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Thread: 10 audiophile myths busted

  1. #211
    Join Date: Apr 2015

    Location: Central Virginia

    Posts: 1,736
    I'm Russell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebottle View Post
    You got me there Russel, I'm a hick

    We are not very impressionable on here, you may have noticed.
    Hi-Fi Hicks, is that an oxymoron?

    Russell

  2. #212
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

    Posts: 51,624
    I'm Geoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alphaGT View Post
    Hi-Fi Hicks, is that an oxymoron?

    Russell
    Dunno. 'Tory benevolence' is though.

  3. #213
    Join Date: Feb 2008

    Location: South Wales

    Posts: 9,151
    I'm NotTakingLifeTooSeriouslyTheseDays.

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    I have always found the Lowther sound "odd" full stop...
    Quote Originally Posted by walpurgis View Post
    Have you heard piano through Lowther horns? That's an odd experience.
    "Today scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality"
    Nikola Tesla



    Its now a conspiracy theory to believe that the Immune system is capable of doing the job it was designed to do.
    A fish is only as healthy as the water its swimming in ! [Dr Robert Young]


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  4. #214
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe View Post
    It's this 'pressure' bit I don't understand.
    It's natural to experience an element of pressure during ANY kind of test, especially if it's being conducted in a public or unfamiliar place, outwith of the comfort of your own home. Did you feel pressure when sitting exams in school? I know I did. It's human nature, as you want to do well and get [whatever it is being tested for] RIGHT.

    Now, of course it's different if you're simply blind-testing yourself at home, which shouldn't be stressful or pressurised, but as soon as the situation involves being judged by others on the results obtained, that causes pressure, and some will feel it more than others.

    I agree that demonstrating any claimed difference shouldn't be a problem, if that difference exists, and that could take the form of a simple listening test at a bake-off, which should reveal the existence of any difference or not, and is less pressurised than blind-testing, so folks should be open to that.

    As for 'night and day' differences between mains leads, that simply doesn't happen.

    If anyone is claiming that, then their system is either broken or they're simply just exaggerating. Mains leads, designed for hi-fi purposes, provide subtle but worthwhile sonic improvements, not drastic ones, the cumulative effect when used throughout a system, can be significant. However, if someone is claiming much more than that, then they're best ignored.

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  5. #215
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by George47 View Post
    Of course, some people are prone to exaggerate these differences but that does not mean they do not exist and for some, the removal of a sharp sound to something more neutral means a lot to them. I am not keen on blind tests as everytime they have been done on SS amps people were unable to tell the differences between them. Not a great advert for the test. Does a Naim, Lavardin, Pass Labs and a Class D nCore amplifier sound the same? Listen in a relaxed environment and there are differences that are easy to hear. Do a double-blind listening test and you can't tell the differences between them. If it does not work on SS amps then what chance on subtler effects with cables?

    Use the components to do what they were designed to do, play music in your hifi system. Do not worry about artificial tests that try to solve one problem by creating another.
    Spot on, George, as usual, and you make a good point about SS amps!

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  6. #216
    Join Date: Mar 2017

    Location: Seaford UK

    Posts: 1,861
    I'm Dennis.

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    The pressure to which I refer is that usually DB testing is organised by some authority, for eg., Alan Shaw was baiting his members to meet for one.

    When you have an expert, or academics, and they can often be the arrogant bully objectivists we have discussed on another thread, running a test on you, it can be intimidating and upsetting to normal perception.

    The ambient I/P ruins the perception of subtlety. Have you tried answering an exam question whilst someone is shouting at you about your abilities?

  7. #217
    Join Date: May 2009

    Location: gone away

    Posts: 4,870
    I'm joe.

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    Well, I was talking about informal, A/B comparison in your own home rather than double-blind scientifically rigorous testing in a strange/unfamiliar environment. I agree that the latter could be intimidating.

