Linn Studio Master Recordings

[griffo104]

Have you got 'Other Aspects' Griffo?

Incidentally, how much are these 45 rpm versions?

Are they these $50 items?
http://store.acousticsounds.com/brow...Title_ID=41675

No haven't got Other Aspects, want it though, got most of Dolphy's earlier stuff and all on vinyl but not this one. I seriously enjoy Dolphy's music even though so many think it's difficult, I've never found that to be the case.

The records are $50 and are different from the Acoustic Sounds set.

Essentially there are two Blue Note 45rpm releases going on at the moment, 64 releases from Music Matters and 25 from Acoustic Sounds, both sets are being pressed at RTI and both have Steve Hoffman's involvements.

The other difference is that Music Matters have gone with gatefolds and the extra Wolff photos in the gatefolds. After some initial problems with the packaging the last batch were superb, good thick outer sleeves and excellent inner sleeves. Of course going with gatefolds removes the authenticity of the original but I'll forgive due to the Wolff photos inside, there is no text just the photos.

I chose the Music Matters range of releases because it has more albums that I'm interested in even though I have a fair few of them.

Hank Mobley's wonderful Soul Station was in the last batch and it totally shreds my previous audiophile reissue of the same album.

I'd also add that the service I recieved from Music Matters after a slight cock up on my first batch was totally superb, their response and service to getting a second set out was truly excellent, fast and very friendly and made the fact these are coming from the US not a problem at all, a big thumbs up from me.

[Marco]

Hi Dave,

Sorry I've taken so long to reply but I've been quite busy recently

Marco, you and I are going to remain respectfully poles apart I'm afraid. I went through the "music first" bull the first time round and have come full circle in many ways now.

Yes we obviously are poles apart in that respect as I don't think prioritising the enjoyment of music first with hi-fi is "bull".

I HAVE had first hand experience of analogue 1/2" 30IPS master (no noise reduction) with the LP, the first time at Linn, through their amps (which noone liked at the time and through passive 'Briks too (hardly high resolution as systems go). The acetate they cut sounded very good but the 12" single and especially the LP was truly, truly dire - all spongy and lacking in emotion. Yes, an LP12/Ittok and karma lacking in emotion and musicality!

I'm sure that was an interesting experience. I would like to have been there. However it has no bearing whatsoever on what I hear from my vinyl set-up. The presentation of my modified SL-1210/DL-103 Pro is very different to an LP12/Ittok/Karma! The best analogue recordings I own sound superior to the best digital ones - it's as simple as that, and it's not because I enjoy some sort of 'rose-tinted' euphonic reproduction of my music. It's because analogue recordings for me are more accurate and faithful to the sound of real voices and instruments; hence why to my ears they sound more 'musical' - that's 'musical' in an objective rather than a subjective sense.

It wasn't until I heard (and bought) a Notts Analogue Mentor with Decca Microscanner a couple of years later that I finally had a vinyl player with a bit of drama and through a valve phono stage it had proper space and depth too, as the phono stage didn't clip (a big problem with carts like the Decca with high output and a little ringing here and there).

I like Deccas because they bring out the emotion in recordings and make music sound like music, not like some false notion of 'pristine perfection' like many of today's moving coils do. It's no coincidence I feel that Deccas also measure terribly in comparison. It's also why I prefer the 'dinosaur era' spherical stylus on my 103 Pro, and its way of making music, to that of a technically 'superior' line contact stylus in, say, an Ortofon or a Lyra.

Why is it I wonder that so often in hi-fi it's the things that measure worst which often sound the most musical (valves, vinyl, electrostatic speakers, etc)? There's definitely something in this, I feel, and it's that whenever 'natural' distortion is removed either in the recording process or in the voicing of hi-fi equipment it results in a less musical sound. This is of course a somewhat simplistic statement, but based on my experience I'm convinced it has some merit.

Using different tracks, I've compared master tapes and files with the CD product and the difference on a big monitoring system isn't worth fussing about, really.

