View Full Version : A bit sad, somehow ...
jandl100
29-08-2011, 10:19
I just noticed this exchange on an AOS thread ...
Where's Richard from NVA when you need him. Is he banned again?
Yes, and unfortunately this time, permanently.
Marco.
Damn. :(
Richard and I usually got on like a house on fire (screams, people running for cover, approaching sound of sirens ... :eyebrows:) but I find myself saddened that he's somehow fluffed yet another chance to get back into the mainstream of hifi fora, which so strongly epitomize his longstanding hopes for the future of the hifi industry.
I missed the break-up event(s) on AOS, but Top Marks to Marco for undoubtedly giving it his best shot. :thumbsup:
Yes it is a shame I find his outlook to be similar to my own and not just with regard to hi-fi. I guess he is too stubborn a personality to ever be able to adapt to someone elses' rules. Not a criticism just an observation.
Let's watch this one guys... So far, the contributions have been polite and respectful, but as Richard has no longer any right of reply, I won't allow him to be slagged off.
Thanks for your kind remarks, Jerry.
So I'll let this one run for a bit, guys, to allow anyone who wishes to say something positive have their say, and then close it :)
Marco.
StanleyB
29-08-2011, 11:02
That reminds me that I haven't seen Steve Toy lately either :scratch:.
Lol - you're a naughty man, Stan! :eyebrows:
Marco.
Rare Bird
29-08-2011, 11:09
Hey there's no one as bad as me, especially where music is concerned nevermind Hi-Fi. I'm personally more than happy to bulldoze any friends & family that say to the contrary of what i believe in.
You may say it's only Hi-Fi or Music but when they are a massive part of your life it becomes a very personal thing. Regarding music: i can't stand people that know nothing about nor have absolutly no taste in it, hence i will always go off on one, if it ends in a ban so be it.
Hey there's no one as bad as me, especially where music is concerned nevermind Hi-Fi. I'm personally more than happy to bulldoze any friends & family that say to the contrary of what i believe in.
You may say it's only Hi-Fi or Music but when they are a massive part of your life it becomes a very personal thing. Regarding music: i can't stand people that know nothing about nor have absolutly no taste in it, hence i will always go off on one, if it ends in a ban so be it.
Interesting and honest thoughts there, dude, even though I don't share your mindset on those particular matters. Regarding bans, you should know by now that on AoS you're understood and accepted for who you are, so unless you *really* lose it, a ban is unlikely :)
Regarding Richard, all I will say is that it became blatantly obvious that as him and I have such strong (and often conflicting) personalities, there was simply no way that we could co-exist harmoniously on the same forum, in the long-term.
Having said that, I have no animosity towards him whatsoever (despite what he writes negatively about AoS and me on his site). It's water off of a duck's back. And so these days I rise above it, as indeed I must, given my position now and the responsibilities I have here. At some point I would still like to visit Richard's place for a sesh (I'm sure I'd still be welcome), and/or shake his hand if we meet again at Scalford Hall.
Life's simply too short to hold grudges, but at the end of the day, I will always do what I consider is in the best interests of AoS and its valued members, even if that means making some (difficult) decisions and personal sacrifices, no matter how much people may stamp their feet in protest. It's the way it has to be.
Marco.
Interesting and honest thoughts there, dude, even though I don't share your mindset on those particular matters. Regarding bans, you should know by now that on AoS you're understood and accepted for who you are, so unless you *really* lose it, a ban is unlikely :)
Regarding Richard, all I will say is that it became blatantly obvious that as him and I have such strong (and often conflicting) personalities, there was simply no way that we could co-exist harmoniously on the same forum, in the long-term.
Having said that, I have no animosity towards him whatsoever (despite what he writes negatively about AoS and me on his site). It's water off a duck's back, and so these days I rise above it, as indeed I must, given my position now and what I have here. At some point I would still like to visit Richard's place for a sesh (I'm sure I'd still be welcome), and/or shake his hand if we meet again at Scalford Hall.
