Croft

[Covenant]

Croft is a name that gets a frequent mention on this site and I had been thinking of trying one of Mr Croft's amps for a long while. When a nearly new Series 7 power amp appeared on Ebay I stuck in a bid and got it for about half list price. :)
Its a revelation, lovely deep, controlled bass and a superb soundstage. I am a convert!
I don't suppose it will be long before I try the pre-amp although it seems fine using my Standac to control volume.
Any tube-rolling tweaks recommended?
So thank you Marco and the many others who have sung the praises of Glen's products. I now realise why. :cool:

[Marco]

Hey, Jerry, you're welcome. Great to hear of another Croftista joining the fold! :)

Got any pics of ya new baby? :cool:

Marco.

[Covenant]

Its a very boring looking black box Marco but I will see what I can do!

[Marco]

I know, but it's always nice to see people's new kit in situ :)

Marco.

[Alex_UK]

I don't suppose it will be long before I try the pre-amp although it seems fine using my Standac to control volume.

To be honest, if you don't need any analogue inputs (or remote control) I doubt adding a pre will improve things much - maybe even the opposite.

[Covenant]

Many people think a pre is essential but I take your point Alex. Its another thing to cause distortion. It does make any future dac replacement limited as it would need multiple inputs and a volume control. Getting the matching pre would allow me to do some tube rolling. Actually there is a tube in the power amp so maybe I could try changing that?

[DSJR]

To be honest, if you don't need any analogue inputs (or remote control) I doubt adding a pre will improve things much - maybe even the opposite.

Now you KNOW this isn't true Alex ;)

[Stratmangler]

To be honest, if you don't need any analogue inputs (or remote control) I doubt adding a pre will improve things much - maybe even the opposite.

I've found this not to be the case, at least in my instance.
Things sound much better with a preamp in circuit - without it sounds nice enough, but with a preamp music has greater drive and togetherness.

An active buffer might well do the same kind of thing.

[anthonyTD]

I've found this not to be the case, at least in my instance.

Things sound much better with a preamp in circuit - without it sounds nice enough, but with a preamp music has greater drive and togetherness.

An active buffer might well do the same kind of thing.
Exactly!
IMHO A good preamp is an essential part of the system.
Anthony,TD...

[hifi_dave]

There are few souces - CD players, tuners, phono stages - with proper output stages capable of driving runs of incon and a power-amp. In most cases, a well designed pre-amp will sound better.

[DSJR]

Actually, I was being a bit tongue-in-cheek with Alex earlier...

If the source component has a decent purpose designed line buffer with low enough output impedance of a few hundred Ohms or less, then it should be well able to drive a power amp directly and I believe the Gator to be one such device as compared to the original output stage it had/has.

The following may be controversial, but I do think a decent valve preamp such as one of Glenn's own, would add something good to the proceedings. I wouldn't say distortion, as his designs measure properly in an up to date fashion I believe, but there is a sense of air and space that comes through (and it ain't compression either that I can tell) which complements the gator really well IMO. It may be difficult to try one though, but occasionally, a Micro Basic may come up at a good price - Glenn's older preamps will need to be sent to "the Master" for fettling/bringing up to date I think - I just feel that the old lower-range Micro's just won't sound "clean" enough for a Series 7 as they are, despite their obvious charms with Croft Series 4 or 5 valve power amp, although the Vitale may be more like the current product for all I know.

[Macca]

I've tried the Micro Basic with the Series 7 power amp and the combo cannot be faulted especially at the price (although I think the price has now gone up a bit)

[Alex_UK]

Please can we have a new smiley with this description :Opensmouthtochangefeet:

[DSJR]

:D

[Haselsh1]

Even the Croft Micro 25 Basic improved my Series 7 hundreds of times. The sound is just so much better with the pre in circuit.

[Ali Tait]

Yep agreed. I have a WAD Pre2 valve pre which is pretty good, and my system's sound was improved even more with the addition of a valve buffer stage built by Nick.

[Covenant]

Even the Croft Micro 25 Basic improved my Series 7 hundreds of times. The sound is just so much better with the pre in circuit.

Wow, I had better start saving.......

[Welder]

ShaunH wrote;

“Even the Croft Micro 25 Basic improved my Series 7 hundreds of times. The sound is just so much better with the pre in circuit.”

Oh arr, are you sure you had the other kit switched on? :rolleyes:

[Covenant]

Oh well Marco, as requested a photo, exciting-Not!

[DSJR]

Looks very neat & it's always a nice thing to see how others set their gear up and in what racking etc... :)

[southall-1998]

Just out of curiosity. How does the Croft Seris 7 poweramp sound? Is it warm/smooth sounding etc?

Regards.

[Covenant]

Hi Shane,
Previously I used the Mini T amp, subject to many favourable reviews on here and elsewhere. In comparison the Croft has far more bass but it is tightly controlled. In other words, only when it's meant to be there. The overall presentation just seems more accurate and, well fun. By that I mean that its more involving and there is a greater sense of realism. It really is a myth about valve amps being lethargic. It sounds fast and precise to me.
The Mini-T is a fine amp for the price but not in the same league. Lets face it, you could buy 14 Mini-T's for the price of a Croft.

[southall-1998]

Thanks Jerry.

The Mini T amp you had, was it from that UK seller on ebay?

Regards.

[DSJR]

IMO, the Series 7 is light and lively and VERY clear without being in the slightest clinical, hard or harsh. One soon forgets it's there and the music tumbles out :)

Alex's Mini-T made the three of us laugh by comparison...

