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Thread: Vinyl or CD?

  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    Bass is compressed so sounds 'louder', low bass is in mono so sounds more solid. Vinyl's weaknesses on paper are, ironically, its strengths when actually listening.
    Ok, but I'm not talking about louder, I'm talking about bass on vinyl 12" singles sounding deeper and having more impact/authority than anything I've heard from CD, played at the same level. Well-recorded 12" singles really are special beasts, because you've got the 45rpm factor, plus all that groove surface to devote to often only one song, and so the dynamics can be incredible!

    Now that may not measurably be the case, which I accept, but what does it matter if that's what you *actually* hear? Like you say, vinyl's weaknesses on paper are, ironically, its strengths when actually listening, so who cares about the measurements? Just sit back and enjoy the bass you can FEEL!!

    Of course you could do this with digital too. If you copy your 12 inch vinyl single to digital and level match it should sound pretty much identical to the vinyl.
    Perhaps, but that could be due to the limitations of the digitization process (sound card), mangling the natural bass characteristics of the vinyl. Every process used imparts its own 'signature'.

    Having 'ripped' vinyl to CD many times, using said digitization process, I can say with some certainty that there is no 'free lunch', and thus a sonic penalty is always paid in the results obtained.

    Marco.
    http://www.thestainedglasscompany.com

    "A man is a success if he gets up in the morning and gets to bed at night, and in between he does what he wants to do" -- Milan Kundera.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Sure, but the point is, when it's gone (in that way), it's GONE for GOOD, and so can't be 'magically retrieved' later

    However, whilst it cannot be disputed that bass dynamics are limited on vinyl recordings, in the way Martin has described, I can't say that I've ever felt that any well-recorded, high-resolution recordings I own on vinyl sound bass-light compared with their CD counterparts.

    Marco.
    However, I was referring to the stereo effect.
    Among the many: Ozric Tentacles early years - Genesis early years - Pink Floyd - Brand X - Camel - Shpongle - Younger Brother - The Peaking Goddess Collective - Deadmau5 - Trentemoller - Kiasmos - Acoustic Alchemy - John Coltraine - Hank Mobley - Lee Morgan - And Oasis...!

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Ok, but I'm not talking about louder, I'm talking about bass on vinyl 12" singles sounding deeper and having more impact/authority than anything I've heard from CD, played at the same level.

    Marco.
    Ah yes but there are aural enhancers in studios that will do exactly that when mixing down.
    Among the many: Ozric Tentacles early years - Genesis early years - Pink Floyd - Brand X - Camel - Shpongle - Younger Brother - The Peaking Goddess Collective - Deadmau5 - Trentemoller - Kiasmos - Acoustic Alchemy - John Coltraine - Hank Mobley - Lee Morgan - And Oasis...!

  4. #84
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    Check out a Behringer SX3040 as just one example.
    Among the many: Ozric Tentacles early years - Genesis early years - Pink Floyd - Brand X - Camel - Shpongle - Younger Brother - The Peaking Goddess Collective - Deadmau5 - Trentemoller - Kiasmos - Acoustic Alchemy - John Coltraine - Hank Mobley - Lee Morgan - And Oasis...!

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Ok, but I'm not talking about louder, I'm talking about bass on vinyl 12" singles sounding deeper and having more impact/authority than anything I've heard from CD, played at the same level.

    Marco.
    And of course these gadgets are all digital
    Among the many: Ozric Tentacles early years - Genesis early years - Pink Floyd - Brand X - Camel - Shpongle - Younger Brother - The Peaking Goddess Collective - Deadmau5 - Trentemoller - Kiasmos - Acoustic Alchemy - John Coltraine - Hank Mobley - Lee Morgan - And Oasis...!

  6. #86
    Join Date: Aug 2009

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Ok, but I'm not talking about louder, I'm talking about bass on vinyl 12" singles sounding deeper and having more impact/authority than anything I've heard from CD, played at the same level. Well-recorded 12" singles really are special beasts, because you've got the 45rpm factor, plus all that groove width to devote to often only one song, and so the dynamics can be incredible!

