+ Reply to Thread
Page 9 of 11 FirstFirst ... 7891011 LastLast
Results 81 to 90 of 105

Thread: Noise reduction

  1. #81
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,786
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bumpy View Post
    Well I'm obviously a mug for making purchases based on sound quality vs value for money..
    No that is what a mug doesn't do. The essential point is that even if this cable subjectively improves sound quality it is not value for money at $200. At $50, maybe, assuming you couldn't make your own or get a pal to make one for you. There has been no R&D unless you count making one up and trying it, which I don't. And I'm surprised that anyone can even consider that the appearance of it, which is the only difference between Geoff's version and the 200 dollar one, would lead anyone to think that it will be more effective in its application. Like putting a £400 CD player in a fancy case and selling it for two grand. And yes, that's already been done.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  2. #82
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Deleted

    Posts: 6,585
    I'm Deleted.

    Default

    There seem to be at least three different issues being discussed (dismissed) here, but as if they are all the same thing.

    1/ The Gutwire cable is a ground link between chassis ground and signal ground. Most components already connect signal ground to chassis (mains) ground at some point so the need for another ground connection is questionable (at least in the UK) and likely to lead to earth loops.

    2/ The Entreq solution is quite different to the Gutwire. In their case they provide a sort of pseudo ground plane in the form of boxes filled with minerals. This pseudo ground plane is connected to signal ground. In this case there isn't any actual extra connection between the signal ground and any actual mains ground.

    3/ The Tannoy solution is different again. In their case they provide a ground link to the metal chassis of the drive unit. This chassis isn't actually connected to the signal at all so grounding it will not impact on the signal or mains ground. It's feasible that if the mains ground is not at zero potential then the chassis will also therefore take on the same potential as the mains ground to which it is connected - how this could be a good thing is a different matter though.
    Account Deleted

  3. #83
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,786
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    Depends also on what is meant by 'ground'.

    All grounding products sell themselves on the idea that ground is like 'the ground' and that noise can be 'drained away' into 'the ground', where it dissipates in the vastness. That's just wrong. It isn't even an over-simplification. It's just wrong.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  4. #84
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: London

    Posts: 685
    I'm James.

    Default

    I'm hoping Geoff's thoroughbred beating donkey actually does improve his system, just to keep this thread alive. It's a laff in here

    ...and it's the season of miracles

  5. #85
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,786
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    I hope so too. Very cheap upgrade.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  6. #86
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

    Posts: 51,624
    I'm Geoff.

    Default

    I've given the made up earth wire a try.

    It makes no audible difference here at all, either with volume turned right up or right down with no signal entering the pre-amp. No difference when listening to music either.

    I tried it on spare inputs on a TVC and on a spare output. I also tried an active pre-amp. Same result in both cases. Background noise was minimal with volume well up in both cases when no signal was introduced, either with or without the 'wire'.

    I fail to see how the 'Gutwire' could do things differently, no matter how its elusive 'properties' are described.

    Can anybody intelligently and plausibly describe how an expensive bespoke wire that carries no signal or power (or at least shouldn't) can improve on a plain wire?
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

  7. #87
    Join Date: Jun 2011

    Location: Skien, Norway

    Posts: 932
    I'm Jostein.

    Default

    Walker Audio has their Eliminators with some of the same functionality:

    http://walkeraudio.com/shop/eliminat...onal-antennae/
    My hifi system:

    Turntable: Technics SL-1200 MKII, Ortofon 2M Bronze cartridge, Mike New bearing, MCRU PSU (c), Oyaide HS-CF headshell, Oyaide MJ-12 TT mat, Vantage Audio Copper mat, Isonoe Isolation Feet, Isodek IF-2 isolation platform, Furutech Monza LP stabilizer, Herbie's Hal-O JR damper Phono Stage: Hagerman Cornet 3 (prototype) Amplifiers: EAR 868L Preamp, Transcription Audio 211 Heaven Power amp, Bob Carver Cherry 180 power amp CD Player: Ear Yoshino Acute Tuner: Magnum Dynalab 90T Speakers: Vandersteen 2CE SigII, Townshend Audio Super Tweeters, Transcription Audio Speakers Cables and stuff: LFD Audio interconnects and speaker cables, Mark Grant G2000HD, BlackCat Electronics, Van Den Hul Clearwater, Black Rhodium mains cables, Black Rhodium mains block, Finite Elements Resonator, Townhsend Stella Speaker stands, Pro Audio Bono hifi rack, Herbie's spike gliders, Herbie's Ultravox and Hal-O tube dampers, Super Black Hole CD mat Record Cleaning Machine: Loricraft PRC4

  8. #88
    Join Date: Sep 2013

    Location: North Island New Zealand

    Posts: 1,757
    I'm Chris.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by walpurgis View Post
    I've given the made up earth wire a try.

