NAS or plain external drive?

[webby]

I've been thinking for some time since ripping all my cd's (well, not all, but I'm some way through) about moving my iTunes library to a NAS drive; one, to reclaim 160gb of disk space on my iMac and two, actually, what are the other benefits of doing this?

I've started to think that a plain old external drive might do the job just as well. NAS drives normally start at 1TB for around £100 and I just don't need that much space. I could get a 500Gb FireWire drive for around half that and it would offer a faster connection.

So, do I need a NAS, or will the plain external drive be sufficient? Are there benefits to the NAS option that I'm not seeing? Money's tight so it's worth weighing up the options.

Cheers

[Ali Tait]

An external will do the job, and it's a good idea to back your music up anyway, preferably in at least two other places. I'd buy two and back up to both. 1Tb is probably worth getting, as you will fill them up sooner than you think.

[shane]

Inevitably, hard drives fail. I would recommend two cheap NAS hard drives, one for everyday use, one as a backup. Twice now I've had hard drive failures that would have resulted in the loss of my entire music library had I not done this.

[Ali Tait]

Snap!

[Thing Fish]

I've been thinking of getting one of these for some time now. Or something similar. Just a thought.

http://www.maplin.co.uk/4-bay-terabox-esata-hdd-raid-enclosure-224358

[webby]

Oh I have a backup, a 1TB western digital. I really think I'll be hard pushed to get my music library close to 500gb let alone 1tb.

[alfie2902]

I'm using 2 external HDD atm one for all playable music files & a back up drive just copied using SyncToy. Works well for me atm, but I do fancy going for a NAS drive with SBS installed at some point, simply so the PC doesn't have to be on all the time I want to use the SBTouch. It also could be a benefit to remove noisey HDD from your music room.

[webby]

I'm using 2 external HDD atm one for all playable music files & a back up drive just copied using SyncToy. Works well for me atm, but I do fancy going for a NAS drive with SBS installed at some point, simply so the PC doesn't have to be on all the time I want to use the SBTouch. It also could be a benefit to remove noisey HDD from your music room.

Ah, that's what I forgot, the 'always on' ability of the NAS.

Cheers Alfie.

[MG1]

I ended up knocking together a NAS from spares a cheap motherboard and this caddy:

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/icy-dock-mb-455spf-3-x-525-bays-hosting-5-hdd-drives-sataii-hotswap-best-seller

...well a similar one.

I'm running ubuntu and it sits in a cupboard with just a network cable and power attached. All the config is done from my laptop over the network and the caddy contains 5 1TB drives giving me a total of just under 3TB of storage ini a RAID 5 array.

I did fork our for a hardware RAID controller that was a little OTT...but it's soubling as my home office file server.

It has been on for over 18months with just breaks when we go away and I havent had to replace a disk yet. I have around 500GB free but am currently considering upgrading the capacity. All I do is take out one drive and place in a larger drive. let it rebuild and then repeat. Once all thr drives are the same size again I can access the partition and redefine the capacity without loosing the data.

Not cheap, but seems to work...it also is accessible through MS Media Player/MCE players.

Anyway, that's just my setup....lots of ways to skin a cat and all that..!

[alfie2902]

I do wonder if RAID is needed in an home music server? Not sure the extra speed is needed? What benefits do you think it brings?

I was thinking of perhaps 2tb NAS just backed up with an external HDD but have little real experiance of NAS.

[MG1]

You're quite right...RAID isn't NEEDED, but now that I've invested a significant amount of time ripping around 120 DVDs (still have around 200 to go hence the rulings around upgrades) plus near on 500 CDs (shamefully as MP3s so I have some work to do there!) I quite like the security if knowing that if a disc fails I don't have to go through that process again.

It also contains around 5 years of digital photography (another serious hobby of mine) and my company projects. And whilst re-ripping films and music can be done as I keep all the originals in boxes in the attic, the other stuff is irreplaceable....must sort that off site storage at some point!

So it works for me, but may be overkill for most.

I started with a little D-link dual disk NAS that works as a media server and was very good. That had RAID 1 or 0 and for media would be fine. IIRC you won't need speed improvements, but the backup benefits are good, particularly if you're tempted to populate it with cheaper drives.

For minimum hassle through a propriety all in one solution is easiest...just look for one with a good guarantee and if possible that offers data recovery.

