My New Techie Basher Turntable :D

[Thermionic]

Very nice Dave, those were the days. I had a very poor cousin of that with an Acos crystal cartridge while the AT6 was considered very respectable. Though apart from the Lab 80 I also lusted after the 3000LM with its Sonotone ceramic cart.

You know I had quite forgotten, but in the States in those days they didn’t have transcription type turntables and exclusively used autochangers even for the higher end. The American guy upstairs with his big system had a Perpentum Ebener (sp?) changer and was very happy with it - odd.

[DSJR]

Not really Gino, the PE and Dual decks (which eventually melded together) were stunningly well engineered, gradually putting the auto Garrards to shame as time went on. The Dual 1019 from the mid sixties was and still is an amazingly good piece of machinery, gently changing records yet delivering a first class subjective performance still with a suitable midrange cartridge without a fussy stylus type.

The PE's were similarly constructed and significantly over-engineered. The mechs underneath were a work of art, hideously complicated looking, yet reliable I understand. As I said above, after the Lab 80, Garrard went into a decline, the sloppy tolerances of the Autoslim derivatives being carried over into the gorgeous looking but scrappy SL72/75/95/TLX3 models. The AP 76 I had was plagued with the classic (for Garrards) trip pawl problems, yet a pretty well mechanically identical SL95B "Module" I owned later was perfect in this respect (I should have kept this one as the platter barely rocked and the arm was fine).

For proper HiFi grade autochangers which make superbly good single players as well, you can't beat the early to mid 70's Duals. Anything from the 1216 upwards (I don't know the ones under this) is a goodie and I'll never sell my 701, which sounds so good with cartridges it was never designed for... Dual later went the Garrard way and styling took over from the basic engineering for a while. the 505 series looks like a Dual, but the pressed top plate was thinner and the tonearms more resonant in the headshell/headpieces they used. A 505-3 cannot sound better than it does with an Ortofon OM20, anything better being lost, whereas the 701 changes a lot of its character with the cartridge and mat used with it.

By the way Barry, when my Koetsu Black was working on both channels, it sounded incredible in the 701. I wouldn't trust it in the AT6 though

[Thermionic]

All interesting Dave and I naturally agree with you about the Duals.

I suppose the point I was making was that the yanks seemed in the 50s and 60s not to revere the ‘transcription’ type (non automatic) turntable as we did.

The PE deck that the guy had upstairs while no doubt nicely engineered looked rather like a BSR Monarch and could not be compared to say a Lenco or Connoisseur (or Dual) of the day. From what I recall of my copy of Audio Engineering for 1951 there were lots of ads for Garrard changers as a Hi-Fi music source and the only single players were battleships for broadcast use.

[SPS]

you lads keep talking about some grand old decks... i have a pe 2020.. its a lovely looking thing.. all brushed stainless... i saw it in my mates place... and he eventually sold it to me... its gone from the top of his wardrobe to my garage loft...

one day...
i would guess its on the lines of the gl75 performance wise..

i would also guess the tone arm is the weak point..

i think i must have a deck fettish...there must be 20 or more around the house

[michaelhigh]

All interesting Dave and I naturally agree with you about the Duals.

I suppose the point I was making was that the yanks seemed in the 50s and 60s not to revere the ‘transcription’ type (non automatic) turntable as we did.

The PE deck that the guy had upstairs while no doubt nicely engineered looked rather like a BSR Monarch and could not be compared to say a Lenco or Connoisseur (or Dual) of the day. From what I recall of my copy of Audio Engineering for 1951 there were lots of ads for Garrard changers as a Hi-Fi music source and the only single players were battleships for broadcast use.

I own a rather beat-up Dual 1225 that's autofunction is awry; but from hanging out on the AudioKarma site I met a guy there they call bohhey who lives in Ohio. He is regarded as THE Dual expert, and for roughly $135+ US (S/H and parts extra) he can overhaul any Dual, regardless of condition, and this man's reputation for quality packing and reliable service comes very highly-recommended. Heads-up to anyone who needs an old fave idler worked on...Tell him michaelhigh sent you and maybe he'll discount my service call (heh)...

[DSJR]

The Dual cueing lift-pin has two adjustments, one on the top plate for users and another finger nut around the pin itself. if these get messed up the mech won't function properly.



The other famous part is the "Steurpimpel," which is a rubber cap on the spring loaded friction pin that is pushed and pulled by the mech when cycling. Failure of this part, which happened ten years ago on my 701, causes the arm not to move back and forth when cycling. I "repaired" mine by fining a ball-pen refill tube of the correct diameter, trimming it to shape and pressing over the end of the friction pin. The 701 has worked flawlessly since then.



Apart from arm-mass, which is desirable these days, the old PE deck may well be an excellent machine as long as the idler hasn't gone off and the motor doesn't vibrate..

[jandl100]

Oh my gosh - this thread is a bit of a downer for me, I'm afraid.

Reminds me too much of grey-skied, rainy interminable Sunday afternoons when I was a nipper, for some reason!

But I'm glad that the rest of you are having fun.

[DSJR]

Be warned, these Garrards breed.....

I've just bought an AT60mk2 in plinth for the hugely sum of 99p! It "features" bias correction and a cueing device...

Hi-Res Beatles memory stick? Forget it! the ONLY way to hear their early recordings is on an early 60's record player

[Beobloke]

Be warned, these Garrards breed.....

I've just bought an AT60mk2 in plinth for the hugely sum of 99p! It "features" bias correction and a cueing device...

Good man -well done!

Oh, and pictures please, or it didn't happen......

[DSJR]

It hasn't arrived yet, but there'll be foaties as soon as it's here.