    It makes no audible difference here at all, either with volume turned right up or right down with no signal entering the pre-amp. No difference when listening to music either.

    I tried it on spare inputs on a TVC and on a spare output. I also tried an active pre-amp. Same result in both cases. Background noise was minimal with volume well up in both cases when no signal was introduced, either with or without the 'wire'.

    I fail to see how the 'Gutwire' could do things differently, no matter how its elusive 'properties' are described.

    Can anybody intelligently and plausibly describe how an expensive bespoke wire that carries no signal or power (or at least shouldn't) can improve on a plain wire?
    If earth wiring, (and equally positive wiring if you go to the trouble ) is arranged in a star arrangement it then carries much less propensity for ground loops and anomalies to occur. Shown here , You can see looking at the diagrams the difference that such wiring might make:
    http://lh-electric.net/tutorials/gnd_loop.html

    Where more difficult problems exist, isolation techniques such as optical or transformer based isolation can assist. However there are always small trade offs requiring additional consideration. For instance an inexpensive but effective isolation method in low voltage systems, is to use back to back diodes, from say a noisy ground plane environment to a star earth. The current carrying capability must be suitably rated, and forward voltage drop of such devices has to be low in order to allow sufficient needed conduction. Either schottky or other ultra fast types are typically used.

    Rod Elliot's article provides summary and solution of most encountered earthing problems: http://sound.whsites.net/earthing.htm

  9. #89
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: Bishops Stortford

    Posts: 1,250
    I'm Chris.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    The essential point is that even if this cable subjectively improves sound quality it is not value for money at $200.
    IF the cable brought about a greater level of improvement in SQ than spending $200 on any other component, then in my book its good value.
    Source
    SW1X Universal Music Server UMS I Signature with Power Supply Unit PSU I Signature
    SW1X USB II
    SW1X DAC III Special
    Audiolab 6000 CDT transport
    Amps
    Pre amps -- Hi fi Collective twin mono ladder stepped attenuator, with Charcroft Z-foil and silver wired. And First Watt B1 active no gain buffer.
    Power amps -- Welborne 45 SET monoblocks 1.8W / Decware Taboo 6W / Elekit 300B TU-8600SVK plus further improved components 9W / ICE Power 1000W
    Speakers
    Highly modified Endorphin P17 open baffle speakers containing both vintage and modern alnico drivers and paper cones. All silver wired - 8" Cube Audio FC8 full range drivers and vintage 15" Altec VOTT 416 bass drivers. All sat on Townsend Audio Podium seismic isolation platforms.
    BK Electronics XLS400FF Sub.
    Cabling
    Silver mains cables, interconnects and speaker cables by SW1X
    Headphones
    HRT HeadStreamer and SennHeiser HD650 headphones

  10. #90
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: Bishops Stortford

    Posts: 1,250
    I'm Chris.

    Default

    So a donkey didn't win the Derby, so no great surprise there. Could there be inherent value in buying the thoroughbred? I have no idea, but hold an open mind.

    Can anybody intelligently and plausibly describe how an expensive bespoke wire that carries no signal or power (or at least shouldn't) can improve on a plain wire

    Well I cant but there are lots of things in Hi-Fi that work for some people for no good reason.
    Source
    SW1X Universal Music Server UMS I Signature with Power Supply Unit PSU I Signature
    SW1X USB II
    SW1X DAC III Special
    Audiolab 6000 CDT transport
    Amps
    Pre amps -- Hi fi Collective twin mono ladder stepped attenuator, with Charcroft Z-foil and silver wired. And First Watt B1 active no gain buffer.
    Power amps -- Welborne 45 SET monoblocks 1.8W / Decware Taboo 6W / Elekit 300B TU-8600SVK plus further improved components 9W / ICE Power 1000W
    Speakers
    Highly modified Endorphin P17 open baffle speakers containing both vintage and modern alnico drivers and paper cones. All silver wired - 8" Cube Audio FC8 full range drivers and vintage 15" Altec VOTT 416 bass drivers. All sat on Townsend Audio Podium seismic isolation platforms.
    BK Electronics XLS400FF Sub.
    Cabling
    Silver mains cables, interconnects and speaker cables by SW1X
    Headphones
    HRT HeadStreamer and SennHeiser HD650 headphones

+ Reply to Thread
Page 9 of 11 FirstFirst ... 7891011 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •