done here, it just doesn't thunder like Jerusalem should.

I don't really want to rate it, because there are bits that score a major 5 and bits that struggle for a 3 (the shorter tracks). There are other prog albums I like better, but I'm pleased to have been introduced to this one, as there are bits (Toccata, Karn Evil) that I will be listening to a lot... If it weren't for the throwaway tracks this would be a four... but I can understand why people who really get ELP would forgive the indiscretions... after all 'Meddle' is still a great album despite 'Pillow Of Winds', 'Fearless' and 'Seamus'!

Rare Bird
05-10-2011, 22:30
Ok, Tim wouldn't bite so I will. Why?

You'd never understand i am a complex character :)

The Grand Wazoo
05-10-2011, 23:52
Oh God - Brain Salad Surgery!

Bombastic? - yes! Pretentious? - well, yes. Pompous? - yes indeed!
But it's also complicated, dramatic, intelligent, eclectic and rather glorious in places.

When I was a kid I used to have a copy of the sleeve of this album stuck to my bedroom wall even before I'd heard it. The sleeve came from a box of promotional stuff scrounged from the local Redifusion shop, which apart from selling tellies and (sort of) hi-fi's, stocked a few records. I loved the artwork and it made me want to hear the record. I got the album and loved it. After BSS, I got Tarkus & all the others and played most of them to death.

My tastes evolved and I grew to like other sorts of music, moving away from what I realise now was pretty narrow and shallow in scope - basically only heavy rock and a bit of stuff like this, King Crimson, Yes etc. I eventually realised that it was OK to like things that my mates might not like, so I started exploring blues & folk, jazz and all the other stuff that I like now.

The other sleeve on my bedroom wall was 'Workingman's Dead'. It was years before I heard the Dead album all the way through and it's interesting really, because those two sleeves could represent my musical evolution - I kind of prefer the dusty and frayed human touch of stuff like Workingman's Dead to the more calculated feel of Brain Salad Surgery. When it comes down to it, I'll take a guitar over a Hammond every single time!

I haven't listened to this all the way through for years but I've played it twice now this week - & it's on again now. Isn't the musical memory a fantastic thing? - I still know it inside out. There's no doubt it was an important album with a fine display of musical talent & I suppose everyone who's interested in any sort of music should maybe listen to it at least once. Apart from that, it's easy to see how music like this could generate a negative reaction - it ain't Louie Louie, that's for sure!

A few years ago I had a clear-out of lots of records and I got rid of all of my ELP recordings except for Tarkus, which remains my favourite.
To quote from that album:

" 'am or cheese? "
Well, to me, BSS is ham & Tarkus is cheese!

It's nice to hear it again once in a while and I enjoyed it this week, but I won't be actively seeking out another copy. If one falls in my lap for a bargain price, I might buy it though!

Thing Fish
05-10-2011, 23:57
Can't say I really enjoyed it that much. But hey ho I wasn't ill.

Vinyleyes
06-10-2011, 05:04
At the time of this album I had stopped listening to ELP after "Pictures" .. and listening again to this album I am reminded exactly why. I know some of the lyrics going round the Prog circuit at that time were pretty whimsical but here ELP's efforts do hit the bottom of the barrel for me. When the best track on the album is a rehash of an old hymn with words from an obscure poem .. and in Wikepedia there is more comment on the albums artwork than anything else .. it kinda sums things up.

This album is a perfect example of another man's meat is another man's poison ... I could not imagine listening to this ever again ... there is nothing there for me .. no melody, atmosphere, coherance. The vocals are weak and sterile ..... nothing to tingle the spine at all ....... it's a Lone star from me I'm afraid. :(

MartinT
06-10-2011, 05:21
but I can understand why people who really get ELP would forgive the indiscretions... after all 'Meddle' is still a great album despite 'Pillow Of Winds', 'Fearless' and 'Seamus'!

My feelings too, and I usually take the album off before these tracks. Benny the Bouncer is just out of place on BSS but I ignored it when giving my rating.

MartinT
06-10-2011, 05:27
You'd never understand i am a complex character :)

I think I understand partially, there was a large change in recorded quality around the mid seventies that heralded the switching of studios to harsher recording equipment and the abandonment of a good balance in favour of one that would sound good on a transistor radio.

It happened in classical music too, to a lesser extent. Some of DG's recordings in the late seventies are just awful sounding.

I try as much as possible to ignore this and listen to the music, but occasionally it grates.

Audioman
06-10-2011, 15:41
Have listened to the Album on CD format -Sony Legacy with the Bonus tracks.

Like Jerusalem done properly but for some reason this looses it's impact by being recorded in a bathroom.

Toccata - nothing special realy.

Still..You Turn Me On - Excellent. Something Greg Lake might have done if he had stayed with King Crimson.