HTH
Michael

[Mark Grant]

It also contains around 5 years of digital photography (another serious hobby of mine) and my company projects.

Have you got that backed up Michael ?

Just that if the PSU in the NAS fails or the controller fails all discs in the raid can be destroyed.

Last year I lost many irreplaceable photos, it wont happen again ! ( Two hard drive failures in a very short space of time.....)

I now use the 321 backup method.

3 copies
2 different media types
1 copy off site

[jantheman]

NAS or plugin...I have used both and it really is all down to convenience. If you have all your gear in one place then a plugin will do as well as anything. I now use NAS as I access my media from around the house. Take your choice, no difference in sound quality from either.

[MG1]

Have you got that backed up Michael ?

Just that if the PSU in the NAS fails or the controller fails all discs in the raid can be destroyed.

Last year I lost many irreplaceable photos, it wont happen again ! ( Two hard drive failures in a very short space of time.....)

I now use the 321 backup method.

3 copies
2 different media types
1 copy off site

The work stuff yes, the rest well it's the problem of capacity again. At almost half a TB of photography that's lots of DVDs! I shoot in RAW and as an example filled 11GB last weekend. I keep my portfolio backed up, but at the moment rely on the RAID and the fact I'm using enterprise level components where it matters.

I did consider things like redundant hotswap PSUs and UPSs but the costs were spiralling and risk management kicks in.

But I agree...there's always something that might scupper you.

Someone once said to me "but what if your house burns down" which was fair enough, but I figure if that happens then I'll have a lot more on my mind than how am I going to stream media! The accounts etc are all in the cloud...that's the best way I reckon and those files are pretty small anyway.

[MG1]

NAS or plugin...I have used both and it really is all down to convenience. If you have all your gear in one place then a plugin will do as well as anything. I now use NAS as I access my media from around the house. Take your choice, no difference in sound quality from either.

TBH, the price difference between the two isn't as much as it once was.

I'd be looking for a dual connection (assuming you have a home network) as you want a high speed for transferring lots of data onto the storage, but don't need such high speed for playback unless everyone in the family is streaming at the same time! Therefore a network connection allows access from anywhere, and for your spinning discs to be kept out of ear shot.

[Yoga]

I have both NAS RAID and eSATA RAID boxes (business use), and the eSata one is much nicer to use.

Just grab a 2-drive eSata enclosure and use RAID-1.

Examples...

http://www.google.co.uk/products/catalog?hl=en&q=2+drive+raid+enclosure&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=7391050795606763108&sa=X&ei=V3e-TceAF9Sx8QO15PDVBQ&ved=0CGAQ8wIwAg#

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Cremax-MB662US-2S-Screwless-External-Enclosure/dp/B001OANDRC

Either way, with RAID-1, the drives are 1 to 1 mirrored. A failure in the hardware enclosure itself, or one of the drives, will still give you a full backup.

Avoid software RAID (i.e. native Win7 or OS X) for external RAID backups. If the software has problems; you lose the data.

[Ali Tait]

Another option is a Drobo. Does all the backing up automatically, sharing the data between four HD's. A great fit and forget bit of kit.

[alfie2902]

Hmm... I'm really not sure about RAID or automatic backups for home users for a music server NAS drive!

Raid works great for disk errors or failures & I'm sure is a great tool in a busy multi user company where downtime could cost lots of money! But a Raid system then needs a further back up to gaurd against file corruption or accidental deletion.

Raid 0 (2 or more HDDs) in a striping array provides improved performance, which is not needed for streaming music & disc failure to one disk destroys the array! at a minimum, catastrophic data loss is twice as likely compared to single drives without RAID!

Raid 1 (2 or more HDDs) in a mirroring array provides a mirrored identical copy on both drives, now where getting somewhere, If 1 HDD fails the 2nd is a back up! But, again if file corruption or accidental deletion has occured it has occured on both Disks so we have data loss!

Automatic backup could also back up the file corruption or accidental deletion so again data loss could happen!

In an home system IMO a single HDD backed up manually on to a 2nd HDD would give you 2 mirrored copies to protect agaisnt HDD failure without the risk of automatic copying of corrupt files or copying the accidental deletion! A third copy then kept off site adds even more protection!

So unless I'm missing something important, & I may well be as I still trying to learn, what advatages does RAID give in a home NAS for music streaming?

