Newbie's request: is a secondhand Pro ject RPM4 a false economy?

[kendide]

Having had various cobbled together Hifi systems over the years I accidentally got back into vinyl a few years ago due to teenagers in the house suddenly deciding it was cool and buying 'vinyls' (as I've also started called records, alas) for which there was no turntable to play them.

A quick cheap set-up to satisfy them, and that allowed me to bring 30 or so LPs out of the loft, resulted in the following:

TT: Audio-Technica AT-LP60X
Amp: Denon PMA60 (largely to accommodate bluetooth)
Speakers: Q Acoustics 3020

Now, a couple of years on, I've reached the point of wanting to upgrade, which would also allow a teenager to have the original turntable in their room.

Still keeping to a very tight budget, I've been looking at Rega Planar 1 or 2 (can't go higher than that, alas) but I've seen a secondhand Pro-Ject RPM4 in good condition at half the price of a Planar 1, and wonder how the spec of an older and presumably originally pricier model plays against a newer lower-priced one.

i.e. how does the quality of an older deck, which would have been higher-spec for its time, compare against a new deck that in relative terms is lower down the pecking order?

I'm not sure I'm explaining this every well, but I'm sure people will understand...

How does a ProJect RPM 4 compare to a new Planar 1, or even Planar 2?

Thanks in advance for any advice!, Jonathan

[Lawrence001]

Both makers are respected for making good value TTs. I've only had a Project Debut Phono years ago and it was decent enough.

It really comes down to personal choice - whether you are happy to have a second hand deck presumably past its warranty with quirky looks and possibly an annoying dust cover but that might sound a bit better, or a newer more traditional looking one with warranty that maybe doesn't sound quite as good. Although whether your system is good enough to discriminate a great deal is another matter.

[willbewill]

Plus you'll need to factor in a new drive belt and stylus or cartridge.

[kendide]

Thanks both! Very helpful points.
I have taken the plunge and bought the RPM4. I'm hoping it will be a useful experience working on something that can be improved.

[AJSki2fly]

Still keeping to a very tight budget, I've been looking at Rega Planar 1 or 2 (can't go higher than that, alas) but I've seen a secondhand Pro-Ject RPM4 in good condition at half the price of a Planar 1, and wonder how the spec of an older and presumably originally pricier model plays against a newer lower-priced one.

Hi Jonathan (I did post this on your welcome thread as well and then noticed this one)

Welcome to AoS. The Pro-Ject RPM4 TT was a very good and highly recommended turntable in its day, I think it marketed for around £375 in 2002, see https://www.sarte-audio.com/sites/de...dbutiirpm4.pdf.

There are several questions that you need to consider with used turntables:-

1. Is it coming from a well cared for home, preferably one or maybe 2 owners, in other words has it been looked after? If yes, you may be onto a good one.

2. Has it ever been serviced, had drive belt replaced bearing oiled/serviced, and when was it last done? If its recent and looks in good cared for condition then check the platted freely spins(with belt removed and no signs of rumble noise from the bearing.

3. Does the platter keep accurate speed? You can download a turntable strobe sheet that you print and put on the turntable and put a TT speed strobe app onto your mobile phone, and use this to test if it runs slow or fast at 33 and 45 rpm, or if it fluctuates.

3. Check that the arm bearing is friction free and no slack, if its had lots of use then it may have seen better days, this depends on amount of use and care of it.

4. What condition is the cartridge/stylus in and how much usage? This is pretty important, you maybe buying a TT for £150-200 but if you get it home and find the stylus has had over use or just needs replacing this could be costly, remember a damaged stylus will damage you vinyl, most stylus are good for 1000-1500hours of use if cared for and not abused, this means records kept clean and free from dust and the stylus tip regularly brushed with a carbon fibre brush for that purpose. The RPM4 could have come with a Pro-Ject K4 or K6 cartridge, but could have been replaced or supplied with another make. I believe the K4 and K6 replacement stylus are hard to get, K4 is around $60 from USA. A reasonable moving magnet like the Ortofon 2M Red to Pro-Ject Pick It Pro will set you back about £100.

5. If it has a Moving Coil cartridge then does your amplifier have a MC phono stage? If not you will need to buy one or replace the cartridge?

6. Do not buy unless you can see and hear it working, unless you are confident it is a good one.

Finally to try and answer your question, which was "Rega Planar 1 or 2 (can't go higher than that, alas) but I've seen a secondhand Pro-Ject RPM4 in good condition at half the price of a Planar 1, and wonder how the spec of an older and presumably originally pricier model plays against a newer lower-priced one".

The answer in my opinion is if the RPM4 is in fact in good condition and the cartridge does not need replacing or need a new stylus, then sonically it should sound better than the Rega.

The RPM range of Pro-Ject turntable were an entry level point into what they called audiophile turntable range, and in fact they still make the range, you can pick up a Pro-Ject Carbon RPM1 for £399 or maybe less https://www.richersounds.com/project...arbon-blk.html all new and a very good Turntable. A Rega Planar 1 is £250 and Rega Planar 2 £429 and both come with a £30 Rega cartridge no match for the Ortofon 2m RED on the Carbon RPM1.

It will be interesting to hear what you do.

[Macca]

Inexpensive upgrade kit for the RPM4 here https://www.analogueseduction.net/pr...grade-kit.html

[Landloper]

Having had various cobbled together Hifi systems over the years I accidentally got back into vinyl a few years ago due to teenagers in the house suddenly deciding it was cool and buying 'vinyls' (as I've also started called records, alas) for which there was no turntable to play them.

A quick cheap set-up to satisfy them, and that allowed me to bring 30 or so LPs out of the loft, resulted in the following:

TT: Audio-Technica AT-LP60X
Amp: Denon PMA60 (largely to accommodate bluetooth)
Speakers: Q Acoustics 3020

Now, a couple of years on, I've reached the point of wanting to upgrade, which would also allow a teenager to have the original turntable in their room.

Still keeping to a very tight budget, I've been looking at Rega Planar 1 or 2 (can't go higher than that, alas) but I've seen a secondhand Pro-Ject RPM4 in good condition at half the price of a Planar 1, and wonder how the spec of an older and presumably originally pricier model plays against a newer lower-priced one.

i.e. how does the quality of an older deck, which would have been higher-spec for its time, compare against a new deck that in relative terms is lower down the pecking order?

I'm not sure I'm explaining this every well, but I'm sure people will understand...

How does a ProJect RPM 4 compare to a new Planar 1, or even Planar 2?

Thanks in advance for any advice!, Jonathan

Only anecdotal, but I had a Rega RP 2 for a day before returning it to the shop and spending a bit more on an RP3/24. The 2 sounded OK but the hum from the motor was too much for me to bear. I could have just been unlucky and bought a sub-par example. Given the choice you have presented I'd go for the RPM4 anyway.

[hifi_dave]

Despite handling and using literally thousands of Rega TTs over my lifetime, I have never had a 'hum' from any of them. If that occurred, then Rega or the stockist would replace the TT asap.

[Landloper]

Despite handling and using literally thousands of Rega TTs over my lifetime, I have never had a 'hum' from any of them. If that occurred, then Rega or the stockist would replace the TT asap.

Indeed, I returned the P2 and paid the difference between that and the RP3, with which I have been very happy for a good few years.

[hifi_dave]

Good choice.