Life's simply too short to hold grudges, but at the end of the day, I will always do what I consider is in the best interests of AoS and its valued members, even if that means making some (difficult) decisions and personal sacrifices, and no matter how much people may stamp their feet in protest. It's the way it has to be.
Marco.
Marco,you are a hell of a good man!
Having said that, I have no animosity towards him whatsoever (despite what he writes negatively about AoS and me on his site).
Marco.
Interstingly I was checking out his site last night and he was defending AoS against one of his contributors who had described it as 'scummy'...
I’m also a bit sad to read that Richard will no longer be contributing.
I hope all goes well for you Richard :)
I found Richard in person really decent I miss the fact the he makes me thinks deeper about equipment and sound
Interstingly I was checking out his site last night and he was defending AoS against one of his contributors who had described it as 'scummy'...
Oh he does, sometimes, and then at other times, goes off on one. At the end of the day, he's entitled to his opinion, but it shows that the time he spent here (and the chats we had on the phone) had some lasting positive effect, which can only be a good thing :)
Jeff, thanks for your kind remarks!
Marco.
I first met Richard way back in the early 80's and he was a pretty headstrong character even then, with some unique and innovative ideas about the build of hi-fi components. Nothing wrong with that at all as it is people just like him that are able to think outside of the box and hence we get technological advances.
However, there are times when it is better to hold your peace in the short term to become victorious in the long term (something I learned long ago on fora) and in my opinion Richard hadn't quite got that aspect of his character off to a fine art, hence the perception that he was being a tad abrasive. However, the fame he as acquired on other forums does rather precede his arrival and the only one to remedy that is the man himself.
Regarding music: i can't stand people that know nothing about nor have absolutly no taste in it, hence i will always go off on one, if it ends in a ban so be it.
I'm with you on people who dislike music, Andr'e. Mind you, we can't all be prog experts :)
Werner Berghofer
29-08-2011, 14:52
Andre,
i can't stand people that know nothing about
in your opinion, how much does one have to know about music to be able to listen to it?
Werner.
I had noticed Richard's absence from the Forum and did wonder if he had been banned. In fact I was thinking of asking Marco if this was true when today I read these posts.
I have to confess I found Richard's forum persona annoying and difficult to like. A shame, as I agreed with a lot of his opinions, yet was in complete disagreement with him on others. Clearly someone who carefully thought about certain aspects of audio design, but at times displayed blinkered vision; his comments certainly gave me cause for thought. He will be missed.
As to AoS being described as 'scummy' - what a peculiar adjective to use!
Regards
Andre,
in your opinion, how much does one have to know about music to be able to listen to it?
Werner.
Absolutely nothing. I remember enjoying music ata deep emotional level at the age of five.
Thing Fish
29-08-2011, 18:41
Who was Richard...?
We're talking Richard Dunn, I suppose ?
I've no souvenirs of him, to be honest.
As for Steve, it's another subject altogether, which cannot be publicly debated, it's the administrators' business and has been treated as such (I suppose).
Thing Fish
29-08-2011, 19:22
I mean what was his AOS name?
aquapiranha
29-08-2011, 19:23
I do not normally read Richard's forum but I just have. Good to see a previous member here, now banned having a go. I do hope his comments are aimed at me, spurs me on... :lol:
Rare Bird
29-08-2011, 19:23
Andre,
in your opinion, how much does one have to know about music to be able to listen to it?
Werner.
depends if it's commercial drivvel or specialist music
I mean what was his AOS name?
Dr Bunsen Honeydew.
Marco.
Thing Fish
29-08-2011, 19:48
Thanks Marco. I can take him off my ignore list now.
Thanks Marco. I can take him off my ignore list now.
:lol: you use an ignore list ? Incredible !
Ali Tait
29-08-2011, 19:59
There's an ignore function on the forum Dimitri. :)
There's an ignore function on the forum Dimitri. :)
I know, but. ... I mean... this forum is small !