[Yoga]

If you're using a Mac, the above post is very easily done using ChronoSync. I use that app to mirror an internal drive with the external RAID drive.

[MCRU]

I just bought a readyNAS duo and have 1 tb hd drive in it, is external back up better away from the NAS then? As its got a USB port can I just put a memory stick in and copy my flacs to that?

Thx

[alfie2902]

I just bought a readyNAS duo and have 1 tb hd drive in it, is external back up better away from the NAS then? As its got a USB port can I just put a memory stick in and copy my flacs to that?

Thx

Hi David,

I'm not totally sure what is best tbh & am just trying to find out!

But my thinking atm would be to use your readyNAS with the one HDD in & use a 2nd external HDD to back up the NAS. If everytime you rip or add files to your music folder (Or whatever folder) then copy the new files over to the external via something like SyncToy & then unplug the drive. You've then got one safe mirrored HDD. As a fail safe a 3rd external HDD mirrored again could be kept off site to protect all your files against fire or lightening strike or anything else that could ruin both main HDD & your back-up HDD. Perhaps over the top, but perhaps not!?

[webby]

Has anyone here had trouble with a NAS and iTunes 10? Apparently iTunes 10 is not compatible with firefly which is the protocol that the NAS drives use.

[nat8808]

I've a budget option for you:

You can get an enclosure with 4 or so removable drive trays with firewire connections on the back that daisychain (mine was free from freecycle atually).

Then, I've noticed where I live at least, people throw out BT digital tv boxes with hard drives in them when they go over to Sky (or whomever) and each at least contains a 160Gb drive - found 2 recently plus a Humax that wint power up with 250Gb drive inside.

Just removed the drives, format them and hey presto youre heading towards 600Gb for free! Get your operating system to see them as one drive, perhaps as a RAID with redundancy.

Still, I also picked up a dual 160Gb Glyph firewire unit for as little as £15 last year from Ebay - specifically setup for pro video work so quite fast..

They are my tips on a budget - people don't seem to realise there are harddrives in those sky plus type boxes and just thow them away when they change provider.

[Batty]

I use a readynas Duo too but with 2 x 2Tb drives it uses Netgear's own version of RAID (X raid) it comes with SBS installed you just have to activate it. Plus it can act as a print server and torrent server too.

[nat8808]

I use a readynas Duo too but with 2 x 2Tb drives it uses Netgear's own version of RAID (X raid) it comes with SBS installed you just have to activate it. Plus it can act as a print server and torrent server too.

Large drives are always tempting but risk of loss becomes greater and greater, even with RAID.

Better to see if you can string more but smaller drives together than 2 x 2Tb - and the cost of replacement also remains low by using older technology rather than the latest capacities.

I think that is often something that is overlooked when thinking about NAS or large external drives - you need to be able to back up your music/film etc to something of the same size. Better to not go for the largest you can buy unless you can buy two. Often what people do is move stuff off their computers as a backup but then later delete it from the computer because they feel they already have a backup.. but of course they now only have it all in one place again, on the large external drive.

[Batty]

So as I understand it, from what you say nat8808 If I buy a 3rd drive and swap out one of the drives in my NAs I would then have a backup of what is on my NAS and all would be good?

At the price of HDDs that is not a bad idea.

[WAD62]

I use a QNAP TS-119, which is a 1tb single bay 1.2ghz unit, I keep a RAID synchronised copy of the HD via the USB to an external drive in case of HD/server failure, I keep this locked away in a cupboard. I also keep a manual copy of my FLAC files on another drive elsewhere...just to be sure :)

I don't see the advantage of RAID synchronisation to another drive inside the server, it's not like one needs 'failover' unless you're running a radio station, and what if the server itself gets stolen? ;)

[Batty]

I use a QNAP TS-119, which is a 1tb single bay 1.2ghz unit, I keep a RAID synchronised copy of the HD via the USB to an external drive in case of HD/server failure, I keep this locked away in a cupboard. I also keep a manual copy of my FLAC files on another drive elsewhere...just to be sure :)

I don't see the advantage of RAID synchronisation to another drive inside the server, it's not like one needs 'failover' unless you're running a radio station, and what if the server itself gets stolen? ;)

I don't think anyone where I live knows what a server is :) plus mine is hidden from view.