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Thread: New mains block

  1. #41
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    And further,why does Marco tell us that the earth spike buried in his garden makes a significant improvement to his system?
    Because it (measurably) lowers the impedance on the mains supply to my system, and more importantly, provides a 'cleaner' earth path for the components connected to it by reducing circuit-borne noise?

    Mind you, the latter is simply a hypothesis...

    I can clearly hear the results, however, when I connect and disconnect the incoming earth wire (from my dedicated earth in the garden) that's connected to the separate CU supplying my system, when the system is playing music... It's something I can do in seconds, and the results are most obvious

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  2. #42
    Join Date: Mar 2008

    Location: Galashiels

    Posts: 13,669
    I'm inthescottishmafia.

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    Yes,that's the point I was getting at,that it lowers impedance.To go back to my original comment,it may be that star earthing would explain what Marco hears with the mains blocks he's used.

  3. #43
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Hi Mark,

    In an amp you have loads of circuits that often need a ground potential, some of these circuits generate quite a bit of noise (think zeners as voltage references or regulators) & some a pretty quiet (the ground for the input & feedback loop if ground referenced).

    Rather than join these grounds together on a PCB or whatever it's much better to keep them seperate & only join them at one low impedance point. That way the noisy circuits don't inject interference into the quiet ones & you have a better sounding amp
    I like that, and it seems as good a hypothesis as any as to why having a dedicated earth for a hi-fi system, to my ears, unquestionably significantly improves its sonic performance.

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  4. #44
    Join Date: Jul 2010

    Location: North Cambs UK, Earth, Sol, Orion - Cygnus arm of galaxy

    Posts: 11,166
    I'm MadeOfDeadGiantStarsThatExplodedEonsAgo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Hi Mark,

    I like that, and it seems as good a hypothesis as any as to why having a dedicated earth for a hi-fi system, to my ears, unquestionably significantly improves its sonic performance.
    I think you'll find i made the same comment about your dedicated earth on the previous page in relation to Alis' question

    It makes a lot of sense, but then as we have discovered, logic can be refuted
    Bests, Mark



    "We must believe in free will. We have no choice" Isaac Bashevis Singer

  5. #45
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Indeed. Logic is sometimes rather overrated

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  6. #46
    Join Date: Mar 2008

    Location: Galashiels

    Posts: 13,669
    I'm inthescottishmafia.

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    Well the question as rhetorical,the lowering of impedance and possible lowering of the noise floor was the point I was trying to make!

  7. #47
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 31,857
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

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    Gentlemen

    I think we have to be very careful about what earthing systems we are talking about. In the UK there are three that can, and are, used: TN-C, TN-S and TN-CS. They are all different! To understand these various earthing arrrangements see: http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Book/5.6.3.htm#Top

    From my visit to Marco's, I suspect that the provision of his local supply supports the TN-CS system. The addition of an additional earth spike could lower the source impedance. IEE regulations require such TN-CS systems to have an earth loop impedance of < 0.32 Ohm. I do not know of requirement on the the source impedance.

    In my location, my mains supply uses a TN-S earthing system. IEE regulations require the earth loop impedance to be < 0.8 Ohm. I have measured my mains supply to have the following: -

    Earth loop resistance: 0.2 - 0.3 Ohm

    Source impedance: 0.21 - 0.25 Ohm.

    Unless your mains supply system supports a TN-CS system, 'beefing up' the earth continuity conductor will only improve the earth leakage path impedance and not the mains supply source impedance. Under normal conditions there will not be any fault conditions demanding current flow to earth, so the latter is largely irrelevant. There will, however, be a slightly reduced source impedance (since the neutral return is in parallel with the earth fault return path).

    There is, and this is very important, a slight risk in providing additional earth spikes to TN-CS systems. In the event (albeit unlikely) of a fault in the neutral conductor, ALL the return current current from all those consumers sharing the phase of your mains supply, could travel through the 'earthed' metalwork of your equipment, in its attempt to find its way back to the transformer in the substation. Under this fault condition, all the metalwork of your equipment will be raised to the mains supply voltage of 230 - 240 V!

    YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED! Don't mess around with the earthing arrangements, unless you know what they are and what you are doing! If you are in the slightest doubt, ask your local electrician for advice.

    The AoS membership is approaching 3000 - we don't wan't it to go in the other direction due to ill-informed messing about with the mains suppy and earthing provisions!

    Regards
    Barry

  8. #48
    Join Date: Mar 2008

    Location: Galashiels

    Posts: 13,669
    I'm inthescottishmafia.

    Default

    Well said Barry,we've been here before but it bears repeating.

  9. #49
    Join Date: Feb 2016

    Location: Dorset, UK

    Posts: 375
    I'm Richard.

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    hi guys.
    I am just about to make some power block myself. What you think about the FN2060-12/06 EMI. Any good to fit these in?


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