End-user satisfaction? What about THIS ignored commercial relationship?

[Neil McCauley]

The audio retailer as a customer of the audio supplier:

Hello again.

Having earlier today asked forum members to answer a couple of questions, it struck me that perhaps I should return the favour.

I am inviting you to post questions to me on this forum about any aspect of the relationship between the supplier (maker, importer or distributor) and the retailer. This is an aspect which although crucial to the well-being of the end-user (especially when product reliability under warranty becomes an issue) is rarely discussed.

Would you like me to shed some light?

To keep this within legal bounds, and to avoid brand-evangelical nonsense creeping in, I will not be answering questions that relate to a specific supplier.

Thus if you are curious as to why, during my Subjective Audio days, Naim said they’d never deal with me, nor Rega for that matter, or in later years why I gave up representing STAX, despite the fact that according to STAX Japan I was their Global #1 reseller – all of that will remain a mystery.

Meanwhile, ask away. I promise to give the answer to any sensible question both thought and care.

Thank you

HP
enquiries@Stereonow.co.uk

[tfarney]

Howard, you're on a roll today. It seemed earlier as if you were using us for market research...which is my game, you're supposed to let me ask the questions for you, at a very high hourly rate! Now you offer payback. Good man. But I don't have any questions unless you can tell me how to get some Harbeths very, very, cheap. Carry on....

Tim

[Filterlab]

Howard; what criteria is a potential importer judged on before given sole (or any) import rights?

My reason for the question is that when it came to locating my Revel speakers (which I dearly dearly love in every way) I had trouble finding anywhere local that stocked them. In the end I had to go to a dealer (not a good one in my opinion) a long way away and suffer poor customer service. Is reputation not factored in at all?


Cheers!

[WikiBoy]

Hi Howard

What is the point of a distributor and retailer when the customer can buy the product from the manufacturer?

We are in and e-world now.

[Snoopdog]

Richard,

Without wishing to cramp Howard's style (which he has in spades I might add) I would only say that yes, we do live in an e-world but that is to over simplify the manufacturer/consumer relationship.

My own view, having spent over 30 years and many thousands of pounds as a consumer is that a good retailer is very hard to find. Subjective Audio was my sole supplier of 'toys' during the 80's. A decade in which I bought a Linn/Meridian active system, Audio Research preamp, Oxford Acoustics turntable/SME V/Koetsu mc cartidge from Howard.

You ask what is the point of a dealer? Well Howard was that rare breed of dealer who was always polite, knowledgeable and helpful and IMHO went the extra mile to serve his customers (literally! He turned up at my home one night with a curry and the manufacturers of my turntable for a demonstration!).

This is very rare today and what concerns me is the relationship between the ditributor/ importer and retailer. Yes, you can buy from a manufacturer abroad and maybe make a saving once you have paid shipping, import duty and VAT. The problem arises when you want your product serviced or repaired if it should become faulty. The resultant cost of returning your equipment to the source, especially in the USA may prove prohibitively expensive and eat into the initial saving that you made at the time of purchase.

That's if the manufacturer will deal with you in the first place. Many will not even speak to you as a customer of their products if they have a UK appointed importer/distributor.

My complaint is that our hobby/industry seems over-populated with complete ****holes who have a virtual stranglehold on some very desirable imported exotica.

I can think of one in particular who is very rude, even if you are spending megabucks, and who even his declining number of retailers dread talking to if a problem should occur.

What strikes me as odd is that do the manufacturers abroad realise that their brand name, because it is associated with a particular distributor, is suffering and with it sales of their products in the UK market because of eccentric behaviour?

[Central Audio]

I can think of one in particular who is very rude, even if you are spending megabucks, and who even his declining number of retailers dread talking to if a problem should occur.


Bloody hell i wonder who that could be

[Filterlab]

[Togil]

It's particularly annoying when the distributor is sole distributor for the whole of Europe !

PS Snoopdog I agree with everything you say about Howard

[WikiBoy]

Richard,

Without wishing to cramp Howard's style (which he has in spades I might add) I would only say that yes, we do live in an e-world but that is to over simplify the manufacturer/consumer relationship.

My own view, having spent over 30 years and many thousands of pounds as a consumer is that a good retailer is very hard to find. Subjective Audio was my sole supplier of 'toys' during the 80's. A decade in which I bought a Linn/Meridian active system, Audio Research preamp, Oxford Acoustics turntable/SME V/Koetsu mc cartidge from Howard.

You ask what is the point of a dealer? Well Howard was that rare breed of dealer who was always polite, knowledgeable and helpful and IMHO went the extra mile to serve his customers (literally! He turned up at my home one night with a curry and the manufacturers of my turntable for a demonstration!).

This is very rare today and what concerns me is the relationship between the ditributor/ importer and retailer. Yes, you can buy from a manufacturer abroad and maybe make a saving once you have paid shipping, import duty and VAT. The problem arises when you want your product serviced or repaired if it should become faulty. The resultant cost of returning your equipment to the source, especially in the USA may prove prohibitively expensive and eat into the initial saving that you made at the time of purchase.

That's if the manufacturer will deal with you in the first place. Many will not even speak to you as a customer of their products if they have a UK appointed importer/distributor.

My complaint is that our hobby/industry seems over-populated with complete ****holes who have a virtual stranglehold on some very desirable imported exotica.

I can think of one in particular who is very rude, even if you are spending megabucks, and who even his declining number of retailers dread talking to if a problem should occur.

What strikes me as odd is that do the manufacturers abroad realise that their brand name, because it is associated with a particular distributor, is suffering and with it sales of their products in the UK market because of eccentric behaviour?

The world is changing, it hasn't changed. In times of change there are always Luddites who don't like it, it makes them feel insecure as well as those who have been stitched up and are just beginning to realise, and no one wants to be seen as an idiot so they lock threads and similar behaviour.

I am absolutely sure that Howard did a good job and remembering him back then even though I didn't deal with him he gave priority to the customers choice and needs only partly balanced to his, where as a lot of his competitors were only interested in their own needs. Times are a changing, where does the middle man fit in now as he is just largely an on cost. A classic example is that you can buy a well known and recognised valve amp bought from China and tweaked by one of these middlemen for say £1000 from a retailer. That retailer is taking between £300 and £500 of that money. A very similar valve amp from that same Chinese manufacturer can be bought new on ebay for £300 inc shipping and import duty / vat etc, it can then be passed to one of the many tweakers around like Crofty or Michael here and for a couple of hundred transformed to something very good. So who's the munchkin? This is just an example of the way things are going, and it will change again, do you really think that Chinese company is not looking at what is going on and wont make those changes themselves, so the tweakers have to stay ahead of the game to survive. And some of this is being re-exported at a further mark up, why? because some omnipotent demigod reviewer says he liked it, how bloody daft can you get!

So we are in a transition stage, lots of retailers are still there with their mark ups, most manufacturers will still only supply through retail and distribution. BUT the likes of Linn are now exploring going direct in some markets and with some products and more and more will do it as time goes on. Look at the industry next year after a year of falling house prices and reccession, for certain it wont look the way it does now.

[Neil McCauley]

Dear all.

Thank you. Most interesting. My computer keyboard is dying. I will get a new one on Sunday. And then I do my best to provide sensible and credible answers.

Sincerely, and gratefully ....

HP