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Thread: Your most loved three vinyl grinders owned throughout the years!

  1. #31
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: South West England

    Posts: 958
    I'm Guy.

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    As an owner of a J7 rebuilt Xenon and a Series V, I'd have to agree with Marco. The SME certainly does 'weighty & powerful' better than the Alphason but not necessarily immediacy, delicacy or speed. They both have great strengths and I'm happy using either enjoying the different flavour each has.

  2. #32
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Hi Martin,

    Pickup arm design has to be one of the most 'black art' areas of hi-fi. Sometimes the most inappropriate of combinations seem to work, other times not. For example, I have a friend with an SME3009-II on a Thorens deck with a Denon DL-103 cartridge. In a 'holey' SME headshell.
    That's because most things are right apart from the headshell... Is it the fixed or detachable headshell 3009 (I forget which one the 'II' is)?

    If it's the latter, your friend can substabtially improve matters by fitting the likes of a Sumiko headshell to it - then watch his 103 sing!

    The 103 likes 'lossy'-style arms like the 3009, as long as there's sufficient mass on the headshell. You can even get it to work well in unipivots like the Hadcock GH242, providing one adds the requisite amount of headshell mass. Basically, as far as optimising 103s in tonearms is concerned, it's the headshell end that impacts most on performance!

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  3. #33
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Hi Guy.

    As an owner of a J7 rebuilt Xenon and a Series V, I'd have to agree with Marco. The SME certainly does 'weighty & powerful' better than the Alphason but not necessarily immediacy, delicacy or speed. They both have great strengths and I'm happy using either enjoying the different flavour each has.
    That's a good way of summarising it

    For me though, regardless of issues of sound quality, the retro appeal of the HR-100S, and the sheer gorgeousness of its S-shaped, all one-piece, beautifully constructed titanium arm and headshell, would always win the day!

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  4. #34
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 31,846
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Hi Guy.



    That's a good way of summarising it

    For me though, regardless of issues of sound quality, the retro appeal of the HR-100S, and the sheer gorgeousness of its S-shaped, all one-piece, beautifully constructed titanium arm and headshell, would always win the day!

    Marco.
    The Alphason arm was one of the best designed arms to come from the UK. I believe it was the first one-piece arm design, though I don't think it was made from titanium. It had superb ceramic bearings and along with the Rega one-piece cast aluminium arm caused SME to pull their socks up and develop the Series V arm.

    I'm still thinking about your comments on the use of cast magnesium alloy for headshell only or for the complete (integrated) arm. Will reply when I have thought a little more about it.

    Regards
    Barry

  5. #35
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: South West England

    Posts: 958
    I'm Guy.

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    It (HR100S) was one piece of formed titanium. The Xenon has a similar arrangement although the part that goes through the bearing yoke is coloured black & may be some other material.




    HR100S


  6. #36
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 31,846
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pure sound View Post
    It (HR100S) was one piece of formed titanium. The Xenon has a similar arrangement although the part that goes through the bearing yoke is coloured black & may be some other material.




    HR100S

    My mistake then! Since titanium is more brittle than aluminium, I have even more admiration for Alphason in producing a formed titanium arm.

    Regards
    Barry

  7. #37
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Indeed, Barry, but it has much greater rigidity, and is probably less resonant too...

    Guy,

    I'm sure I remember stories of the chap who made them (his name escpaes me now) demonstrating his tonearms at shows, and handing out a sample for people to see if they could bend - the idea being that if they could do it, they could then keep it! As far as I know, no-one managed it though...

    Do you remember that?

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  8. #38
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Deleted

    Posts: 6,585
    I'm Deleted.

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    I built my three favourites
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  9. #39
    Join Date: May 2008

    Location: Cricklewood

    Posts: 9,074
    I'm ILOB.

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    VPI super scoutmaster with rim drive
    GL78 Lenco with slate plinth
    Gyro upgraded to a Orbe (for me a disappointment)
    Loves anything from Pain of Salvation to Jeff Buckley to Django to Sarasate to Surinder Sandhu to Shawn Lane to Nick Drake to Rush to Beth Hart to Kate Bush to Rodrigo Y Gabriela to The Hellecasters to Dark Sanctury to Ben Harper to Karicus to Dream Theater to Zero Hour to Al DiMeola to Larry Carlton to Derek Trucks to Govt Mule to?

    Humour: One of the few things worth taking seriously

  10. #40
    Join Date: Nov 2008

    Location: North Down /Northern Ireland/ UK

    Posts: 19,484
    I'm Neil.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Hi Neil,

    I thought you might have commented further on this?

    Marco.
    Sorry I have been a wee bit busy the last few days.

    I can't say a lot about magnesium as a material in audio, but what you write sounds as good a reason for the *colourless sound*as any other I have read...except that I feel its a combination of that aspect + the awful darkness of the VDH arm cable used (wire an SME with any other internal cable and that would open things up. Haven't tried it, so I am not sure how much it will open things up by on a Model 20; but using an output box and different cable works wonders for the 5 on my Oracle.), also the SME turntable is in itself highly damped. It use damping sheets under the metal work, rubber O rings between motor and plinth, silicon damping in the adjusting towers, and the whole plinth hangs on heavy stiff rubber O rings. All in all its very damped. Sitting it on its metal ball feet rather than the rubber protective caps, helps a little as does sitting the whole motor unit on in my case granite.

    The Graham B44 arm was developed by Bob Graham on/for a SME Model 30 motor unit, so logically it would, I thought sound very good on a Model 20, which it does. However clearance between the plinths on a Model 30 is greater than on a Model 20...so the output cable has to be rotated to a right angle. Unless you buy a right angled connector you need to modify it yourself, which I was able to do.

    Uni-pivot arms which the Graham arms are, though they differ in implementation to other uni-pivots, have a very fast and open quality to them + excellent tracking ability (I know many don't rate uni-pivots in this area)due to the use of a magnet (old 2.2 used out rigger side weights), which controls the arms lateral movement.

    My B44 is a .1(my designation for it as Graham never named his covert changes..until the .2 was released), Graham likes to tweak his designs and while mine is not a B44.2 it has a fair bit of what the .2 has. A customer/friend who came round was annoyed to note the differences between my B44 and his B44..."He's upgraded the arm "he said with a look of disgust on his face.

    The Arm cable is also very good, its Graham's own IC 40 cable (now different on the B44.2)

    One area where the SME arm destroys the Graham(any Graham arm) is the instruction booklet. Anyone can set up an SME, (instructions done to perfection)but Grahams, based on the scrapes of paper he includes, which he calls instructions....I don't think so..poor Bob very poor !

    Many love the sound of the Model20A (including 5 arm)and unlike you I don't think its badge snobbery (might be in a few cases , but not all), they just like that sound. I don't like the digital sounding Avid TTs but many do. Like all things audio its a case of system synergy and taste.

    Regards D S D L
    Regards Neil

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