View Full Version : Phillips GP412 ii cartridge
The Vinyl Adventure
29-03-2011, 21:37
This thing seems pretty decent!
Sounds funky and to the point if that makes sence! Perhaps not so acurate mind...
I am in a particularly "good mood" tonight but I do like it ...
http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/9a30c2cb.jpg
Does anyone have a clue about it? Age? Is it of any value now? Anything really?
spendorman
29-03-2011, 21:46
I have one of these and it does sound good. bought it as NOS over 17 years ago! I wonder if it's made by Shure.
The Vinyl Adventure
29-03-2011, 21:51
So it's an old boy then!
What did you pay for it Alex ... If you don't mind me asking ... I want to buy it but it's off a mate ... And I want to give a fair price!
The Vinyl Adventure
29-03-2011, 21:54
You know what, i think this is what I have been looking for in an older cart ... Fun sound... Bit muddled now n' again, but upbeat and fun!
Shure... Dunno... Sounds better than my m75 though... By a margin!
It's late 70's-early 80's from memory. I didn't mind it but 'Choice didn't for the reasons you've given...
For a tenner or less, it'll be fun :lolsign:
spendorman
29-03-2011, 21:57
Now you're asking, it's a long time ago, in fact I bought several of the GP range, all unused. They all sounded pretty good.
The value will depend on the stylus condition of course.
spendorman
29-03-2011, 21:59
You know what, i think this is what I have been looking for in an older cart ... Fun sound... Bit muddled now n' again, but upbeat and fun!
Shure... Dunno... Sounds better than my m75 though... By a margin!
Think I agree with that, possibly similar to my Shure M95 HE, which can't be bad.
vinylspinner
30-03-2011, 17:41
Hi Hamish,
I used these cartridges in the late 70's, imho they sounded better than the Shures, only replaced them with the Ortofon VMSE 30 range, which I thought was a cracking cartridge for the money, still use one today.
Nigel
There was a problem with some of these cartridges, and that was the feeling from the audio-buying public in general that the higher the compliance and lower the playing weight, the better back then. I remember the GP400 series was very high in compliance and unsuited to the otherwise excellent 212 turntable for example. By now, the suspensions may have tightened a little with age and this may actually bring the cartridge into where it should have been when new...
The Vinyl Adventure
30-03-2011, 22:13
Hi Hamish,
I used these cartridges in the late 70's, imho they sounded better than the Shures, only replaced them with the Ortofon VMSE 30 range, which I thought was a cracking cartridge for the money, still use one today.
Nigel
I'm loving it on this deck! It's a really enjoyable cart to listen to!
Seems to really work well with the bassiness of the table...
The Vinyl Adventure
30-03-2011, 22:16
There was a problem with some of these cartridges, and that was the feeling from the audio-buying public in general that the higher the compliance and lower the playing weight, the better back then. I remember the GP400 series was very high in compliance and unsuited to the otherwise excellent 212 turntable for example. By now, the suspensions may have tightened a little with age and this may actually bring the cartridge into where it should have been when new...
Sometime I feel so out of my depth in this hobby... And my brain is too full of photo stuff to learn all this stuff properly ...
What does high compliance mean?
What does it mean for me in this instance?
Should this cart be a good match to the rega 301?
It there anything I can do to squeeze more out of this arm/cart combo?
Sometime I feel so out of my depth in this hobby... And my brain is too full of photo stuff to learn all this stuff properly ...
What does high compliance mean?What does it mean for me in this instance?
Should this cart be a good match to the rega 301?
It there anything I can do to squeeze more out of this arm/cart combo?
Hi Hamish,
'High compliance' means the suspension of the stylus cantilever is soft and therefore very flexible; requiring a low playing weight and a lightweight arm.
I don't know too much about the Rega 301 arm. I'll do a bit of research, but I suspect that the arm/cartridge combination may not be ideal.
