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Thread: Ker pow!!!

  1. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatmarley View Post
    I'm sorry but If you mention any kit In this thread, you have to tell us what It sounds like at low volumes
    Well Matt I have the volume pretty low at the moment and the 'kit' still sounds amazing to me

    Does that help ?
    Bev


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  2. #112
    Join Date: Mar 2017

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    I'm Dennis.

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    I've read through much of the previous, but I am working so hard at difficult stuff ATM that I am sorry, but I am too tired to fine tooth comb everything and deal with every point.

    What I have stated is only that, not an entire treatise on everything which may affect sound quality at low levels.

    So it seems the claimed phenomenon is a poor performance at lower levels, and this I believe Nelson Pass addressed with First Watt amplifiers. IMD has also been mentioned, and it is subjectively horrible in nature, but objectively measurable.

    The Benchmark amp, which I posted about a while ago is absolutely impeccable from the parameter point of view, and I heard a pair in Feb last year on a 30k pair of JBLs, and could not fault it, and it is SS.

    Andrew's point above corresponds exactly with my points on dynamic range.

  3. #113
    Join Date: Apr 2011

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ninanina View Post
    Well Matt I have the volume pretty low at the moment and the 'kit' still sounds amazing to me

    Does that help ?
    Yes thanks.

  4. #114
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    Hmm...Still lots of 'convenient avoidance' and deflecting in evidence in your reply, I'm afraid, Dennis.

    Here's what I see:

    You simply cherry-picking the bits you agree with (that support your 'world view' or what you've learned from books, rather than challenges it) and ignoring the rest, including reams of technical comment, in support of valves over SS, which you seemingly would rather pretend didn't exist.

    Feel free, though, to correct me if I'm wrong......

    You mention Andrew's post, but what about my response to it?

    And you still haven't answered this, which I'm afraid I'm going to push you on, simply because I'd like to know the last time you heard a good valve amp 'in anger':

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco
    However, may I ask when was the last time you heard a well-designed valve amplifier in any kind of meaningful context? And if you have recently, please outline the amp in question, along with that context, which should include details of the partnering system. Ta!
    This appears to be an SS amp you're referring to, not a valve one (the wording is a little confusing):

    Quote Originally Posted by Pharos
    The Benchmark amp, which I posted about a while ago is absolutely impeccable from the parameter point of view, and I heard a pair in Feb last year on a 30k pair of JBLs, and could not fault it, and it is SS.


    Marco.
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  5. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Cheers, Barry. That's equally as clear and concise as what Dave said. Interesting. I suspect that slew rate is connected somehow with the point that Anthony was making earlier, in reference to voltage rails in valve amps, which makes them able to 'react' faster to transients in music, than solid-state designs, all else being equal

    Marco.
    "Today scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality"
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  6. #116
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    Lol - I'm glad that I interpreted it correctly! This learning game can be quite fun, eh?

    In my experience, having owned or listened to many good SS amps in the past, valves, at low levels in particular, simply allow music to 'breathe' better, which is why, with the right speakers, you don't have to crank up the volume, in order for recordings to 'come alive'.

    Therefore, taking the title of this thread, "Ker pow!!!", can happen whether listening at low or high levels. That's not to say, however, that when you hit the 'sweet spot', on the volume control, with a particular track, played on your system [and I believe that all recordings have this], it isn't exhilarating!

    Marco.
    http://www.thestainedglasscompany.com

    "A man is a success if he gets up in the morning and gets to bed at night, and in between he does what he wants to do" -- Milan Kundera.

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  7. #117
    Join Date: Mar 2017

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    I'm Dennis.

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    I was going to just move on and let it go, but with your post 114 you have really angered me now.

    There were so many assumptions and errors in thinking processes in your posts that I just could not bother to go through it all.

    You have been rude by implication in questioning my integrity, for eg your assertion about black and white is at least surly and churlish, and is inappropriate. This phrase is used to allude to someone seeing things in only simplistic terms, and you have no evidence that I am or have been doing such.

    What I stated was pure classically established science, that was all, and you then have seemingly extensively attacked my position, accusing me of a lack of understanding when you have repeatedly not responded to my request for a clear coherent statement of the phenomenon which the thread is alluding to.

    What I have stated is not, and never was an entire treatise, but a simplistic statement of what I believe, and what is verified by science to be true. It may be that other factors/phenomena are relevant and which are yet to be discovered.

    If I say "The sun is shining" I am saying only that; it is not an entire treatise on all aspects of weather, nor does it even allude to any other factors which the weather may contain.

    If you are as eloquent as you seem to allude to being, then please clearly state your case and your arguments, and regarding your suggestion that I re-read your threads, I think you should do just that, and reflect on your own behaviour and quality of expression.

    Innuendo and implication are often for the weak whose factual grasp and understanding are in question, and such people often use tools in argument which are dishonest.

    (See Straight and Crooked thinking by Robert Thoulness, particularly "20 dishonest tricks in argument").

    My original tactic, and it was deliberate, was to post only established science and to see what response it would provoke, and I was not disappointed by some of the resulting responses which were, though veiled, more about the subjectivity of personalities than audio concerns.

    I am concerned with the pursuit of truth in all I do in life, the 'Hi-Fi' model serving as a metaphor for objectivity, which in Hi-Fi is accurate perception of the external source.

    (I gave up valves in '70, and with the improved performance achieving about 0.1% distortion, the problems of inefficiency, microphony, aging, geta loss, drifting bias, high O.P Z, and expensive O.P transformers, have had SS ever since.)

  8. #118
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    Dear oh dear.... Have you any idea what you sound like?

    You and I are clearly VERY different people, Dennis, so I suggest we now definitely leave it there and move on, and perhaps stay out of each other's way from now on, on hi-fi threads.

    Marco.
    http://www.thestainedglasscompany.com

    "A man is a success if he gets up in the morning and gets to bed at night, and in between he does what he wants to do" -- Milan Kundera.

    BE HAPPY EVERYDAY!

  9. #119
    Join Date: Oct 2016

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    I suspect that slew rate is connected somehow with the point that Anthony was making earlier, in reference to voltage rails in valve amps, which makes them able to 'react' faster to transients in music, than solid-state designs, all else being equal
    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Lol - I'm glad that I interpreted it correctly! This learning game can be quite fun, eh?
    No Marco, that isn't correct - the slew rate of an amp has nothing to do with how high the voltage rails are. It has more to do with the time it takes to charge capacitance in various parts of the circuit.
    Actually, you can't have a high slew rate without having a wide bandwidth, and SS amps generally have a much wider bandwidth than valve amps. It follows logically therefore that SS amps are able to react faster to transients in music than valve amps. However, I agree that there are valve amps which do sound very "fast", despite having specs which would suggest otherwise. Why that should be, I don't really know.

  10. #120
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    Hi Andrew,

    Fair enough, still learning then. So where was Anthony coming from? He clearly indicated, by quoting me with a smiley, that he was agreeing with what I had written...


    See post #115.

    Marco.
    http://www.thestainedglasscompany.com

    "A man is a success if he gets up in the morning and gets to bed at night, and in between he does what he wants to do" -- Milan Kundera.

    BE HAPPY EVERYDAY!

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