    As for tests and exams, it's many years since I've done any. These days, most academic assessments are based on coursework and 'open-book' exams, which are inherently less stressful than having to memorise shedloads of stuff and be able to call it to mind during multiple exams. Having said that, some people find it stressful having to write essays to deadlines even with all the relevant books and internet resources to hand. A spot of National Service would do them good.

  8. #218
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Vancouver, Canada

    Posts: 2,166
    I'm Alex.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    It's natural to experience an element of pressure during ANY kind of test, especially if it's being conducted in a public or unfamiliar place, outwith of the comfort of your own home. Did you feel pressure when sitting exams in school? I know I did. It's human nature, as you want to do well and get [whatever it is being tested for] RIGHT.

    Now, of course it's different if you're simply blind-testing yourself at home, which shouldn't be stressful or pressurised, but as soon as the situation involves being judged by others on the results obtained, that causes pressure, and some will feel it more than others.

    I agree that demonstrating any claimed difference shouldn't be a problem, if that difference exists, and that could take the form of a simple listening test at a bake-off, which should reveal the existence of any difference or not, and is less pressurised than blind-testing, so folks should be open to that.

    As for 'night and day' differences between mains leads, that simply doesn't happen.

    If anyone is claiming that, then their system is either broken or they're simply just exaggerating. Mains leads, designed for hi-fi purposes, provide subtle but worthwhile sonic improvements, not drastic ones, the cumulative effect when used throughout a system, can be significant. However, if someone is claiming much more than that, then they're best ignored.

    Marco.
    I find that even intimate, solipsistic A/B tests conducted in the privacy and isolation of my listening room, with no one present, can be very stressful. I purchase this new interconnect, bring it home, plug it in, and suddenly the angels sing! I hear it right way, from the moment the first sound emerges from the speakers, that now this makes it sound so much cleaner. It sparkles!

    I'm in love, head over heels, I'm so happy I made that change.

    So now the very reasonable thing would be to replace the new interconnect with the old one, to hear how much worse the sound is with the old interconnects. But I find all kinds of excuses not to do it. I push that test for later. Why? Because I feel the pressure, fearing that the newly won happiness is just a placebo.

    I'd hate to be proven wrong, to look like an idiot in my own eyes. So I continue living with this untested situation. Ah, human nature is full of folly...
    Don't you just hate it when you cannot detect where the post ends and a signature line begins?

    Alex.

  9. #219
    Join Date: Mar 2011

    Location: Reading

    Posts: 110
    I'm George.

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    Quote Originally Posted by magiccarpetride View Post
    I find that even intimate, solipsistic A/B tests conducted in the privacy and isolation of my listening room, with no one present, can be very stressful. I purchase this new interconnect, bring it home, plug it in, and suddenly the angels sing! I hear it right way, from the moment the first sound emerges from the speakers, that now this makes it sound so much cleaner. It sparkles!

    I'm in love, head over heels, I'm so happy I made that change.

    So now the very reasonable thing would be to replace the new interconnect with the old one, to hear how much worse the sound is with the old interconnects. But I find all kinds of excuses not to do it. I push that test for later. Why? Because I feel the pressure, fearing that the newly won happiness is just a placebo.

    I'd hate to be proven wrong, to look like an idiot in my own eyes. So I continue living with this untested situation. Ah, human nature is full of folly...
    Now let me make it worse. Supposing you do the blind test and you hear no difference. Do you actually find the music was always there or does the music disappear from your new cable? Imagine all that lovely music gone. Don't do it.

  10. #220
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Vancouver, Canada

    Posts: 2,166
    I'm Alex.

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    Quote Originally Posted by George47 View Post
    Now let me make it worse. Supposing you do the blind test and you hear no difference. Do you actually find the music was always there or does the music disappear from your new cable? Imagine all that lovely music gone. Don't do it.
    You've just described my worst fear!
    Don't you just hate it when you cannot detect where the post ends and a signature line begins?

    Alex.

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