Regards
Hamish you might be interested in this: http://www.gramophone.net/Issue/Page/February%201970/116/771646/#header-logo
The cartridge has a measured compliance of 12.5cu at 100Hz, suggesting a compliance of 19 - 25cu at 10Hz. I cannot find the weight of this cartridge, but let us assume it is 5g.
The effective mass of the Rega RB301 arm is 11.5g, so the low frequency resonance of the Philips 412/II and Rega arm combination will lay in the region 7.8 to 8.9Hz. This is on the low side; ideally it ought to lay in the range 10 - 15Hz.
However, I would suggest you go ahead and try the cartridge out in your arm and see how you get on.
Regards
The Vinyl Adventure
31-03-2011, 17:51
Hamish you might be interested in this: http://www.gramophone.net/Issue/Page/February%201970/116/771646/#header-logo
The cartridge has a measured compliance of 12.5cu at 100Hz, suggesting a compliance of 19 - 25cu at 10Hz. I cannot find the weight of this cartridge, but let us assume it is 5g.
The effective mass of the Rega RB301 arm is 11.5g, so the low frequency resonance of the Philips 412/II and Rega arm combination will lay in the region 7.8 to 8.9Hz. This is on the low side; ideally it ought to lay in the range 10 - 15Hz.
However, I would suggest you go ahead and try the cartridge out in your arm and see how you get on.
Regards
Hi Barry
cheers for the info
i found this on VE
http:// www. vinylengine.com/library/philips/super-m-mark-ii.shtml
(i have added some spaces to the link as i dont think ve links work from here?)
it says the weight is 6g ... how does that change things?
is there a way to add weight that might help? or would that be wrong?
i have it on the arm ... it sounds great!! it has its flaws but i really like it!! its just what i wanted to find when i set out on my mission to find an inexpensive cart that i loved the sound of.... im just trying work out if i can improve it!?
With a cartridge weight of 6g the resonance frequency is lowered to 7.6 - 8.7Hz.
Adding weight would lower it further. It needs to be raised, as approaching a 6Hz resonance frequency makes the whole assembly vulnerable to foot falls.
However if your turntable is well isolated, by for example, being mounted on a wall shelf, then you can probably get away with it. And from your description, it seems that you do.
Regards
[PS How is Hannah (+1) ?]
Rare Bird
01-04-2011, 01:43
Does anyone have a clue about it? Age? Is it of any value now? Anything really?
The GP412-II is 1977 .. If their be any cartridge it resembles it's the Empire 900-II
The Vinyl Adventure
01-04-2011, 07:53
With a cartridge weight of 6g the resonance frequency is lowered to 7.6 - 8.7Hz.
Adding weight would lower it further. It needs to be raised, as approaching a 6Hz resonance frequency makes the whole assembly vulnerable to foot falls.
However if your turntable is well isolated, by for example, being mounted on a wall shelf, then you can probably get away with it. And from your description, it seems that you do.
Regards
[PS How is Hannah (+1) ?]
She's fine... 24 weeks gone now, so we are getting there! :)
All the attention has jumped temporarily to the 10 5 week old puppies we have running around our utility room!
Yes the tt is well isolated, I was a little worried when I first set it up on the coffee table actually, I couldn't really move for it hopping about on the surface of the record, but on the Quadraspire rack in the fire place its fine even with the dogs running around the place!
That's just down to the low tracking weight though right ...
So when you say venerable to foot fall... So as to make sure I am not suffering any issues technically speaking ... What should I look out for?
If I'm honest, I'm not overly worried ... I'm just trying to learn this stuff ... ... Despite my brains unwillingness to absorb this stuff properly, playing with all these old carts is a lot of fun, perhaps the most fun I have had with my hifi ... And although I can subjectively say I like one over the other having the knowledge to understand what is happening would be useful I think!