I'm in no position to dispute that assertion, but it's meaningless in the context of my own comparisons which I've carried out between analogue and digital recordings. I have a Nakamichi CR-7, and the recordings I make of the same music from vinyl via my SL-1210 and from CD via my Sony always results in the recordings from the same album on vinyl sounding more real and lifelike, and as such more musically enjoyable. As an aside, the CR-7 with a good quality chrome tape spanks any modern CD player I've heard and gets very close to good vinyl on the SL-1210

My preference for analogue recordings is obvious whether I compare the recordings through the CR-7 in my main system or if I make the comparisons through the tape deck in my car. Yes I still use a (Sony) tape deck and not a CD player in the car for reasons of superior sound quality! I'd rather suffer a bit of tape hiss to hear better sound. Most car CD players sound absolutely dire.

Some of you with big pro speakers (even vintage Tannoys/JBL's/NS1000's etc) will know what I'm w@nking on about and I suspect Marco you're getting a good bit through your SP100's. It's just that your "enjoyable" may well be my "too much to bear."

One of the reasons I use the Spendors is because of their neutrality, particularly through the midrange, so I know exactly what you're getting at, but I don't consider that my source components are as coloured as you're making out - indeed quite the opposite. I just like instruments and voices to have the requisite natural tone and body, and much of the hi-fi I hear today from sources to speakers fails to deliver in that area. The voicing of hi-fi equipment and ancillaries seems to have moved away from accurate tonality to a sound which majors on detail retrieval and 'impressiveness', resulting in a thinner, brighter, more forward presentation from equipment than before which I feel has gone too far in the one direction and is alien to both how real music sounds and my purist principles. You're entitled to your opinion and to differ, of course, but I think you may change how you feel, certainly with regards to my system, if you should ever come and visit...

Good job we're all different...... Makes life and audio systems much more interesting..

Too bloody right!

Marco.

[SteveW]

Well..if I might add my two penny worth, and especially as the post is about Linn Studio Master recordings, and initiated by JC

Firstly, well done for allowing him to post again. Biased and deluded he might be, but he does add valuable contributions to the way we are all going to end up in our listening habits.

Second..I've heard Linn Studio Masters in the format and system that Linn would like them to be heard. Mind you the Komri system that I first heard them was dire...so much disco like bass was terribly uncomfortable.
However, even, there the musicality of the files was so much more enjoyable than the fully analogue versions as played through a 'keeled' LP12. The detail and subliminal information that becomes available through these files is bloody amazing. You just simple hear detail on recordings that you had no idea was there. So musical.

Thing is...I want to have that kind of reproduction without having to pay £10,000 for the Klimax DS that was streaming the files.

I happen to believe its possible, and that the key to all of this is the original file..be it the Linn studio files, or the error correction- jitter free- ripped CD's, can be so awesome.

And people like JC are pointing the way. Not very well, in my opinion. But hey, lets hear it...if there is the potential to make listening to music even better.

[Chris Frost]

Some very valid points there, Steve.

Having access to master quality recordings opens up new horizons. It's an exciting development and one that I'd like to see happen more often.

[Marco]

Hi Steve,

Nice to hear from you again

Firstly, well done for allowing him to post again. Biased and deluded he might be, but he does add valuable contributions to the way we are all going to end up in our listening habits.

Whilst I fully acknowledge the potential benefits of computer audio, and indeed have heard them for myself and also intend to obtain a suitable set-up, I will not abandon vinyl or CD, particularly when I have large physical collections to play on both formats and I can't be arsed spending time ripping CDs to a hard drive. So I don't know if it's the way I'm going to end up in my listening habits. My computer audio set-up will simply be a third source and just another way to enjoy music to a very high standard.

Second..I've heard Linn Studio Masters in the format and system that Linn would like them to be heard. Mind you the Komri system that I first heard them was dire...so much disco like bass was terribly uncomfortable.
However, even, there the musicality of the files was so much more enjoyable than the fully analogue versions as played through a 'keeled' LP12. The detail and subliminal information that becomes available through these files is bloody amazing. You just simple hear detail on recordings that you had no idea was there. So musical.

I don't doubt it, Steve. Having access to master quality recordings is potentally very exciting, but until I hear the results myself the jury is still out as far as I'm concerned. Based on my own experience I'm 100% convinced that streaming lossless files via a computer, when the quality of the original download is excellent, gives better results than are capable from any CD player *providing* a top-notch DAC is used. I'm not convinced though on the sonic performance of some of the DACs currently being used in computer set-ups.

I've also heard the Komris and your description of "disco bass" is spot on. They're simply dreadful and a total joke at the asking price.

