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Thread: Valve DAC recommendation for Croft 25/7 and Harbeth

  1. #31
    Join Date: Jun 2010

    Location: Liverpool, UK.

    Posts: 1,228
    I'm Geoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yomanze View Post
    Thanks for the detail.
    You'd already given it!
    Main system: Sony TTS8000; AT1010; Audio Technica Art1; The Lentek; Cambridge 851n, Yamaha NS1000.
    System 2 - SBT; Technics SH-X1000 DAC; Denon PMA-850

  2. #32
    Join Date: May 2016

    Location: Much Wenlock

    Posts: 1,522
    I'm Gary.

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    Could have been me? Sorry.

    I like the case, and with the Siemans valves sounds really good.

    Great value/performance.


    Quote Originally Posted by User211 View Post
    +1.

    But the case is pretty horrid. Then again it is cheap. Sonically A for that money, though.

    I tried to buy one two days ago off here but was just popped to the post.

    I was going to re-house it and dump some copper paper in oil Jupiter caps in it etc etc just for kicks and use in a 2nd system. But it is good enough for use in the main one. Which is surprising.

  3. #33
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Coppull

    Posts: 147
    I'm Robert.

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    Quote Originally Posted by montesquieu View Post
    I'd be cautious of Chord DACs, I had a DAC64 and it was the total opposite of what you'd expect from a valve DAC.

    I had fantastic results with the Audio Note DAC 0.1x which in my opinion punches well above its weight. So much so that I went down the more expensive Audio Note route - but the combination of valves and the non-oversampling approach is common across the Audio Note range and if you look inside the 0.1x has some pretty nice Audio Note components. It has SPDIF input as well as USB which is handy.

    Anyway I'd recommend wholeheartedly.
    Evening,

    Just sent a private message but your inbox is full so might as well ask the questions here in case others have some insight.
    Good evening,

    Can I pick your brains please?

    I have just bought (was delivered today) an Audio Note 0.1x DAC and it has been settling into my system for a few hours. I think it’s around 4 years old and so shouldn’t need any running in!

    I believe you used to have one of these DAC’s? I was wondering if you ever played around between the USB input and standard coax input? I am using the coax connection at the moment which I have to say sounds sublime. Better than the internal DAC on the Auralic Aries Mini which I considered to be pretty good.

    Did you make any tweaks to yours - cables etc - that made a difference?

    Finally, I notice that you sold yours - I assume you moved onto something pretty special?

  4. #34
    montesquieu Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob1969 View Post
    Evening,

    Just sent a private message but your inbox is full so might as well ask the questions here in case others have some insight.
    Good evening,

    Can I pick your brains please?

    I have just bought (was delivered today) an Audio Note 0.1x DAC and it has been settling into my system for a few hours. I think it’s around 4 years old and so shouldn’t need any running in!

    I believe you used to have one of these DAC’s? I was wondering if you ever played around between the USB input and standard coax input? I am using the coax connection at the moment which I have to say sounds sublime. Better than the internal DAC on the Auralic Aries Mini which I considered to be pretty good.

    Did you make any tweaks to yours - cables etc - that made a difference?

    Finally, I notice that you sold yours - I assume you moved onto something pretty special?
    I was seriously impressed by the AN DAC 0.1x, the comparison between the etched, hyper-detailed, ear-bleeding Chord DAC64 I had owned not really that long prior to it, and the Audio Note 0.1x can't be understated.

    I had experimented previously with NOS DACs such as the MHDT one and an early Valab one (both, interestingly, from Taiwan), and also with tube output DACs including a DIY Lampizator'ed one based on a board off ebay, and the EE Minimax DAC; but the 0.1x is where it all started to properly come together for me on the digital side (used with a Wadia transport and also a 47 Labs Shigaraki transport which was very good, if basic in its features).

    I did try USB on the 0.1x but I didn't have much music to play on it, all I can say was that even then with a Macbook it was plug and play.

    I think Audio Note do 'get' digital in their approach - in fact I have very little patience with Audio Note speakers or power amps (being pretty one dimensional/theological in their approach to design - I tried many ever more expensive variants of AN SET amps, with every more fancy pairs of AN E's having more and more silver in them - nah, not for me ...) but many of their source components from analog to digital I've found to be far more interesting and musically successful.