I was simply surprised, not meant to judge or anything. ;)
I do not normally read Richard's forum but I just have. Good to see a previous member here, now banned having a go. I do hope his comments are aimed at me, spurs me on... :lol:
Indeed they were. He's an irrelevance, though, and being taken seriously only by people like Cawley, who obviously has an axe to grind, due to my exposing on AoS of his various 'misdemeanours'.
Best leave it there, though, mate :)
Marco.
aquapiranha
29-08-2011, 20:09
No problem Marco. BTW, you have until Friday... :lol:
Lol - I've always found ultimatums strangely attractive! ;)
Marco.
Werner Berghofer
29-08-2011, 20:35
Andre,
depends if it's commercial drivvel or specialist music
even “specialist music” needs to be produced and sold to be heard and recognized. No matter if specialist music or something else: if it’s not self explanatory on an emotional or intellectual level I think it’s a failure.
I believe music first needs to touch the heart or the soul. If a human being which is eager to learn is touched by music, then perhaps there’s an interest to learn and know more about music, to delevop knowledge. If an academic degree in art history is required before looking at paintings or sculptures something went terribly wrong.
Werner.
Rare Bird
29-08-2011, 21:00
Na mate thats rubbish :lolsign: Your on a totally different plane to me :D
Let's not forget that Mozart died alone, accompanied to the common grave by a dog...
Selling and quality music are two different things, even if they can meet, sometimes. ;)
Rare Bird
29-08-2011, 21:11
I'll give you a clue Werner, why do you think the albums i listern to fetch such outrageous amounts of money?
jandl100
29-08-2011, 21:27
:)
Let's not forget that Mozart died alone, accompanied to the common grave by a dog...
Selling and quality music are two different things, even if they can meet, sometimes. ;)
Here is a good example of that.
This artist had a tragic life,HATED by some people ,only managed to make 2 CD's but if you listen closely with a good pair of cans,a stiff drink in a darkened room (STUNNING)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4kdX2L5txQ&feature=related
FWIW I'm with Werner on this one - sorry Andr'e :( .
I know nothing about music, as many members on here will confirm ;) but I know what I like. I'm quite happy to swap music with people for stuff that I would not otherwise listen to, or even get the chance to listen to. Mostly it does not 'involve' me but ocassionally something 'touches' me and I look for more in the same vein..
It's a bit like art - you don't need to know anything about art to appreciate a beautiful painting or a beautiful photograph - something about it strikes an inner chord (no pun intended :) ) and you get great but quiet inner pleasure just looking at it.
I would just hate to be 'locked in' to any one single genre of music, no matter how varied it may be in sub-genres. I have stuff on my hard drive varying from Budhist and Gregorian Chants through crooners and 50s, 60s and 70s pop, electronica and classical and my favourite way of listening is on 'Random Track' mode - drives my wife mad BTW :lol: .
Just thought you all like to know that :lol: .
Dave.
I think many get as confused with André as he gets confused by us.... but at the end of the day we all like music, so that's a good thing isn't it?
I like it that we are all different, means I can keep learning (and spending).
:cool:
I think many get as confused with André as he gets confused by us.... but at the end of the day we all like music, so that's a good thing isn't it?
I like it that we are all different, means I can keep learning (and spending).
:cool:
+1
Well said Tim - that's what it's all about. :cool:
bogle111
30-08-2011, 00:57
To get back to topic, always found Mr Honeydews INPUT better than his OUTPUT, if you know what I mean.
I am surprised that none of the fora have a "Slammer" and a "Solitary", then an "Exiled". Two good strikes gets you out of the "Slammer", five gets you out of "Solitary", money (which really hurts) gets you out of "Exiled". Members could pay a quid to keep them in the Pokey and the offender would have to match or double what was spent to get out. Could raise revenue. Even a "Stocks", where rotten eggs and tomatoes could be thrown.
"Life is just one episode, nothing to really get worked up about, not like a whole series".
As for music, bit like the opposite sex IMO. You don't know till you try, though so many times you end up thinking, why did I bother. :eek: :scratch: Spent years trying to understand both, still none the wiser.