[Covenant]

Thanks Jerry.

The Mini T amp you had, was it from that UK seller on ebay?

Regards.

Thats the one-mine is going on ebay when I have a spare minute.

[Puffin]

But of course the 7 is not really a valve amp :sofa:

[Alex_UK]

Alex's Mini-T made the three of us laugh by comparison...

Maybe not quite laugh for me, certainly not a belly laugh, more of a chuckle, at what the fuss is all about with the Tripath amps :scratch: I think the mini-T is brilliant for what it is, at it's price point, on a computer desk or in my case for "dinner jazz" in the dining room at low levels - but for me, not much more, and I certainly couldn't live with one in my main system. Sorry peeps!


But of course the 7 is not really a valve amp

Indeed - best of both worlds IMO :)

[Covenant]

How would you describe it Rob-a hybrid? :)

[Reid Malenfant]

Hybrid yes... Valve input & voltage amplifier with a mosfet output stage ;)

Should be good in theory :) Can't say i have had the pleasure though.

[DSJR]

You don't know what you're missing ;)

[Reid Malenfant]

You don't know what you're missing ;)
Never a truer statement was said :lol:

[Puffin]

How would you describe it Rob-a hybrid? :)

Yep, bang on the money.

I have a "sort of" similar set-up (unless someone tells me I am talking pony), I use a Musical Fidelity X-10D before the Pre-amp and between pre and Power amp.

From Stereophile 1996

"It's a tubed output stage and buffer. The X-10D has two sets of RCA jacks, input and output (you'll need an extra set of interconnects). You put the X-10D between your CD player and your preamp, active or passive. Or you can put it after your preamp, active or passive. Or you can put one X-10D before the preamp and another one after, if you like—which would have the effect of tubing everything before it goes to your power amp".

rob.

[hifi_dave]

Maybe not quite laugh for me, certainly not a belly laugh, more of a chuckle, at what the fuss is all about with the Tripath amps :scratch: I think the mini-T is brilliant for what it is, at it's price point, on a computer desk or in my case for "dinner jazz" in the dining room at low levels - but for me, not much more, and I certainly couldn't live with one in my main system. Sorry peeps!



Indeed - best of both worlds IMO :)

I didn't laugh. I was polite and thought it good for the money.

The Croft Series 7 and 7R are very much like his old OTL amps. Clean, clear, dynamic and with enought body to let you know there's valves inside.

[DSJR]

Yep, bang on the money.

I have a "sort of" similar set-up (unless someone tells me I am talking pony), I use a Musical Fidelity X-10D before the Pre-amp and between pre and Power amp.

From Stereophile 1996

"It's a tubed output stage and buffer. The X-10D has two sets of RCA jacks, input and output (you'll need an extra set of interconnects). You put the X-10D between your CD player and your preamp, active or passive. Or you can put it after your preamp, active or passive. Or you can put one X-10D before the preamp and another one after, if you like—which would have the effect of tubing everything before it goes to your power amp".

rob.

How far have you taken the X-10D? The original is pretty invasive sonically in original form, but breathed on (rock-grotto style) and with a larger 12VAC supply it is far, far better, if not totally transparent.

[chris@panteg]

I've found this not to be the case, at least in my instance.
Things sound much better with a preamp in circuit - without it sounds nice enough, but with a preamp music has greater drive and togetherness.

An active buffer might well do the same kind of thing.

Hi Chris

I agree with that :) what's your amp set up again ? I can't remember if you told me or not :scratch: must be old age creeping up on me .

[Stratmangler]

Hi Chris

I agree with that :) what's your amp set up again ? I can't remember if you told me or not :scratch: must be old age creeping up on me .

Just a bog standard NAD C320BEE.
The pre and power stages are connected by jumper bars, so it's also possible to use the stages seperately.

[swampy]

But of course the 7 is not really a valve amp :sofa:

Its a mosfet amp with an ecc83 (I think) as an input driver in place or the more commonly used jfets. I guess the mosfets are running in Class AB

[swampy]

Its not a bad price also. Mr Crofts markup looks much more fair and honest than most hifi companies out there.

[Ali Tait]

Aye, one of the few that don't try to rip you off IMHO.

[DSJR]

And easy to service should they ever need it, don't forget.

One advantage of making such fine products with standard components is that spares probably won't ever be a problem, unlike some of the "significant new products" over the last forty years which used custom components which are now long gone.

[dionisio]

Could be a summer amp/pre purchase in the offing, and the Series 7 / Micro 25 combo looks like it'll do the business - this thread has proved useful reference, thanks!

Are there any Northern dealers?

[DSJR]

Look on Glenn's website, or ask hifi dave if he'd be able to have it sent directly to you?

Looking at another thread, I ought to say that Glenn's gear is no passing fad or fashion. It's been great value ever since it became available in the mid 80's, it works so well, reliably and gives such pleasure to its owners for decades (my preamp is around twenty years old now - unbelievable :)) and Glenn will always look at his older stuff and sensitively update it as necessary.

A Series 7/Micro 25 is one amp set that I could recommend wholeheartedly to anyone within sensibilities of course..

[Macca]

Could be a summer amp/pre purchase in the offing, and the Series 7 / Micro 25 combo looks like it'll do the business - this thread has proved useful reference, thanks!

Are there any Northern dealers?

Haden Boardman in Bolton

[dionisio]

Thanks!