Audio Myth's Dispelled?

[Marco]

Lol - that's your prerogative, age before beauty and all that!

I look forward to your erudite scribbles later.

Marco.

[Rare Bird]

Originally Posted by Barry

I believe that we should be guided by our ears, but should also be aware that we can sometimes be fooled on initial hearing into thinking that a change made is for the better. After a period of time revert back to the original status and see if the change was genuine.

That's intresting Barry, after my long voyage through the years of upgrading (Going thru the motions) it was only a few years back i decided to take a trip down memory lane, revisiting a few early systems i used to have only to realise i'd totally not upgraded through the years but in reality degraded (to my ears)! Now for me it's implementing various aspects of new technology with the older to create a concoction of loverlyness

[Marco]

I think you've misunderstood Barry there, Andre!

Marco.

[Rare Bird]

Originally Posted by Marco

I think you've misunderstood Barry there, Andre!

Marco.

I understood that checking back to see if any upgrade is worthwhile, just thought id chuck in that one..

[electric beach]

Originally Posted by Andre

I understood that checking back to see if any upgrade is worthwhile, just thought id chuck in that one..

I have always kept the album that I used to audition my first amp and CD player 30 years ago, using a few specific tracks for particular qualities that I grew to know very well and to have some kind of constant reference. Well, it seemed like a good idea at the time.

It feels like I've come a long, long way since but putting that disc on is a big reality check. It never seems to be quite as amazing as I expect it will be - or should be after all the upgrades. Perhaps all those post component change comments of "Well, I can't hear any difference - but so long as you're happy. Can that be it now?" had merit after all!

In the video one of the magic treatment examples they ridicule is the Synergistic Research Acoustic ART room treatment system (the tuning bowls). I heard this used with Zingali speakers at the Heathrow show two consequetive years and both times I thought they had one of the best sounds of the show. They demonstrated taking the devices away one by one, touching nothing else and you didn't need to strain or focus on the changes to hear how the presentation of the sound changed. Dramatically. With all devices removed, obviously having the full treatment as the reference, the system seemed nothing special at all; soundstage collapsed, presence and projection into the room disappeared. The illusion of holographic reality evaporated before our ears.

Valerie came to her first Hi Fi shows those years. The other day I asked her which was the most impressive thing that she'd heard from all her exposure to different replay systems and she nominated that system sound and in particular the effect of those impossibly named little bowls. For me, their inclusion of the ART system in their examples of ridiculous, ineffective pseudo tweaks completely undermined their credibility for every other word spoken.

There's a big difference between an enquiring attitude and a mission to find confirmation that what you already believe is correct.

If you think you already know, then you're not looking.

[Barry]

Originally Posted by electric beach

I have always kept the album that I used to audition my first amp and CD player 30 years ago, using a few specific tracks for particular qualities that I grew to know very well and to have some kind of constant reference. Well, it seemed like a good idea at the time.

It feels like I've come a long, long way since but putting that disc on is a big reality check. It never seems to be quite as amazing as I expect it will be - or should be after all the upgrades. Perhaps all those post component change comments of "Well, I can't hear any difference - but so long as you're happy. Can that be it now?" had merit after all!

In the video one of the magic treatment examples they ridicule is the Synergistic Research Acoustic ART room treatment system (the tuning bowls). I heard this used with Zingali speakers at the Heathrow show two consequetive years and both times I thought they had one of the best sounds of the show. They demonstrated taking the devices away one by one, touching nothing else and you didn't need to strain or focus on the changes to hear how the presentation of the sound changed. Dramatically. With all devices removed, obviously having the full treatment as the reference, the system seemed nothing special at all; soundstage collapsed, presence and projection into the room disappeared. The illusion of holographic reality evaporated before our ears.

Valerie came to her first Hi Fi shows those years. The other day I asked her which was the most impressive thing that she'd heard from all her exposure to different replay systems and she nominated that system sound and in particular the effect of those impossibly named little bowls. For me, their inclusion of the ART system in their examples of ridiculous, ineffective pseudo tweaks completely undermined their credibility for every other word spoken.

There's a big difference between an enquiring attitude and a mission to find confirmation that what you already believe is correct.

If you think you already know, then you're not looking.

Were you aware of these devices, i.e. were they advertised as being used to optimise the listening enviroment? Did the demostrators announce they would be removing these devices one-by-one, and in doing so, the 'tuning' would be affected?

Sounds similar to the Linn 'one speaker' demonstrations whereby after explaining the reasons why the presence of additional (unused) speakers in the room would adversely affect the sound, they then brought in a small bookshelf speaker into the room - and guess what? everybody thought it did spoil the sound.

[StanleyB]

Originally Posted by electric beach

There's a big difference between an enquiring attitude and a mission to find confirmation that what you already believe is correct.

If you think you already know, then you're not looking.

A healthy dose of generalization there, and one that I have to disagree with.

[anthonyTD]

hi all,
i am a great believer that almost everything can be explained if we know how to test for it, and that is i feel the main problem with experiencing changes in audio that at first seem to defy logic. at the moment we humans are just starting to realise that there is a lot more going on than we originaly thought posible, if we first acknowledge and accept that there are changes happening then we need to look outside our comfort zone to try and establish what is actualy going on.
anthony,TD...

[Mr. C]

An genuine enquiring mind would set about this with a full RTA sweep of the room before application of these devices, followed by a full sweep after they have been 'placed' and a comparsion made of the resulting plots.

I did get involved in with a client who had imported these units from the US, small basement room, low ceiling height, lots of stray upper frequency dispursial modes (verity audio speakers), the chap insisted on using these tuning cups and wooden blocks, upshot 5 hours of faffing around did provide some improvement.

However, 45 mins spent correctly positioning the speakers give more satisifing results, cost your time.

Final issues were resovoled with a couple of deffuser panels on the side wall, and a absorbtion panel behind the listening position, cost was less that the tuning cups, which he resold on audiogon.