Still like different types of music depending on mood, which is what it is for. Have known people that would listen to particular types of music they didn't like, just to test their equipment - Boring - bit like calling Mario Lanza and Gigli opera singers - not in same league.
He was Briant at times and at other times,like a bad rash all over the forum.
But he always had a unique prospective.
Werner Berghofer
30-08-2011, 06:07
Andre,
Na mate thats rubbish
the letters IMHO would make that statement more friendly to read, in my humble opinion.
Werner.
Werner Berghofer
30-08-2011, 06:13
Dimitri,
Let's not forget that Mozart died alone, accompanied to the common grave by a dog...
yeah, but let’s also not forget that even during his lifetime Mozart and his music were very popular. He was invited to perform in front of reigning monarchs and the upper class of his era. He certainly was not the ingenious, outcast underdog composing the “Prog Rock” of his time which nobody understood or cared/dared to listen to ;-)
Werner.
Werner Berghofer
30-08-2011, 06:21
Dave,
I can take him off my ignore list now.
me too :-) Dr Bunsen Honeydew was the first name I put on this list, and it was the first time ever I used such thing like a forum’s ignore list.
Werner.
jandl100
30-08-2011, 06:25
I'll give you a clue Werner, why do you think the albums i listern to fetch such outrageous amounts of money?
Because your obsessed with high price tags rather than musical content? :lolsign:
Werner Berghofer
30-08-2011, 06:35
Andre,
why do you think the albums i listern to fetch such outrageous amounts of money?
don’t know, maybe because the music on these albums causes a lot of pain in the ears and minds of people?
Have a look at “Kind of Blue”, recorded in 1959 by Miles Davis and a group of excellent musicians. It dramatically changed the contemporary Jazz music of its era, but listening to it is still a source of pure joy, even for the un-initiated high priests of Jazz. “Kind of Blue” was a huge commercial success.
Werner.
Beechwoods
30-08-2011, 06:39
Can we all take a deep breath and allow the 'genre' wars come to an end. Pretty much everything on the forum, and in particular anything regarding the music we like, why we like it, and what it does for us, is implicitly followed by 'IMO' - it's all opinion, whether humble or not!
yeah, but let’s also not forget that even during his lifetime Mozart and his music were very popular. He was invited to perform in front of reigning monarchs and the upper class of his era. He certainly was not the ingenious, outcast underdog composing the “Prog Rock” of his time which nobody understood or cared/dared to listen to ;-)
Werner.
I beg to disagree. "Popularity" and "acceptance by the establishment" are two different things. I invite you to think of how much "popular music" Mozart's Requiem is: it has clearly nothing to do, has it ?
On the other hand, there are numerous "popular" (or well-sold, or "supergroups", as you like) groups of music amongst the Prog-Rock, as well as some acclaimed to be amongst the most influencial by critics : Pink Floyd, King Crimson, Yes, EL&P, Soft Machine... the list is quite impressive.
Just go to AMG and have a look under the Prog/Concept/Art Rock legend, we're far from the "unknown artist club".
I repeat myself, but popularity (including critics acknowledgement) and quality are two different notions, imho.
Music, like most art can only be judged objectively much later than when it actually happens. ANd people who are specialized in one style (like Andre or others) are very precious in understanding the subtle differences inside this style. Which doesn't exclude personal taste, quite the contrary, even. ;)
Werner Berghofer
30-08-2011, 08:04
Dimitri,
Music, like most art can only be judged objectively much later than when it actually happens.
I certainly doubt that anything – regardless if art or something else – can be judged objectively by humans.
ANd people who are specialized in one style (like Andre or others) are very precious in understanding the subtle differences inside this style.
There’s a difference in being specialized in one style and in boldly stating that any music which has been created after a certain year or era is just crap and bullshit.
Werner.
any music which has been created after a certain year or era is just crap and bullshit.
Certainly Andre is talking about Prog, not about "any music", I guess. I doubt he has listened to all the Funk, for instance.