    I did think about upgrading the 0.1x, after all the components are all Audio Note ones and can be swapped out for fancier ones. But while I was thinking about this, I came across someone selling an Audio Note Kit DAC 2.1x. This had already been breathed on by its original builder with upgraded components (shed loads of Black Gates including many little red Black Gates I hadn't seen before, plus assorted audio note tantalum resistors as well as the super hi-B output transformers from the AN DAC 3.1x/M3 preamp).

    This was upgraded a couple of times subsequently, to M5 / M8 level output and I/V transformers, full balanced operation (it had balanced transformers but they hadn't been fully wired up for balanced previously), even fancier caps, various further improvements to the power supply, and a switchable input incorporating a JFET input buffer on one of the single ended inputs (the others - balanced AES/EBU and single ended SPDIF - used the top end AN input matching transformers which are also in my transport).

    I use this with the AN CDT2/II transport which brought further improvements (transports DO make a difference). I heard the DAC in its current state back to back at someone's house with a factory 4.1x and the sound was on a par in my opinion, though subtly different. Not sure what a factory one costs. It's a VERY heavy box now.

    I'm not the biggest cable believer, I've experimented but really only found they made a substantive difference in my setup in two places, which is where I stuck with AN-Vx silver - in the phono arm cable, and in the SPDIF connection between transport and DAC. Everywhere else I use RFC cables from Paul Coupe, which are simply well constructed shielded copper cables with no fancy back story - these replaced a mix of AN-Vx silver and Kondo copper. But I do use Audio Note silver between transport and DAC as I think I can hear a difference.

    Very recently I've added a Mutec MC-3+USB reclocker / master clock / USB interface which works really well and has brought the digital performance up another notch and given me streaming capability at last to match my CD transport - though funnily enough I couldn't hear the impact of the AN-Vx after putting that in. It's still there for now though.

    I've had the kit DAC now for 5 years, expecially after the upgrades, I have considered it endgame for me on the digital side - it's natural, nicely dimensional, musical, and has a fetching ability with timbre. However I have been talking to the guy who did the upgrades and he has some ideas to squeeze more out of the unit's Analogue Devices DAC chipset, incuding replacing the indirectly heated double triodes in the output stage with directly heated ones, and generally going to town improving the PSU to full double mono, two boxes etc, perhaps using a couple of solid copper chassis from speedysteve.

    I'm considering it, though the expense would be considerable, and considering I probably listen to 80%+ vinyl, I'm really not sure... My phono side remains better than analogue, and I swing between seeing if I can bring them on par, to wondering whether it may not be worth the investment as I'll probably end up still being predominanly vinyl.

    I'm pondering. But my curiosity has been aroused.

  5. #35
    Join Date: Oct 2009

    Location: Birmingham, UK

    Posts: 394
    I'm Phil.

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    Audionote dac sig 2.1 £1200 seconhand , hard to beat at the money , mine has 12au7 valves for some reason , a bit more choice though , had the jolida dac which was great for the money , but not in the audionote league . phil .
    Phil.

  6. #36
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Coppull

    Posts: 147
    I'm Robert.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by montesquieu View Post
    I was seriously impressed by the AN DAC 0.1x, the comparison between the etched, hyper-detailed, ear-bleeding Chord DAC64 I had owned not really that long prior to it, and the Audio Note 0.1x can't be understated.

    I had experimented previously with NOS DACs such as the MHDT one and an early Valab one (both, interestingly, from Taiwan), and also with tube output DACs including a DIY Lampizator'ed one based on a board off ebay, and the EE Minimax DAC; but the 0.1x is where it all started to properly come together for me on the digital side (used with a Wadia transport and also a 47 Labs Shigaraki transport which was very good, if basic in its features).

    I did try USB on the 0.1x but I didn't have much music to play on it, all I can say was that even then with a Macbook it was plug and play.

    I think Audio Note do 'get' digital in their approach - in fact I have very little patience with Audio Note speakers or power amps (being pretty one dimensional/theological in their approach to design - I tried many ever more expensive variants of AN SET amps, with every more fancy pairs of AN E's having more and more silver in them - nah, not for me ...) but many of their source components from analog to digital I've found to be far more interesting and musically successful.