I know I have banged on about this before, but playing with these carts, not trying to find perfection in the sound, but trying to find a sound that the compromise is one that suits me and spending very little money is a lot more satisfying than spending big money on the major bits of the kit! Not to mention the fact I can do it all with little worry of annoying Hannah with anything ugly ... The ugliest cart in the world isn't going to bother her!
Although I am now on the hunt for a tonearm with an interchangeable head shell to make this all a lot easier ... Although that might be a while in the coming yet!
The Vinyl Adventure
01-04-2011, 07:56
The GP412-II is 1977 .. If their be any cartridge it resembles it's the Empire 900-II
Are you thinking of somthing else andre? The gramophone link Barry posted shows an article from feb 1970!
... I've just realised that makes this thing 41 years old!!
Rare Bird
01-04-2011, 12:14
Are you thinking of somthing else andre? The gramophone link Barry posted shows an article from feb 1970!
... I've just realised that makes this thing 41 years old!!
Nop the 1970 will be the first version 'GP412'..the 'GP412-II' (which you have) is part of the the Super M range..1977..
Don't diss the vintagemeister! :eyebrows:
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
01-04-2011, 13:39
haha... ... thats exactly why i asked the question not made the statement! ;)
She's fine... 24 weeks gone now, so we are getting there! :)
All the attention has jumped temporarily to the 10 5 week old puppies we have running around our utility room!
Yes the tt is well isolated, I was a little worried when I first set it up on the coffee table actually, I couldn't really move for it hopping about on the surface of the record, but on the Quadraspire rack in the fire place its fine even with the dogs running around the place!
That's just down to the low tracking weight though right ...
So when you say venerable to foot fall... So as to make sure I am not suffering any issues technically speaking ... What should I look out for?
If I'm honest, I'm not overly worried ... I'm just trying to learn this stuff ... ... Despite my brains unwillingness to absorb this stuff properly, playing with all these old carts is a lot of fun, perhaps the most fun I have had with my hifi ... And although I can subjectively say I like one over the other having the knowledge to understand what is happening would be useful I think!
I know I have banged on about this before, but playing with these carts, not trying to find perfection in the sound, but trying to find a sound that the compromise is one that suits me and spending very little money is a lot more satisfying than spending big money on the major bits of the kit! Not to mention the fact I can do it all with little worry of annoying Hannah with anything ugly ... The ugliest cart in the world isn't going to bother her!
Although I am now on the hunt for a tonearm with an interchangeable head shell to make this all a lot easier ... Although that might be a while in the coming yet!
I can't remember how your deck is mounted, but by being "vulnerable to footfalls", I mean if the arm (and to some extent the deck) wobbles badly when you walk near it, then you might have problems.
Don't understand what you mean by "an ugly cartridge"?
Regards
The Vinyl Adventure
01-04-2011, 17:51
Nah don't have that problem Barry ...
I'm still not sure I'm clear about what is bad about this resonant frequency if it goes near 6hz ... ??
What I mean by ugly cart is ...
I can get away with buying any type of cartridge as it won't offend hannah as they are so small ... I can't do the same with speakers for example as Hannah is picky about what goes in the living room! ...
Nah don't have that problem Barry ...
I'm still not sure I'm clear about what is bad about this resonant frequency if it goes near 6Hz ... ??
What I mean by ugly cart is ...
I can get away with buying any type of cartridge as it won't offend hannah as they are so small ... I can't do the same with speakers for example as Hannah is picky about what goes in the living room! ...
I can't prove it, but I'm sure I read somewhere that the frequency components of foot falls on wooden floorboards are around 3 and 6Hz. If the arm/cartridge system has a resonant frequency at 6Hz, then foot falls will excite the resonance.
Above the resonant frequency, the stylus can move relative to the cartridge body and arm and thus generate an output. Below the resonant frequency, the stylus, cartridge body and arm all move together; as they do whilst riding record warp.