You (as well as me) are welcome to disagree with his statement, I suppose.
But, for Prog, we have to bring solid arguments. ;) (I tried, personally to do so, in the past, but, making a retrospective of my own Prog, I found very few exceptions to his statements, so....)
Richard had strong opinions and he put time and effort into the forum. He was passionate without appearing 'smart' I thought. I guess like so many passionate, talented people he could also come across as not quite 'right'.
I recognise he must have been a nightmare to moderate. It was pretty obvious he pushed the wrong buttons on Marco and it could never have lasted..... Ah! it was a fiery bromance from the start!
Richard had strong opinions and he put time and effort into the forum. He was passionate without appearing 'smart' I thought. I guess like so many passionate, talented people he could also come across as not quite 'right'.
I recognise he must have been a nightmare to moderate. It was pretty obvious he pushed the wrong buttons on Marco and it could never have lasted..... Ah! it was a fiery bromance from the start!
Spot on, Darren - particularly the bit in bold!!
What's a "bromance", though - some kind of clever play on words, or was it simply a typo? :eyebrows:
Marco.
Hi Marco,
A Bromance is when two straight men are strongly attracted to each other for a period - a sudden strong friendship if you will. Not a gay relationship just a liking for each other as close friends.
I used the term in jest as I know your back is broad enough to take a joke.
Ok, since I can't PM you Andre, I'm going to ask you a couple of flippant questions in jest: Genesis, Phil or Peter? Floyd, Syd or Dave? Or even, Dave or Roger? :sofa:
Sorry dude, I knew what you'd answer but had to ask to lighten the mood ;)
I know it's thought of as herecy amongst some Floyd fans, but I have always preferred the sound of the band post 'Syd'. I could never quite grasp where they were in their early years, but that may have had something to do with the fact that I was only eight years old when I first heard them in 1970.
My fave album is Wish You Were Here, closely followed by DSOTM, although I never tire of listening to their other albums. I'm not a big fan of The Division Bell though...
As for Genesis, it has to be Peter of course, Selling England By The Pound being my fave. Best track though goes to Return Of The Giant Hogweed ;)
I think those who mourn the loss of Syd are really into a different kind of psychedelic sound. DG made PF who they are now with his superb guitar sound, RW wrote most of the songs. They were both key to who modern PF were. Not forgetting the other RW, of course :)
I think those who mourn the loss of Syd are really into a different kind of psychedelic sound. DG made PF who they are now with his superb guitar sound, RW wrote most of the songs. They were both key to who modern PF were. Not forgetting the other RW, of course :)
Rick Wakeman?
Rare Bird
03-09-2011, 12:43
I'm going to ask you a couple of flippant questions in jest: Genesis, Phil or Peter? Floyd, Syd or Dave? Or even, Dave or Roger? :sofa:
Peter but only bother with upto but not inc 'Selling England'
The Floyd s tricky, Syd era however legendary it is is but for me Floyd from 'Saucerful' upto but not including 'DSOTM'
Thats my preference.
chris@panteg
03-09-2011, 13:44
Sorry for being so late on this , but i like Richard and have always been interested in his point of view , his kit (NVA) sounds good to me and interestingly different to anyone else's , one day i might even own some NVA gear ! If it wasn't for this damn kitchen :eyebrows:
Rick Wakeman?
Rick (Richard) Wright ;)
I think those who mourn the loss of Syd are really into a different kind of psychedelic sound. DG made PF who they are now with his superb guitar sound, RW wrote most of the songs. They were both key to who modern PF were. Not forgetting the other RW, of course :)
+1 ;)
I'm not a Genesis fan really. I have some of the early albums that I listen to every now and again - I don't have any post-Gabriel ones.
Regarding PF, I like all of their stuff, but have a preference for the pre-Dark Side Gilmour albums, especially More, Atom Heart Mother, Meddle and Obscured By Clouds. I probably played DSotM and WYWH to death as a teenager and don't play those very often now.
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