    Now that may not measurably be the case, which I accept, but what does it matter if that's what you *actually* hear? Like you say, vinyl's weaknesses on paper are, ironically, its strengths when actually listening, so who cares about the measurements? Just sit back and enjoy the bass you can FEEL!!



    Perhaps, but that could be due to the limitations of the digitization process (sound card), mangling the natural bass characteristics of the vinyl. Every process used imparts its own 'signature'.

    Having 'ripped' vinyl to CD many times, using said digitization process, I can say with some certainty that there is no 'free lunch', and thus a sonic penalty is always paid in the results obtained.

    Marco.
    I agree that what it sounds like is what it sounds like regardless of what might technically be going on. What sounds like deeper bass may not actually be deeper bass, if you measured it, however I agree that is irrelevant to our perceptions.

    If your vinyl rip sounds different to actually playing the 12 inch single the likelihood is that you are missing the acoustic feedback, something else about vinyl that is technically undesirable but in reality improves the listening experience. You won't be able to hear the effects of the ADC/DAC in your soundcard unless you loop the signal through it at least half a dozen times.
    Martin



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  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    I agree that what it sounds like is what it sounds like regardless of what might technically be going on. What sounds like deeper bass may not actually be deeper bass, if you measured it, however I agree that is irrelevant to our perceptions.
    Excellent, now we're getting somewhere, lol! And at the end of the day, when listening to music, it's ultimately only our perceptions that count. Incidentally, the same principles also apply to other aspects of audio, where what's heard doesn't correlate with what's measured

    If your vinyl rip sounds different to actually playing the 12 inch single the likelihood is that you are missing the acoustic feedback, something else about vinyl that is technically undesirable but in reality improves the listening experience. You won't be able to hear the effects of the ADC/DAC in your soundcard unless you loop the signal through it at least half a dozen times.
    Perhaps, but that's not how I'd interpret the results. To my ears, there's an undesirable falseness and 'glare' (in effect an irritating and tiring-sounding coloration) superimposed onto the music, with the digital rip, that is completely absent on the vinyl itself - and it's happened with every rip I've ever done.

    Marco.
    http://www.thestainedglasscompany.com

    "A man is a success if he gets up in the morning and gets to bed at night, and in between he does what he wants to do" -- Milan Kundera.

  8. #88
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    A couple of months ago I moved from cd to vinyl myself James.
    I shan't be going back anytime soon.
    All that time and money wasted trying to get digital audio to sound analogue.

    If you're serious about the change spend a couple of hundred quid on a deck and a couple of vinyls.
    If you hate it then you haven't lost owt but if you love it you are on the ground floor and running.

  9. #89
    Join Date: Feb 2014

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    Quote Originally Posted by James the Albarry lover View Post
    "About 50 CDs
    0 records"

    I had around 250 CD and no vinyl. A CD or vinyl is just an item.

    "My favourite music is from the 70s and 80s, to be honest I don't like the idea of streaming but I do see the benefits of it, to me the physical side of music is a fun part that I would miss it's nice having something solid for your money wether it be CDs or LPs, I never knew that some modern re releases on vinyl where so bad which is making me edge more towards CD"

    Just because it's on a CD doesn't guarantee good audio.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by agk View Post
    A couple of months ago I moved from cd to vinyl myself James.
    I shan't be going back anytime soon.
    All that time and money wasted trying to get digital audio to sound analogue.

    If you're serious about the change spend a couple of hundred quid on a deck and a couple of vinyls.
    If you hate it then you haven't lost owt but if you love it you are on the ground floor and running.

    Among the many: Ozric Tentacles early years - Genesis early years - Pink Floyd - Brand X - Camel - Shpongle - Younger Brother - The Peaking Goddess Collective - Deadmau5 - Trentemoller - Kiasmos - Acoustic Alchemy - John Coltraine - Hank Mobley - Lee Morgan - And Oasis...!

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