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Thread: Opinions on Tribute SUTs

  1. #31
    Join Date: Nov 2008

    Location: belgrade serbia

    Posts: 840
    I'm gordan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arkless Electronics View Post
    Manufacturers can themselves be the source of bollocks... for marketing reasons etc

    how strange
    Gordan.
    Speakers: Oris Swing MkII
    Amps: Thomas Mayer 300b/ Hiraga La Maison de L'Audiophile 20
    Preamp: Silver AVC by eng. Ferenc Lazar
    Phono Preamp: Shishido LCR by Solaja Audio
    Decks: Garrard 301 Martin Bastin reworked/plinthed with Fidelity Research FR64fx
    Garrard 401 in eng Ferenc Lazar solid wenge plinth with SME 3012/2
    Cartridges: SPU Spirit/ Koetsu Black revisited by eng. Salai/ Miyajima Shilabe
    Step Up Transformers: Tango MCT 999/ Ortofon T-5000/ Lumiere SUT
    Digital: Shigaclone by eng. Ferenc Lazar with Lampizator Amber II
    Wires: of sufficient length

  2. #32
    Join Date: Oct 2012

    Location: NE England

    Posts: 4,173
    I'm Jez.

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    As someone with the rare experience of having tried high end head amps as well as high end SUT's I'm surprised The Great Leader hasn't opined his ha'porth as yet on the subject....
    Arkless Electronics-Engineered to be better. Tel. 01670 530674 (after 1pm)

    Modded Thorens TD150, Audio Technica AT-1005 MkII, Technics EPC-300MC, Arkless Hybrid MC phono stage, Arkless passive pre, Arkless 50WPC Class A SS power amp, (or) Arkless modded Leak Stereo 20, Modded Kef Reference 105/3's
    ReVox PR99, Studer B62, Ferrograph Series 7, Tandberg TCD440, Hitachi FT-5500MkI, also FT-5500MkII
    Digital: Yamaha CDR-HD1500 (Digital Swiss army knife-CD recorder, player, hard drive, DAC and ADC in one), PC files via 24/96 sound card and SPDIF, modded Philips CD850, modded Philips CD104, modded DPA Little Bit DAC. Sennheiser HD580 cans with Arkless Headphone amp.
    Cables- free interconnects that come with CD players, mains leads from B&Q, dead kettles etc, extension leads from Tesco

  3. #33
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Alicante. Spain.

    Posts: 1,885
    I'm Adrian.

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    I like the example of musical fidelity and the tuner, but would argue that although their published reasons for doing it were dubious to say the least, there might have been a slight difference in performance by taking out the PSU, and hence positive reviews.

    Without turning this (my original thread) into a sales pitch for arkless id like to ask what the quality of the components inside the box is, as I believe that there are sonic. differences between caps, resistors etc, id expect some 'boutique' components in there (nowt truly exotic, Elna cerafine for example) - if not would a unit with higher quality parts be available?

    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
    Technics SP10 mk2
    Jan Allaerts MC 1 Boron mk1 cart
    Miyajima Shilabe cart
    Hashimoto HM-X SUT
    Siggwan (gimballed not unipivot) Cocobola 12"
    Aurorasound Vida LCR Phonostage
    The Truth linestage
    Dave Slagle Autoformer Volume Controller
    Cary 805c SET amps
    Audio Note ANe-SPX speakers
    Townshend Isolda speaker cables
    Cardas Golden Presence interconnects

  4. #34
    Join Date: Oct 2012

    Location: NE England

    Posts: 4,173
    I'm Jez.

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    Quote Originally Posted by farflungstar View Post
    I like the example of musical fidelity and the tuner, but would argue that although their published reasons for doing it were dubious to say the least, there might have been a slight difference in performance by taking out the PSU, and hence positive reviews.

    Without turning this (my original thread) into a sales pitch for arkless id like to ask what the quality of the components inside the box is, as I believe that there are sonic. differences between caps, resistors etc, id expect some 'boutique' components in there (nowt truly exotic, Elna cerafine for example) - if not would a unit with higher quality parts be available?

    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
    Oops... sorry for hijacking your thread There's a thread documenting, with photos, the build of the last head amp I made here http://theartofsound.net/forum/showt...for-a-customer actually there a couple of Elna Cerafines in it! Good guess!

    Very few of the components are ones directly in the signal path so it would be comparatively cheap to use Vishay bulk foils (about £12 each V 3P each for normal ones ) and the only capacitor in the signal path is the output cap (Panasonic polypropylene used in this build) so not too expensive if one really wanted to fit boutique caps here. Most of the complexity etc is in the voltage regulation and power supply circuitry.
    Arkless Electronics-Engineered to be better. Tel. 01670 530674 (after 1pm)

    Modded Thorens TD150, Audio Technica AT-1005 MkII, Technics EPC-300MC, Arkless Hybrid MC phono stage, Arkless passive pre, Arkless 50WPC Class A SS power amp, (or) Arkless modded Leak Stereo 20, Modded Kef Reference 105/3's
    ReVox PR99, Studer B62, Ferrograph Series 7, Tandberg TCD440, Hitachi FT-5500MkI, also FT-5500MkII
    Digital: Yamaha CDR-HD1500 (Digital Swiss army knife-CD recorder, player, hard drive, DAC and ADC in one), PC files via 24/96 sound card and SPDIF, modded Philips CD850, modded Philips CD104, modded DPA Little Bit DAC. Sennheiser HD580 cans with Arkless Headphone amp.
    Cables- free interconnects that come with CD players, mains leads from B&Q, dead kettles etc, extension leads from Tesco

  5. #35
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Alicante. Spain.

    Posts: 1,885
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    Don't worry you didn't hijack it.
    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
    Technics SP10 mk2
    Jan Allaerts MC 1 Boron mk1 cart
    Miyajima Shilabe cart
    Hashimoto HM-X SUT
    Siggwan (gimballed not unipivot) Cocobola 12"
    Aurorasound Vida LCR Phonostage
    The Truth linestage
    Dave Slagle Autoformer Volume Controller
    Cary 805c SET amps
    Audio Note ANe-SPX speakers
    Townshend Isolda speaker cables
    Cardas Golden Presence interconnects

  6. #36
    Join Date: Jul 2012

    Location: Wimborne

    Posts: 701
    I'm Alex.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by farflungstar View Post
    I like the example of musical fidelity and the tuner, but would argue that although their published reasons for doing it were dubious to say the least, there might have been a slight difference in performance by taking out the PSU, and hence positive reviews.

    Without turning this (my original thread) into a sales pitch for arkless id like to ask what the quality of the components inside the box is, as I believe that there are sonic. differences between caps, resistors etc, id expect some 'boutique' components in there (nowt truly exotic, Elna cerafine for example) - if not would a unit with higher quality parts be available?

    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
    It would appear you're getting interested. If you didn't live so far away I would be happy to loan you mine for a trial run. It really is a great bit of kit, I can't recommend it high enough. Go for it

  7. #37
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Alicante. Spain.

    Posts: 1,885
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    Weighing up options, researching, cogitating...
    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
    Technics SP10 mk2
    Jan Allaerts MC 1 Boron mk1 cart
    Miyajima Shilabe cart
    Hashimoto HM-X SUT
    Siggwan (gimballed not unipivot) Cocobola 12"
    Aurorasound Vida LCR Phonostage
    The Truth linestage
    Dave Slagle Autoformer Volume Controller
    Cary 805c SET amps
    Audio Note ANe-SPX speakers
    Townshend Isolda speaker cables
    Cardas Golden Presence interconnects

  8. #38
    montesquieu Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by alcarmichael View Post
    Surely that's only your opinion. Have you tried the Arkless head amp in your system against a Tribute SUT? I have and I prefer the Arkless head amp.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Alex I'm quite curious as to the rest of your system when you made that comparison.

    I've done it time and and time again, something repeated at intervals over many years, SUTS against both headamps and MC stages, compared using a whole raft of high-end cartridges from an Io2 to Koetsus to Miyajima to top end SPUs - and always the high-end SUTS always come out on top ... I've owned a few nice SUTs, not just the HM7s but Kondo-era AN-S6c, the internals in my current EAR 912, S&B TX103, Jorgen Schou for Ortofon SPU, quite a few others ... beating MC inputs and head amps alike essentially every time.

    Plus points for the best SUTs - quietness (once you get them positioned), immediacy, dynamics, musicality. Down side is principally matching, both impedance and gain - easy to get it not so much wrong, but 'not quite right' with sub-optimal results.

    Plus points for head amps - a lot less faff when it comes to hum, much more flexibility in matching with a variety of cartridges, and unquestionably more sound per pound. Down sides - hiss, and the ineffable ... I don't know, hifi wise they can be very good indeed, but musically even really good ones like the Slee Elevator (which I realy rate, don't get me wrong) just fall short of the very best SUTs for me. In my experience of course. But you pays your money ...


    Quote Originally Posted by Arkless Electronics View Post

    I have not done any sort of search as to what's available new today in the realms of head amps and the only "high end" head amps I personally know of (I'm sure others will enlighten me on this) are the one I make and an even more expensive one from Paul Haynes designs. I recall in a long phone call from Marco a fair while ago him saying that both mine and the Paul Haynes unit had convinced him that a good head amp can be a least as good as the best SUT's... and this was in comparison with the top of the range Ortofon ST80 at around £1400. Marco actually bought the Paul Haynes unit! (double the £750 which mine costs).
    I wouldn't put the ST80 anywhere near the top rank of SUTs, it's overpriced by a mile by the sound of the one I heard (with an SPU incidentally).

    I have heard great things about the Paul Hynes BTW I would love to hear one.

  9. #39
    Join Date: Nov 2008

    Location: belgrade serbia

    Posts: 840
    I'm gordan.

    Default

    oh, ST-80 is now the benchmark SUT?

    then you really don't need a 750 UKP product to put it against (let alone paul heynes' designs which are FWIW a top notch), you can save 90% and knock yourself for an afternoon a headamp with a handful of parts - 2 x 2SK170, a few resistors and caps plus a 24V battery supply, just as jean hiraga did it some 35 yrs ago. i doubt you would spend more than a 50 quid, a chasis included.

    or buy yourself a kit for $49:
    http://diyaudioprojects.com/Solid/JF...re-Preamp-Kit/
    Gordan.
    Speakers: Oris Swing MkII
    Amps: Thomas Mayer 300b/ Hiraga La Maison de L'Audiophile 20
    Preamp: Silver AVC by eng. Ferenc Lazar
    Phono Preamp: Shishido LCR by Solaja Audio
    Decks: Garrard 301 Martin Bastin reworked/plinthed with Fidelity Research FR64fx
    Garrard 401 in eng Ferenc Lazar solid wenge plinth with SME 3012/2
    Cartridges: SPU Spirit/ Koetsu Black revisited by eng. Salai/ Miyajima Shilabe
    Step Up Transformers: Tango MCT 999/ Ortofon T-5000/ Lumiere SUT
    Digital: Shigaclone by eng. Ferenc Lazar with Lampizator Amber II
    Wires: of sufficient length

  10. #40
    Join Date: Jul 2012

    Location: Wimborne

    Posts: 701
    I'm Alex.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by montesquieu View Post
    Alex I'm quite curious as to the rest of your system when you made that comparison.

    I've done it time and and time again, something repeated at intervals over many years, SUTS against both headamps and MC stages, compared using a whole raft of high-end cartridges from an Io2 to Koetsus to Miyajima to top end SPUs - and always the high-end SUTS always come out on top ... I've owned a few nice SUTs, not just the HM7s but Kondo-era AN-S6c, the internals in my current EAR 912, S&B TX103, Jorgen Schou for Ortofon SPU, quite a few others ... beating MC inputs and head amps alike essentially every time.

    Plus points for the best SUTs - quietness (once you get them positioned), immediacy, dynamics, musicality. Down side is principally matching, both impedance and gain - easy to get it not so much wrong, but 'not quite right' with sub-optimal results.

    Plus points for head amps - a lot less faff when it comes to hum, much more flexibility in matching with a variety of cartridges, and unquestionably more sound per pound. Down sides - hiss, and the ineffable ... I don't know, hifi wise they can be very good indeed, but musically even really good ones like the Slee Elevator (which I realy rate, don't get me wrong) just fall short of the very best SUTs for me. In my experience of course. But you pays your money ...




    I wouldn't put the ST80 anywhere near the top rank of SUTs, it's overpriced by a mile by the sound of the one I heard (with an SPU incidentally).

    I have heard great things about the Paul Hynes BTW I would love to hear one.
    Hi Tom,

    The rest of my system was a modified 1210 as source, the head amp's and SUT's were into a Croft 25R/RS into a Croft series 7 to B&W 805's. If you're interested in giving the Arkless a go you're welcome to try it.

    Cheers,
    Alex

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