Please help! Ortofon 2M Bronze on a PL-71

[Ian7633]

As Robert and Svend have said there are so many variables but the end result is well worth it and the bonus is that you will learn loads about cartridge set up. Good luck with it, you'll love it when you here the sparkle.

[Dizastical]

Thanks for all the help guys. Im not sure how to use or read the calculator in the link. Here are my specs:

Tone arm mass = 18g. (is this correct? i cant find solid info)
Headshell = 12g.
Cart weight with screws = 7.8g.

Any help with trying to find out if my cart/headshell is optimum would be great!

As for the other points brought up....

- I am using a vintage Pioneer SX-750 with a built in pre amp.
- I have checked all connection. All ok.
- I use a digital scale to measure VTF. I set it to the exact height of an average record so I can achieve the best accuracy.
- Lastly, I have heard the sweet spot on my 2M Blue. Im not sure exactly what the sweet spot sounds like on the Bronze but what I do know is that it just does not seem to sound correct right now. The mids are bloated and almost resignating (the best way i can describe it). Highs seem to be covered in a blanket. Bass is just not very detailed and is lacking body.

You guys have been great! Thanks for being patient with me.

Dave

[paulf-2007]

If they are that finicky, how does it work with different thicknesses of vinyl, sounds a right pain in the arse.

[alphaGT]

Tracking angle stated same as the Black then. Always found a slightly negative rake is where the sweetspot is at, never parrallel with any of the Blacks Ive had and Ive had all three 2M, Quintet and now Cadenza - all 20 deg.

I see, so perhaps if you kept the bottom parallel, and increased the tracking force, you’d wind up with the same SRA, or stylus rake angle? Of course increasing the tracking force can have its own issues, especially without exceeding the recommended force. Tilting it back may help keep it from exceeding the weight limit?

I also noticed it said that the 2M Black stylus would fit the 2M Bronze cartridge, as a replacement. So they must be very similar.

I’d love to have a Cadenza Black! But I wonder about the lesser Cadenza’s? The bronze and blue are much easier on the pocket, but you never hear any reviews of them, everyone wants the black.

Russell

[mac72]

Thanks for all the help guys. Im not sure how to use or read the calculator in the link. Here are my specs:

Tone arm mass = 18g. (is this correct? i cant find solid info)
Headshell = 12g.
Cart weight with screws = 7.8g.

If this is correct your headshell is way too heavy it wold make your cartridge to resonate around 5.5Hz , you should aim at 8-12Hz range

[Dizastical]

I have a new Ortofon SH-4 headshell. I weighs 9.4g. Would that put me in the correct range? My 2M Blue is mounted to an SH-4 and sounds great. But then I will not be able to adjust Azimuth.

Dave

[mac72]

I'm afraid Ortofon 2M cartridges aren't very good match for your arm , 2M Blue is less compliant and with lighter headshell give ~6Hz , you'd be better of with something less compliant like 6-10Cu

[struth]

I have a new Ortofon SH-4 headshell. I weighs 9.4g. Would that put me in the correct range? My 2M Blue is mounted to an SH-4 and sounds great. But then I will not be able to adjust Azimuth.

Dave

if its sounding great i wouldnt worry

[Dizastical]

Quiet a few people run Bronze and Black carts on this table with Sumiko headshells that also come in @ 12 grams. I'm very confused why my setup would be any different.

[Svend N]

Dave, I still think the heavy headshell might be a significant part of the problem here (there may be other issues). I checked out the PL-71 and as far as I can tell it has an Acos arm that is similar if not the same as the Rega R200 that came on the first gen Planar 2 and 3 decks, which was a variant of the Lustre made by Acos for Rega. I happen to have used this very arm on my Heybrook TT2 with (you guessed it) a 2M Bronze. It sounded terrific - much better match for the Bronze than the lighter RB300 arm I used prior (@ 11.5g eff. mass). Now, the headshell that came with the Rega R200 version only weighs 7g, fully 5g lighter than yours. I'm sure you can find a Rega R200 headshell for cheap, if not free -- there are plenty of these arms about, many of which have been mothballed due to broken AS mechs. Post a want ad here and someone may help you out.

As for setup, I played with VTA a bit with my rig, and found that slightly tail down seemed to sound best. If I dropped it too far it gave the sound a character similar to what you describe - tubby midrange, lacking bass and treble. Tail too high and it was all air and no beef.

One more question: how clean is your stylus? If you've never cleaned it, I can recommend the Magic Eraser treatment. Works great! If you've never heard of this, let me know and I'll fill you in. I found this made a big difference to sound quality.

Hope this helps. Keep at it, as this cartridge is worth the effort. If your arm is indeed the same as the Acos Lustre / R200, then it's actually a great match and there's no reason you couldn't make it sing.

Best,
Svend

PS -- I used the Rega Baerwald protractor for alignment of the R200/Bronze....worked great.
PPS -- on reading your last post above, and your first post, I'm thinking this cart is just not playing nice with that Pro-Ject headshell, and/or you should try a different protractor. Seriously, try to find a nice light Rega R200 headshell and align using Baerwald and see what happens. You won't have azimuth adjustment, but I'm not sure you need it -- my Bronze sounded wonderful on the R200.