Benny The Bouncer - Totaly out of place here. The Mockney singing shows Chas and Dave to be genuises. Should have been dumped for the bonus track 'When The Apple Blossoms Bloom etc'

Karn Evil - Epic piece which is great in places and boring in others. Unfortunately goes on too long especialy the 3rd impression part.

Recording quality is pretty good on this remaster except when they resort to excessive echo/reverb. Of course these are great musicians but by this album everything was getting overblown with a lack of outside QC re track selection and mixes. Difficult to believe they spent 18 months to record this as the sleeve notes claim.

The story behind the sleeve get's quite an airing in the notes but for some reason no attempt to repro the unacceptable version as per XTC did for Skylarking. Bill Clinton's favourite prog album ! ;)

Interesting listen if not great. For the good parts including bonus material 3 out of 5.

Bazil
08-10-2011, 18:22
My feelings too, and I usually take the album off before these tracks. Benny the Bouncer is just out of place on BSS but I ignored it when giving my rating.

Same as I did.

Rare Bird
08-10-2011, 20:37
Quite an intresting outcome..:D

MartinT
08-10-2011, 21:35
Quite an intresting outcome..:D

It is actually, it got more 5-stars than I expected. Clearly ELP are not everyone's cup of tea.

Rare Bird
08-10-2011, 21:36
nor mine

keiths
09-10-2011, 13:35
Whereas I quite like ELP - the excellent 'Trilogy' gets played often, 'ELP' and 'Tarkus' fairly regularly, I've never really enjoyed this album much. I've re-listened to it a couple of times over the last week and nothing I've heard has changed my opinion.

Just 2 stars from me.

SCIDB
13-10-2011, 19:21
Hi,

I have a copy of this album knocking around so I gave it a spin.

From this, I can see why people don't like prog rock. It didn't do much for me. At times, it sounded like self indulgent tomfoolery, at other time bloody awful.

Nice sleeve.

Rare Bird
29-10-2011, 16:16
Not a bad result at the end of the day.

Rare Bird
24-11-2011, 09:33
I just thought i'd address a few issues with the three tracks that some people arnt too chuffed about:

Trk 01: Jerusalem
You can hardly pull the band down for this, it's basically a simple adaption of the great hymn (that everyone loves) with a touch of William Blake chucked in for good measure.. At least if your not too keen on the hymn itself, focus your attention to Carl Palmers absolutly superb drumming skills, no other drummer had a patch on Carl at that time, he was well good imho.

Trk 02: Toccata
Why on earth people do not appreciate this is beyond me! ''Leaves me cold''?? (sorry Neil, i dont agree, leaves you astounded more like) It's an absolutly brilliant adaption of Alberto Ginastera's 'Piano Concerto No.1, 4th Movement..Fantastic

Trk 04: Benny The Bouncer
Cumon' fellas for crying out aloud...I think ''BTB'' was quite effective at least in dividing the first half of the album from 'KE9', clears the slate if you like.You see ''Karnevil9'' has a basic story in three parts 1st-3rd Impressions, a story of the begining of the world through to the future with computers & things trying to take over etc etc, (i think you get the idea)..

'Brain Salad Surgery' will go down in history as one of the greatest ever Prog rock albums of all time..

:cool:

'The tapes have recorded their names'

MartinT
24-11-2011, 10:58
Can't argue with you there, Andr'e.

Stratmangler
25-11-2011, 01:09
I just thought i'd address a few issues with the three tracks that some people arnt too chuffed about:

Trk 01: Jerusalem
You can hardly pull the band down for this, it's basically a simple adaption of the great hymn (that everyone loves) with a touch of William Blake chucked in for good measure.. At least if your not too keen on the hymn itself, focus your attention to Carl Palmers absolutly superb drumming skills, no other drummer had a patch on Carl at that time, he was well good imho.

Trk 02: Toccata
Why on earth people do not appreciate this is beyond me! ''Leaves me cold''?? (sorry Neil, i dont agree, leaves you astounded more like) It's an absolutly brilliant adaption of Alberto Ginastera's 'Piano Concerto No.1, 4th Movement..Fantastic

Trk 04: Benny The Bouncer
Cumon' fellas for crying out aloud...I think ''BTB'' was quite effective at least in dividing the first half of the album from 'KE9', clears the slate if you like.You see ''Karnevil9'' has a basic story in three parts 1st-3rd Impressions, a story of the begining of the world through to the future with computers & things trying to take over etc etc, (i think you get the idea)..

'Brain Salad Surgery' will go down in history as one of the greatest ever Prog rock albums of all time..

:cool:

'The tapes have recorded their names'

By and large I'm with you on this one Andre.
My thoughts on the album - the title of the third track is "Still, You Turn Me On", and this album still does it for me.

Roy S
25-11-2011, 01:12
Well I like it

Werner Berghofer
25-11-2011, 21:55
Compare this to any shit & i mean shit today

I think that’s a matter of personal taste. I could easily name at least three releases from 2011 which I certainly like much more than the complete œvre of Emerson, Lake and Palmer.

Werner.