    I did think about upgrading the 0.1x, after all the components are all Audio Note ones and can be swapped out for fancier ones. But while I was thinking about this, I came across someone selling an Audio Note Kit DAC 2.1x. This had already been breathed on by its original builder with upgraded components (shed loads of Black Gates including many little red Black Gates I hadn't seen before, plus assorted audio note tantalum resistors as well as the super hi-B output transformers from the AN DAC 3.1x/M3 preamp).

    This was upgraded a couple of times subsequently, to M5 / M8 level output and I/V transformers, full balanced operation (it had balanced transformers but they hadn't been fully wired up for balanced previously), even fancier caps, various further improvements to the power supply, and a switchable input incorporating a JFET input buffer on one of the single ended inputs (the others - balanced AES/EBU and single ended SPDIF - used the top end AN input matching transformers which are also in my transport).

    I use this with the AN CDT2/II transport which brought further improvements (transports DO make a difference). I heard the DAC in its current state back to back at someone's house with a factory 4.1x and the sound was on a par in my opinion, though subtly different. Not sure what a factory one costs. It's a VERY heavy box now.

    I'm not the biggest cable believer, I've experimented but really only found they made a substantive difference in my setup in two places, which is where I stuck with AN-Vx silver - in the phono arm cable, and in the SPDIF connection between transport and DAC. Everywhere else I use RFC cables from Paul Coupe, which are simply well constructed shielded copper cables with no fancy back story - these replaced a mix of AN-Vx silver and Kondo copper. But I do use Audio Note silver between transport and DAC as I think I can hear a difference.

    Very recently I've added a Mutec MC-3+USB reclocker / master clock / USB interface which works really well and has brought the digital performance up another notch and given me streaming capability at last to match my CD transport - though funnily enough I couldn't hear the impact of the AN-Vx after putting that in. It's still there for now though.

    I've had the kit DAC now for 5 years, expecially after the upgrades, I have considered it endgame for me on the digital side - it's natural, nicely dimensional, musical, and has a fetching ability with timbre. However I have been talking to the guy who did the upgrades and he has some ideas to squeeze more out of the unit's Analogue Devices DAC chipset, incuding replacing the indirectly heated double triodes in the output stage with directly heated ones, and generally going to town improving the PSU to full double mono, two boxes etc, perhaps using a couple of solid copper chassis from speedysteve.

    I'm considering it, though the expense would be considerable, and considering I probably listen to 80%+ vinyl, I'm really not sure... My phono side remains better than analogue, and I swing between seeing if I can bring them on par, to wondering whether it may not be worth the investment as I'll probably end up still being predominanly vinyl.

    I'm pondering. But my curiosity has been aroused.
    Thank you for the very comprehensive response. It is very much appreciated.

    I am using the DAC with an Auralic Aries Mini after, in the recent past, having tried the Chord 2Qute Dac and Audiolab MDAC+. These two either left me cold or irritated or both. For the price of the Aries Mini I think the DAC is pretty good and to my ears better than the previous two offerings mentioned.

    The 0.1x gives more detail without being surgical and has an analogue like energy that I haven't heard from digital - especially in the bass. It also seems to fill my lounge better with music closer to what I have heard from vinyl before.

    My wife and spent around half an hour comparing the Mini's DAC and the 0.1x and it there was no competition. We listened to some Ladysmith Black Mambazo and the vocals were amazingly real and present.

    Your DAC must sound truly divine by comparison.

    The only thing I might consider is sending it to Audio Note for a once over - I am not sure of the lifespan of the valves and having done some digging don't look easily replaceable.

  7. #37
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Coppull

    Posts: 147
    I'm Robert.

    Default

    The Audio Note has now been in my system for a few days now. The verdict? Easily the best digital component I have ever had in my system. Bar none.

    Anyone got an Audio Note amp they want to sell?! ��

  8. #38
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 127
    I'm Slawa.

    Default SW1X DAC opportunity

    Greetings,

    If anybody is still looking to acquire an analogue & musical sounding DAC without any BS, there is one for sale here on AOS:

    http://theartofsound.net/forum/showt...highlight=sw1x

    S
    SW1X Audio DesignTM ... Finest Audio Components ... Designed and Handcrafted in England
    www.SW1XAD.co.uk

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