At the resonant frequency the cartridge will produce the largest output. How well the arm/cartridge copes with this depends on the damping, or 'Q' factor of the combination. Even though you can't hear it, the cartridge will be generating sub-sonic signals, which may overload the pre-amp, especially as this is exacerbated by the RIAA pre-emphasis. Many preamps have a high pass filter which has a roll off at 20Hz, and this is there to prevent low frequency signals such as those caused by turntable rumble from causing mischief to the preamp. Many other pre-amps do not have this arrangement.
vinylspinner
01-04-2011, 19:32
Hi Hamish,
I am with Andre on this one, deffo '77 / 78, got mine about the same time as the Fleetwood Mac Rumours album, changed the cartridge in '79 for the Ortofons.
Nigel
Rare Bird
02-04-2011, 15:09
That Philips 'GP412.II' has a lower mass than the original, it'll give you a somewhat indesirable tonearm resonant frequency of around 6.9Hz with the RB300!
The Vinyl Adventure
02-04-2011, 16:13
Yea, so I'm told ...
But I'm yet to experience anything that would lead me to believe anything bad is happening?
What signs should I be looking out for that would show me that something isn't right?
Is it there anything I could hear?
I don't have a clue if my pre amp has any filter like what Barry talks about, but I could find out ....
I'm contemplating sourcing an r200 tonearm or similar so I can more easily play with all these different carts ... Would it be a better match to one of those?
The Vinyl Adventure
02-04-2011, 16:51
Balls ... Ah well ...
Not that I'm going to buy a tonearm to match it ... But hat would be suitable?
I'd still like a r200 just to make all this swapping and changing easier ... But I suppose it might be counter productive to get something that would be less easily compatible ... This tonearm/cart stuff is a god damn mine field if you ask me :)
Rare Bird
02-04-2011, 17:11
That cart is better suited to a real low mass arm like the SME III, Mayware, Original Mission 774 etc
The Vinyl Adventure
02-04-2011, 17:22
so whats the maths to work out this frequency then?
im playing with some of these sony carts now and im intrigued to work out if technically speaking they are a better match to the arm?
ones a vl-32g
the other a
xl-15
info here
http://www.vinylengine.com/cartridge_database.php?m=Sony&t=any&mod=&sort=1&Search=Search&sty=&ovlo=&ovhi=&can=&dclo=&dchi=&stid=&masslo=&masshi=¬es=&prlo=&prhi=
Rare Bird
02-04-2011, 17:31
Hold on i'll PM you an explinantion..Bioth those carts are fine
I don't have a clue if my pre amp has any filter like what Barry talks about, but I could find out ....
I'm 99.9999% sure it doesn't ;)
Andre is right about tonearms. You need something ultra-low mass to max out your Phillips. Any of the ones he mentions would be great, or also a Hadcock.
Marco.
So whats the maths to work out this frequency then?
I'm playing with some of these Sony carts now and I'm intrigued to work out if technically speaking they are a better match to the arm?
ones a vl-32g
the other a
xl-15
info here
http://www.vinylengine.com/cartridge_database.php?m=Sony&t=any&mod=&sort=1&Search=Search&sty=&ovlo=&ovhi=&can=&dclo=&dchi=&stid=&masslo=&masshi=¬es=&prlo=&prhi=
At the risk of boring the pants off you, the formula to work out the resonant frequency of a cartridge arm combination is as follows:
resonant frequency (in Hz) = 1/(2*pi*(sqrt(C*M))),
where pi = 3.1416, C is the compliance of the stylus suspension, quoted in cm/dyne and M is the total mass (= cartridge mass + effective arm mass).
These days compliance is quoted in cu (compliance units). To convert this to a compliance expressed as cm/dyne, you need to multiply by 10^-6, thus 10cu = 10*10^-6 cm/dyne.
However things are not quite as simple as that. The compliance figure usually quoted is the static compliance. This is the figure quoted by US and UK cartridge manufacturers (as it is a simpler measurement to make). What we need is the dynamic compliance, preferably one pertinent to a frequency of 10Hz. Japanese cartridge manufacturers tend to quote figures at 100Hz (why, I don't know - but there you are). As a rough rule of thumb:
Dynamic compliance at 10Hz = 1/2 * static compliance = 1.5 -2.0 * dynamic compliance at 100Hz.
