To Tighten or Not to Tighten - that is the question

[CableMaker1]

I was once told to not tighten the tonearm plate to the turntable. I never undertood this since when it comes to our equipment, we want to make sure a solid connection is made. Is there any reason behind this? Could the reason be that vibrations from the turntable may make its way to the tonearm plate then through the tonearm? If so, how about adding a type of vibraion damper from the base to the plate to protect the tonearm?

I currently have the tonearm plate tightened to the turntable as I would with a chassis cover tightened to the chassis.

Mike

[Stratmangler]

I thought that the SME arms came with rubber washers to provide a lossy coupling :scratch:

[CableMaker1]

I have two SME arms. But there are no washers that I recall that came with either arm. The tightening I am talking about is from the base plate to the TT.

There is also the tonearm to the base plate clamping, but to save any possible confusion - this is not what I am talking about.

[Stratmangler]

I have a 3009, and it has rubber washers fitted between the carriage and the armboard.

[CableMaker1]

Ahh, OK. I have a 309 and V. When did you get your 3009? Just out of curiosity, did you ever have a contest between your 3009 vs. the 309, IV, or V? If so, what were your impressions?

[WOStantonCS100]

Correct me if I'm wrong; but, the stock arm uses clear damping material around the three leg posts of it's arm board as well as a few bits of some material around the sides of the arm board, in between the arm board and the chassis. When swapping in another arm and tonearm, those bits usually get lost or discarded. I've seen some folks line the entire lip of the chassis where an aftermarket arm board bolts in. I'd feel more comfortable with that approach rather than leaving the arm board "loose", leaving open the possibility for "chatter" between the arm board and the chassis. If the arm board is free to "micro" move, it will compromise alignment/VTA/VTF/anti-skate, will it not? At the right frequency and/or under the right conditions (volume) you might even have the bolts and the whole thing singing/playing music of it's own. :(

[YNWaN]

The old 3009 came with rubber grommets that decoupled the arm from the armboard (to an extent) - intended to reduce the transference of rumble from idler designs. A popular and easy tweak was to remove these. None of SME's current arms come with these grommets.

[Stratmangler]

Ahh, OK. I have a 309 and V. When did you get your 3009? Just out of curiosity, did you ever have a contest between your 3009 vs. the 309, IV, or V? If so, what were your impressions?

The 3009 is fitted to a Thorens TD125 MkII that came my way around 5 years ago.
I've never had a IV or V to compare it to.

[Welder]

While this isn’t the particular bit the OP was interested in I wondered if anyone else used these to mount their SME arms to the arm board given conventional wisdom was the 3009 and Series 3 sounded better without the rubber grommets?

http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/4401d03e2bd8976bcd810821e752c934e529d319407163429a ab67d54d60c1892g.jpg (http://www.mediafire.com/imageview.php?quickkey=ezbgxb4i5uhywhl&thumb=5)

I believe these were ceramic. I have not seen them mentioned before.

[worrasf]

I was once told to not tighten the tonearm plate to the turntable.
Mike

My understanding is that it is the interface between the arm pillar and the armboard rather than the arm board to deck that's critical - certainly that's my experience. Origin Live are very clear that the arm mounting nut should only be done finger tight and my experince with the Jelco and Shuggie's arm solar is that the grub screw just needs to be nipped up - if it's even slightly over tight the dynamics go to pot.

Steve

[chris@panteg]

My understanding is that it is the interface between the arm pillar and the armboard rather than the arm board to deck that's critical - certainly that's my experience. Origin Live are very clear that the arm mounting nut should only be done finger tight and my experince with the Jelco and Shuggie's arm solar is that the grub screw just needs to be nipped up - if it's even slightly over tight the dynamics go to pot.

Steve

If this is true , it could explain why my deck (when i last heard it) sounded dead and lifeless with Zero dynamics .

You see i nipped up my SME sled nuts fairly tightly :doh: could it really be the reason ?

[Stratmangler]

If this is true , it could explain why my deck (when i last heard it) sounded dead and lifeless with Zero dynamics .

You see i nipped up my SME sled nuts fairly tightly :doh: could it really be the reason ?

Over tightened nuts can be the cause of considerable discomfort :eyebrows:

[chris@panteg]

Over tightened nuts can be the cause of considerable discomfort :eyebrows:

Hi Chris

Yes thats very true :) One feels the urgent need to relieve the strain :eyebrows:

[CableMaker1]

Chris -

Nice pics of Westchester NY in the other thread. I bet all those places are now underwater.

Mike

[CableMaker1]

Correct me if I'm wrong; but, the stock arm uses clear damping material around the three leg posts of it's arm board as well as a few bits of some material around the sides of the arm board, in between the arm board and the chassis. When swapping in another arm and tonearm, those bits usually get lost or discarded. I've seen some folks line the entire lip of the chassis where an aftermarket arm board bolts in. I'd feel more comfortable with that approach rather than leaving the arm board "loose", leaving open the possibility for "chatter" between the arm board and the chassis. If the arm board is free to "micro" move, it will compromise alignment/VTA/VTF/anti-skate, will it not? At the right frequency and/or under the right conditions (volume) you might even have the bolts and the whole thing singing/playing music of it's own. :(


I would agree with this, which is why I prefer to have my connections tightened.

[DSJR]

The old Techie of mine has a thin "shaped" washer between deck plate and armboard..

I seem to remember that one reason Rega arms (for instance) could sound less than perfect on a Techie was the "closed loop" kind of solid mounting - possibly, with everything tightened up. At least 309's etc have a slinging pillar to partially break this - probably typing a load of bollix here, but that's how I understood it.

So I suppose the answer is not to over tighten anything. Maybe some thin nylon washers between the arm plate fixing screws and top plate (as mine has) may help?

[WOStantonCS100]

The old Techie of mine has a thin "shaped" washer between deck plate and armboard..

I seem to remember seeing those as well... easy to lose buggers if one isn't careful.