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Thread: Ker pow!!!

  1. #151
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigman80 View Post
    What kind of valve amp would sound "as it should"?

    Freely available and not the price of a used car please lol
    Lol, as ever the best things in hi-fi are never quite so straightforward!

    "Freely available", however, you've got no chance. The best valve amps I've heard have always been 'no compromise' (within a given budget) bespoke designs, built by experienced specialists [unhindered by commercial demands], who fundamentally understand the technology (its limitations as well as its strengths) and how to get the best out of it.

    That usually results in the production of a valve amp which sounds "as it should", i.e. where its strengths outweigh its limitations, and where it's not trying to be something it isn't (nor ever will be)!

    Incidentally, the same also applies to solid-state designs, particularly those that try to sound 'valvey'.

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  2. #152
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Birmingham

    Posts: 6,772
    I'm James.

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    Did you not have a little bake off sometime back with Firebottle and his amps Marco. I thought the outcome was very close between your all valve power amp and Alan's hybrid power amp which is a similar design to the Croft 7. I have heard and evaluated the Firebottle against the Croft 7 and there is very little difference between the two which would suggest it would perform equally well against your TD power amp?

  3. #153
    Bigman80 Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Lol, as ever the best things in hi-fi are never quite so straightforward!

    "Freely available", however, you've got no chance. The best valve amps I've heard have always been 'no compromise' (within a given budget) bespoke designs, built by experienced specialists [unhindered by commercial demands], who fundamentally understand the technology (its limitations as well as its strengths) and how to get the best out of it.

    That usually results in the production of a valve amp which sounds "as it should", i.e. where its strengths outweigh its limitations, and where it's not trying to be something it isn't (nor ever will be)!

    Incidentally, the same also applies to solid-state designs, particularly those that try to sound 'valvey'.

    Marco.
    That was my suspicion.

    Maybe one day I'll commission a very special build but i fear it'd take MONEY to better what I already own.

    I'd love a listen to Mikeyb's primaluna. I suspect that's rather good. And very much in the camp of proper design.

  4. #154
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Hi Jim,

    I enjoyed the Firebottle amp I heard at the time, but despite its strengths (which I fully acknowledged), I could still hear the inherent solid-state nature/characteristics of the design, albeit it being a very good example of the hybrid species.

    The fact that I didn't rush out and buy one afterwards (or consider replacing my Copper amp with it), however, should tell you all you need to know.

    However, that doesn't detract from what Alan's achieved with his (very well-executed) hybrid amp design, which for the money I think is amazing, simply that it reflects my own personal preferences.

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  5. #155
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigman80 View Post
    That was my suspicion.

    Maybe one day I'll commission a very special build but i fear it'd take MONEY to better what I already own.
    Trust me, Oliver, having been there, done that and bought the t-shirt, that is the *only* way of doing the job right, short of spending tens of thousands of pounds on something from the 'exotic high-end' of the market, built for the right reasons, and not just to look pretty.

    In terms of money needed, think around the region of £5k, to do it right, but much will depend on what you're looking for (SET or push-pull), which valves are used and how much power you want.

    The Primaluna is good, but not in the same ball park as the best examples of the above. I'd class it as one of the better commercially available valve amps, which offers high SPPV, and definitely well worth checking out.

    Quite simply, pound for pound, NO affordable commercial valve amp can be in that ballpark, because there will always be significant overheads for the company in question to consider, and often various middle men to pay, so unlike with a specialist 'one-man band' type of business, the budget simply isn't there with a commercial product to spend the bulk of the money where it matters most!

    And that's why most of them, despite in some cases looking 'prettier', are sonically inferior.

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  6. #156
    Join Date: Sep 2009

    Location: Derbyshire

    Posts: 9,228
    I'm Josie.

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    As Marco said, you need a nice fund to get it right.

    Other than buyng brand new, look in to 2nd hand amps which are built well, well designed and which are easy to mod. For example a puresound A30 can be made it to a stonking power amp.

    All you need to do is ask on here and someone should be able to point you in the right direction in buying an amp which could only cost you around £800 and with someone who knows what they are doing can mod it to a much higher level for a modest cost.



    Sometimes you can get an amp which blows much more expensive new amps in to the dust once it's been sorted by someone who really knows his onions.
    Ultrafide U500DC power amplifier - Croft Vitale )highly modified) - TRIO L-07D Turntable - Denon DL103C1 - Funk Firm Houdini - Lentek MC head amp - 15" Tannoy Monitor Gold Loudspeakers in Lockwood Major cabinets (From Trident Studios) - Tannoyista SPEC 3 Custom Crossovers - VanDamme Black Speaker Cable


    Tannoyista.com

    Facebook

  7. #157
    Bigman80 Guest

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    Well, a £5k amplifier is some distance away but I don't doubt what you're saying at all!

    We need to get this amp of yours to a bakeoff.

  8. #158
    Bigman80 Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Black Adder View Post
    As Marco said, you need a nice fund to get it right.

    Other than buyng brand new, look in to 2nd hand amps which are built well, well designed and which are easy to mod. For example a puresound A30 can be made it to a stonking power amp.

    All you need to do is ask on here and someone should be able to point you in the right direction in buying an amp which could only cost you around £800 and with someone who knows what they are doing can mod it to a much higher level for a modest cost.



    Sometimes you can get an amp which blows much more expensive new amps in to the dust once it's been sorted by someone who really knows his onions.
    Yes Josie, luckily, I'm not in any need to make any change to my monoblocks. The question was asked due to the suspicion that we were talking in the "custom" area of the market.

    If money was no object, I might have a look.

  9. #159
    Join Date: Sep 2009

    Location: Derbyshire

    Posts: 9,228
    I'm Josie.

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    Cool
    Ultrafide U500DC power amplifier - Croft Vitale )highly modified) - TRIO L-07D Turntable - Denon DL103C1 - Funk Firm Houdini - Lentek MC head amp - 15" Tannoy Monitor Gold Loudspeakers in Lockwood Major cabinets (From Trident Studios) - Tannoyista SPEC 3 Custom Crossovers - VanDamme Black Speaker Cable


    Tannoyista.com

    Facebook

  10. #160
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    No problem, I always enjoy a good sesh, but of course the way to appreciate any amp the most will always be to hear it within the context in which it was designed to perform best

    Taking bits out of a 'completed jigsaw' and trying to get them to successfully fit elsewhere is always a bit of a minefield.

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


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