So for your G412, The Gramaphone magazine measured a compliance at 100Hz of 12.5cu. The equivalent compliance at 10Hz would therefore be in the range 19 -25cu. The mass of the cartridge is 6g and the effective mass of the Regas 301 arm is 11.5g making a total of 17.5g.
Let us take a 'middling value' for the complaince of 22cu, then:
resonant frequency = 1/(6.28*(sqrt((22*10^-6)*17.5))) = 8.1Hz.
This is a bit on the low side: ideally it should lay between 10 and 12Hz, though some would put it higher at 16Hz.
To help you with your calculations the product of the compliance (in cu) and the total mass should lay between 176 and 250.
Lesson over.
Reid Malenfant
02-04-2011, 18:41
Just console yourself Hamish that that calculation of Barry's is vastly simpler than what i had to put up with designing bass reflex or 4th order bandpass enclosures with a calculator :eyebrows:
Thank god for the internet & winISD 4065
Apologies for the drift...
The Vinyl Adventure
02-04-2011, 18:46
I'm 99.9999% sure it doesn't ;)
Andre is right about tonearms. You need something ultra-low mass to max out your Phillips. Any of the ones he mentions would be great, or also a Hadcock.
Marco.
im sure theres no filter in my pre amp ...
but there might be somthing in my phono pre??
The Vinyl Adventure
02-04-2011, 18:47
so really, by rights, it shouldnt sound good? it that what we are trying to say?
Rare Bird
02-04-2011, 18:49
To be honest Hamish i've has some real technical mismatch disasters that just sounded great
To be honest Hamish i've has some real technical mismatch disasters that just sounded great
Yes I would agree - it's best not to get too bound up with these calculations. It all depends on the amplitude at resonance (i.e. the Q value), how the turntable is isolated from the room and if there is some damping of the arm pivot. Only if you see the arm 'trembling', should you worry.
As for technical mismatches - well for a while I used a Linn Asak in an SME arm (with damper). The Linn dealer said it could not be done and wouldn't work! Hell what do they know?
Regards
The Vinyl Adventure
02-04-2011, 19:21
Yes I would agree - it's best not to get too bound up with these calculations. It all depends on the amplitude at resonance (i.e. the Q value), how the turntable is isolated from the room and if there is some damping of the arm pivot. Only if you see the arm 'trembling', should you worry.
As for technical mismatches - well for a while I used a Linn Asak in an SME arm (with damper). The Linn dealer said it could not be done and wouldn't work! Hell what do they know?
Regards
at last, a useful, tangible bit of info ;)
today i have listened to these carts with the following results
shure m75 - not to bad, a little warm
ortofon 2m red - fine, bit hifi, bit harsh
sony xl15 - very harsh (probably because it was NOS)
sony vl-32g - quiet, maybe broken (edit ... just noticed the stylus wasnt clicked into place :doh:)
sony vm10p - SHIT, sounded like a toy
nagaoka mp-11 - boron - fine, bit cuddly
phillips 412 - Funk Meister!!! :)
the phillips wins!
spendorman
02-04-2011, 20:22
Somewhere? I probably have a magazine test of the later GP cartridges, think they came out pretty well. If you like the GP421, you may like the Shure M95HE.
I have a GP422 in a Thorens TD166 mk2, works very nicely.
I'm wondering if anyone is even speaking English on this forum any more? :lol:
I'm wondering if anyone is even speaking English on this forum any more? :lol:
Me two, it either sounds good or shit, simples no? Anul yes?
I'm wondering if anyone is even speaking English on this forum any more? :lol:
Qué?
Me two, it either sounds good or shit, simples no? Anul yes?
