Cart Loading MC

[Bigman80]

...but not the wallet, £12,000

Sweet Jesus!!!!!

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[montesquieu]

Yes, front panel switches for both gain, and for cartridge loading resistance and capacitance.

Regarding the latter, I would like to see a choice of 47R (for Transfiguration cartridges and for Ortofon SPUs), 100R (for the majority of MC carts), 240R (for EMTs) and 390R (for Denon 103s). And an ability to add 2.2uF for some Fidelity Research MCs.

Assuming (as I think the original post makes clear - that this is an MC stage rather than MM ) then I agree with this list of R values, plus 1k is useful.

Mono button too as some mono cartridges with a single generator can hum if used into both channels. Personally I also find a lot of use for different equalisation options where turnover and roll-off can be varied (again in conjunction with mono). In fact more people need this than realise they need it.

I've never been fussed about capacitance for MC, though I can see the point for older MMs.

[YNWaN]

Once you start adding alternate equalisation curves you are spending as much on the ‘support’ circuitry as the actual stage itself and costs will jump significantly.

[Marco]

I'm also of the opinion that mono vinyl set-ups need (dedicated) specialist phono stages, working in conjunction with mono-only cartridges, totally separate from the phono stage used with stereo cartridges, if you want to do the job right.

Marco.

[montesquieu]

I'm also of the opinion that mono vinyl set-ups need (dedicated) specialist phono stages, working in conjunction with mono-only cartridges, totally separate from the phono stage used with stereo cartridges, if you want to do the job right.

Marco.

Disagree Marco. Nick Gorham built a dedicated single channel mono phono stage for me when I had a dedicated mono rig (Leak TL12+ into ESL63, various turntables including a Rock 2 used with a Mono cartridge), but listening to mono on a stereo rig with stereo speakers is actually more enjoyable, with far more sense of back to front depth possible due to the psycho-acoustic effect of the wall of mono sound two speakers generate. I persevered with single speaker mono for a while as it's supposedly more authentic, but I was kidding myself and broke it up/sold it all in the end. Having a mono cartridge is more important than the mono nature of the amplification as the quality of the initial mono signal is the critical component.

As for adding complication to the phono stage - I'm thinking here from a marketing perspective - differentiation is the key to commercial success. What's the point in another me too minimalist phono stage, almost regardless how good, when many buyers will just buy a brand, and others will never get round to hearing it? Sell them the additional functionality and have them luxuriate in it .... either that or instill anxiety that without it they won't be able to hear their records properly. (Which I would argue is true).

I love my EAR 912 and its swiss army knife nature (just about any cartridge can be played through it), but it still doesn't do everything needed for satisfactory analogue reproduction of any disk from 1920 to today ... so I have to put an Equalisation box in the (tape) loop. If I could get all that, at same quality, all in one box, that would be very appealing.

As for compromise from switches etc - well the reason I bought it was because Petrat brought his down for me to hear and it was a considerable improvement on Hashimoto HM7 + Aurorasound Vida + Modwright 36.5 preamp - all purist components in their own way. What's worse, a high quality few switches in an integrated component or 2m of additional interconnect + socket connections + internal wiring?

[YNWaN]

You rather assume people are prepared to pay for all this additional functionality - my experience is that the majority are not.

[montesquieu]

You rather assume people are prepared to pay for all this additional functionality - my experience is that the majority are not.

The point I'm making is one of desirability. The world is awash with feature-free phono stages. The only one I can think of that does most of what I'm suggesting is the Thoress one:



Sexy beast I'm sure you would agree.

The various theoretical work that's been done in the area of strategic marketing suggests that there are two places to be if you want commercial success: I paraphrase but these are broadly pile-em high/sell em cheap, or niche/specialist - that is, differentiated in some way.

Of course you can still attempt to differentiate by making the best purist/'no buttons' phono stage at the price point - but there are literally hundreds of rivals out there there that would dispute the claim. Or you can build something that almost no-one else is making and meets needs that people don't know they have yet. I would suggest the latter is the easier sell - not only that but the niche can be made bigger by selling more people on the value of the approach. This is an easier course of action than a head to head 'mine's better than yours' based on purely subjective criteria.

[sq225917]

Its actually trivial to make a Paradise that can take any eq curve. Its only two resistor and cap values per channel, so could be done on push pin like loading is now.

For the purist its good as it is. If you abhor switches then rca loading plugs could be used adding only 10cm of wire, there's no more contacts as one would replace the current pushpin with the rca connection, so still only two none soldered contacts overall.

I guess for convenience sake though its front mounted switch, something like a smt Elma switch with silver make before break contacts.

[YNWaN]

Plague... That bad, eh?



Yup, ultimately the best compromise. Naim had it right with their plug-in 'K' boards, etc. It's just that what was used, component wise, wasn't the of the highest quality, or necessarily implemented optimally, but the principle was right!

Marco.

Whoops, ‘plug’ in, not ‘plague’.

Naim’s solution was to pretty much make the whole phonostage plug in and make subtly different versions with different gain and loading. In my Paradise only the loading resistor is plug in (a capacitor can also be added).

[Barry]

Assuming (as I think the original post makes clear - that this is an MC stage rather than MM ) then I agree with this list of R values, plus 1k is useful.

Mono button too as some mono cartridges with a single generator can hum if used into both channels. Personally I also find a lot of use for different equalisation options where turnover and roll-off can be varied (again in conjunction with mono). In fact more people need this than realise they need it.

I've never been fussed about capacitance for MC, though I can see the point for older MMs.

Even if we are only considering moving-coil cartridges, some gain adjustment is desirable as not all MCs have the same output. For example, EMTs put out between 0.75 - 1.05mV (at 5cm/s) depending on model, whereas Ortofon SPUs produce between 0.2 -0.3mV, again depending on model. Thats a difference of 14dB.

In general MCs are not too fussy about the capacitive loading, but some Fidelity Research cartridges definitely benefit from some extra capacitance, for example the FR202 needs 1.5uF to remove a treble peak of +6dB at 15kHz to a virtual ruler-flat response.

IMO all amplifiers should have a 'mono' button, but the facility to alter the equalisation is only really useful if you have many recordings made before 1960; after which the RIAA equalisation had been universally accepted as standard by all the major record labels.