I happen to believe its possible, and that the key to all of this is the original file..be it the Linn studio files, or the error correction- jitter free- ripped CD's, can be so awesome.

I agree. The only problem for me is that it's such a soulless way of accessing one's music. Call me a daft traditionalist but nothing beats the ritual of playing a record, and handling the sleeves and everything else that goes with it. It's so much more of a 'human' and tactile experience than using a computer; such things are important to me.

Marco.

[DSJR]

Thanks guys for some thought provoking posts (Marco, I've owned many Nakamichis, highlights being the 700ZXE, 682ZX, DRAGON, CR4 and CR7, which I sold for financial reasons)

I've been enjoying LP's 12" singles AND CD's the last couple of days, even though my stuff is a long way from top end these days. Highlights were "Spacebird" 12" (System 7) and the Depeche Mode Singles 86-98 on CD, an excellent sounding compilation IMO...

[SteveW]

Cheers Chaps.

Marco...I refer back to what I said somewhere else, and quoting someone I trust, about the software to rip CD's. The key to it all seems to be in the amount of information thst is actually on a CD, and is capable of being replayed.
I guess this is only the same as the arguement always put forward for playing vinyl...the information is there..it just needs extracting.
I reckon the Funk Firm through Arthur K is still proving to be the case...vinyl replay can still be improved upon.
Digital information on a CD can still be improved upon. I know...I've heard it. And yes, maybe the CD replay version I heard was not the best it can be.
Digital information from Studio Masters has the potential to out perform the analogue (vinyl) version. I think so..

Marco...like you, I've got a load invested in vinyl and CD 'libraries' that I love, enjoy and am not going to give up...but I can see a time coming when they can be improved upon.

If thats the case, then, bring it on...because I'd love it.

But I want to be persuaded about it, not bullied or bullshited by Ashley, JC or anyone else. However, I am prepared to listen.

[SteveW]

Oh..yes.
I couldn't agree with you more about the 'tactile' experience of havving something to touch, read,and see. Christ, even smell if it comes to it. We all know the damp smell of an old album bought from the 2nd hand shop, or wherever.
Nowadays I seem to need reading glasses for every function (oooerrr matron)
so, the thing of having a big ol album sleeve to look at cannot be underestimated these days to me !!!
Not only that...but its a bugger to read some of the stuff printed on CD's as well

At this stage in computer music...and lets face it, its in its infancy...the interface you use is still not a patch on something solid. I love the itunes coverflow...perhaps combining this with the company that Peter Gabriel is promoting using 'The Filter' software will help...where you have the album information, combined with artist info, combined with other recommendations.

[DSJR]

I'm worried that some of you are having trouble with CD's sounding spatially dead or "flat" with no "oommpphh" begind the sound.

Please bare with me on what follows...

For various reasons, I ended up with a preamp that despite a twenty year warranty (needed when our lad was toddling) and this preamp if not left on 24/7 makes everything sound a bit samey, especially on cymbals and percussion.

I was able to return to my 1991 era and re-acquire a Croft pre amp with a push-pull line buffer built in. This preamp feeds the line signals straight out through the tape record sockets with only a couple of inline resistors in the way and my CD player fed via these sockets to the power amp (with gain controls) sounds incredibly dynamic and "vital." Feeding the power amp (gain controls at max) with the proper preamp outputs caused a slight softening and "valving up" of the sound, nothing like the flatness of the previous preamp, but a colouration nonetheless, which is far less than that of many ARC preamps I should add.

A bit of tube rolling on the line stage (long plate Mullards) has improved things and Glenn Croft suggested a couple more tweaks (including removing the resistors across all the line input sockets thereby raising the gain of the line stage and replacing the supply caps with smaller value ones (???!!)) which has lifted the performance further and now, apart from a slight softening, the line stage does very little and barely alters dynamics at all.

What I'm attempting to suggest, is that some preamp line and buffer stages may remove some of the dynamics given out by the CD player and make it sound bland and ordinary. I don't know the layout of your much later Croft Marco, but I love the way Glenn handles people like me, respecting and understanding my requests and coming up with genuine and useful suggestions (he wishes to re-do the "PP" line stage in my preamp and modify the phono stage so I can use lower impedance good quality Alps pots...). Good job he'll be back in business very soon.

www.croftacoustics.co.uk

Just thought the above comments may have some interest.