"...is anyone speaking English on this forum anymore?" Clearly not - I assume you meant to write:
"Me too, it either sounds good or shit; simple - no? Anal - yes?
Yes, at times an attention to detail might appear to be 'anal', but if you're not interested in the answer, don't ask for advice.
Av no slabbered yon gibber fur donkees... Ah gist bump ma gums in pure gallis Glesga chanter, so thon glachit bawbags fae Engerlund huvnae goat a scooby whit am chunterin oan aboot :eyebrows:
Marco.
Av no slabbered yon gibber fur donkees... Ah gist bump ma gums in pure gallis Glesga chanter, so thon glachit bawbags fae Engerlund huvnae goat a scooby whit am chunterin oan aboot :eyebrows:
Marco.
Understood dear boy - understood! ;)
Translate it then, word for word! ;)
Marco.
Translate it then, word for word! ;)
Marco.
Word for word? Umm - tricky, but subject to licence, the 'gist' of what you said (subject to correct transliteration on your part), might be:
"I've not (spoken) Southener's 'speak' for donkey's years. I only use my mouth (to talk) Galic Glaswegian talk." :scratch:
Lol - I'll give you 5 out of 10 and a strawberry lolly! :eyebrows:
Marco.
Lol - I'll give you 5 out of 10 and a strawberry lolly! :eyebrows:
Marco.
Oh - you hard taskmaster. I did it, having consumed a whole bottle of 2008 Blason de Bourgogne, Hautes-Côtes de Beaune. (And very nice it was too!)
Regards
The Vinyl Adventure
03-04-2011, 08:54
Av no slabbered yon gibber fur donkees... Ah gist bump ma gums in pure gallis Glesga chanter, so thon glachit bawbags fae Engerlund huvnae goat a scooby whit am chunterin oan aboot :eyebrows:
Marco.
I haven't talked like you for years, I just talk in pure glasgow talk so you gobshite(?) ballbags from England haven't got a clue what I'm going on about
The Vinyl Adventure
03-04-2011, 09:04
Me two, it either sounds good or shit, simples no? Anul yes?
Trying to expand on knowledge is not anal...
Nor is trying to expand on knowledge to get more out of a hobby...
Learning is key to further enjoyment of most things...
Unfortunatly is seems sometimes getting a straight, or indeed understandable answer is not so easy ... But that comes with the territory of trying to learn something that is seemingly quite complicated ...
Andre saved the day though and sent me a link to how to calculate compliance
And Barry told me to look out for a wobbly tonearm if anything was going wrong ... Those 2 things were all I needed!
The Vinyl Adventure
03-04-2011, 09:20
Here is a link to me sharing some of my knowledge to help people learn and get more out of thier photography (my real specialist subject) http://www.realphotographersforum.com/threads/1119-Back-to-Basics-Exposure-Part-1-Understanding-Aperture
I think it's important to learn these things to gain further enjoyment from photography ... Of course you can just put a camera in auto and shoot away ... But that isn't enough for some people!
If you read that you will see that I feel the same about photography as I do about hifi... There is a certain level of info that is useful for getting the most out of kit... I'm not so interested in the science behind it... Just the basics to understand what's going on!
I haven't talked like you for years, I just talk in pure glasgow talk so you gobshite(?) ballbags from England haven't got a clue what I'm going on about
Oooh, 7 and a half out of 10!! :clap:
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
03-04-2011, 10:38
Must be me being a 1/4 sponger, cough, I mean scottish ...
Lol! The exact translation is:
"I've not spoken that language (English) for ages. I just talk in excellent Glaswegian lingo, so those gormless English daftees don't have a clue what I'm talking about".
:eyebrows: ;)
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
08-04-2011, 17:03
I've had this thing for over a week now and it still sounds biriant!
I've even tried to convince my self I'm making it up in my head ... But then I play somthing and it sounds ace!
This is the first time in ages I haven't turned on the linn! And te first week in ages I have used the hifi for more than a short amount of time everyday!
