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Thread: Sounds a bit shrill-is it my Audion?

  1. #1
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 14,592
    I'm Steve.

    Default Sounds a bit shrill-is it my Audion?

    I have an issue that I'm hoping you someone out there can help me with.

    My stuff comprises Monarch turntable with Ortofon 2M Black, Yaqin phono stage, Densen Beat B-400 Plus CD player, Audion Silver Night Mk 2 Stereo power amp, and Zu Omen Defs. Interconnects and speaker wires are Atlas.

    I bought the amp secondhand and it came with PS Vane 300b valves, dunno what they're called but the bottles are black.

    Sound is ok at low volumes, but at moderate to high volumes becomes quite 'shouty' in the midrange, with female vocals suffering the most.

    I would like the music to draw me in, but this coarseness is pushing me away, and I find myself playing the same few records and CDs all the time. Recordings made in recent years are the most painful, while early 'singer songwriter' stuff (Carly Simon, James Taylor etc you know the kind of thing)is just right.

    I don't have any 'hifi' buddies to consult with, so for all I know it may my hearing that's the problem, and I should man-up and embrace the 'liveness' of the sound.

    I've considered requesting some replacement valves in my letter to Santa, but I'd like advice from some superior minds first.

    regards, Ste

  2. #2
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: East Riding of Yorkshire these days

    Posts: 4,779
    I'm Shaun.

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    Ste, I may well be incorrect here but I think you are overdriving the amp. This amp is an 8 Watter. I had a similar amplifier back in 1997 that was an Audion 300B SEL and it sounded bloody gorgeous.

  3. #3
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: East Riding of Yorkshire these days

    Posts: 4,779
    I'm Shaun.

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    Also, for what it is worth, I have had only one experience with Psvane valves and it didn't end well.

  4. #4
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 14,592
    I'm Steve.

    Default

    Thank you Shaun for your quick reply, clearly you type with more than two fingers!

    I hadn't considered that, the Zu's have a quoted sensitivity of 101 dbW, going from 0 to Armageddon on next to nowt. I should try another amp for comparison.

  5. #5
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Norwich

    Posts: 2,814
    I'm Hugo.

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    The 2M Black is notoriously fickle regarding setup and loading at the phono stage, so it might just be that it needs a bit of height adjustment to get VTA/SRA right (the Shibata tip is quite fussy about alignment). Equally likely is that the combined capacitance load of the tonearm cabling, plus whatever the Yaqin phono stage has across its input, is a tad high. The 2M Black will tend to be uncomfortably shrill with too much capacitance - many users have found that when loaded optimally, the 2M Black becomes a superb performer.

    TonyL over at Pink Fish Media has been through all of this with his 2M Black and a search of that forum will bring up some good recommendations.

  6. #6
    Join Date: Apr 2009

    Location: Near Saffron Walden, Essex

    Posts: 7,087
    I'm Dave.

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    Two things spring to mind - the amp running out of steam and/or the speakers. I stocked Zu for a short while, some years back and whilst they were fast and fun, they were rather coarse, especially through the mid.

    Have you had the Zu speakers sounding good with other amps ? and/or have you had the amp sounding good with other speakers ?

  7. #7
    Join Date: Apr 2009

    Location: Near Saffron Walden, Essex

    Posts: 7,087
    I'm Dave.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ammonite Acoustics View Post
    The 2M Black is notoriously fickle regarding setup and loading at the phono stage, so it might just be that it needs a bit of height adjustment to get VTA/SRA right (the Shibata tip is quite fussy about alignment). Equally likely is that the combined capacitance load of the tonearm cabling, plus whatever the Yaqin phono stage has across its input, is a tad high. The 2M Black will tend to be uncomfortably shrill with too much capacitance - many users have found that when loaded optimally, the 2M Black becomes a superb performer.

    TonyL over at Pink Fish Media has been through all of this with his 2M Black and a search of that forum will bring up some good recommendations.
    If it was cartridge related, it would occur at any volume level.

  8. #8
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 14,592
    I'm Steve.

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    Thanks Hugo, I'll check out TonyL, hopefully not too many big words will be used as I'm a total donkey when it comes to things technical. I should mention that the coarseness applies to CDs as well.

  9. #9
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Norwich

    Posts: 2,814
    I'm Hugo.

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    Ah, I read the OP as being OK with CD, but reading it again properly I can see that it’s a system problem. Still worth setting up a 2M Black carefully, though.

  10. #10
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 14,592
    I'm Steve.

    Default

    Hi Dave, this is all your fault, telling us about your Luxman amps and making me want one!

    I first heard the Zu's an Audio show in Manchester about 5 years ago, driven by some 845's. and then I auditioned them with a Siver Night. Both times I was impressed with the sound.

    When took delivery of the speakers the nice man from Audio Counsel (think his name was Dave too) thought the amp might want a service, but I'd run out money by then.

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