I want to send it to mr audio origami for a MOT and a look at the stylus see how long I have it for!
Still worried about what to offer my mate for it ... Dave said a tenner ... But I feel bad only paying that much when I like it so much ...
Rare Bird
10-04-2011, 09:21
No more than a tenner Hamish i personally wouldnt give that.
The Vinyl Adventure
10-04-2011, 09:33
cool man ... cheers Andre ...
I understand Expert Styli can also re-tip mm types for under a ton, so when the diamond wears out, a new one can be fitted to the original cantilever if the suspension etc is still ok. I understand EsCo may have made a good few batches of the A&R P77 stylus too, back in the day..
The Vinyl Adventure
10-04-2011, 11:37
Esco??
Not thought about re-tiping it ... But I guess if I like the sound it's not as crazy as it would first seem ?????
I found the HiFi Choice review and the ONLY negatives preventing recommendation were to do with the stylus cut and polish and a then unfashionable high compliance, which were judged poor on the test sample. The former could be dealt with by EsCo (or possibly a Jico replacement), I'll have to look) and the latter by arm choice :)
Rare Bird
10-04-2011, 16:29
Hi Hamish
Don't quote me on this but the 'GP422' Mk.II styli should fit your 'GP412' Mk.II, the 'GP422' Mk.II styli would be a great upgrade, it has Shibata SST..The tracking force will be just the same as yours..
I'd ask your chosen supplier for compatability first..I honestly wouldnt worry about it not being New old stock tbh..I've had some fantastic compatable styli in the past..
The Vinyl Adventure
10-04-2011, 16:43
It's just finding one andre ... Any ideas if places to look ...
There's a 422mkii cart on eBay for £100!!! I ain't buyin that!!! But that's the only similar I have found on eBay (apart from a 401 on a 212 table that I bid on but lost - I only bid a tenner - just thought it was pretty)
I've just received a cheap 'original but repackaged' ATN120E stylus from Anderson's in the US for more than a tenner cheaper than European prices. The AT120E is singing in the Dual 701 as I type and it sounds sublime here, having the lightness of touch of the better Shures, but with some bass weight too (no problems in this arm) and an easy clarity that's most beguiling and definitely no "sting" as the 440MLa is reported to have on occasion. Tracking is sublime at 1.5g too and there's an airiness to it which suits old Joanie Armaplating well ;)
The Vinyl Adventure
28-03-2012, 17:23
I've been collecting
http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/b7ac1e40.jpg
http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/93fdee6f.jpg
Just got th 412 mkiii today ... It's rather nice!
Anyone know if these pinnacle jobs I picked up will any good ... And how close to the originals they will be
They are all labeled for different carts ... I have a couple of 400's a couple of 412's a 412mkii and a 422 stylus made bay them.
They were cheap so thought id get my self a back up since I seemed to have developed the vintage Philips cart fetish ...
Rare Bird
29-03-2012, 23:11
Nice one Hamish, i used to like the 412's.. However i don't expect some of the arseholes on here would give them a second look regardless of how nice they may sound, self created standards to uphold see.. :D
The Vinyl Adventure
29-03-2012, 23:26
Well I think they sound lovely and and all that stuff has cost me around £50 ... I think I'm winning even if no one else does (excluding you of course ;))
Don't suppose you know anything about these pinnacle stylus do you Andre?
The Vinyl Adventure
29-03-2012, 23:30
... Also, in terms of sound is there any sure way of identifying an ageing stylus ...
The spare one sounds different (all be it only slightly) to the one on the cart when I got it ... I'm trying to work out if it is because it is older or newer
Rare Bird
30-03-2012, 00:05
Don't suppose you know anything about these pinnacle stylus do you Andre?
No i dont. Your right they are loverly. If you see a '422' let me know buddy but i guess you'll want it first :D
Don't worry about the deck situation ive got something in the pipeline hopefully another by next week.. :eyebrows:
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