+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 9 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 87

Thread: Vegans and Vegetarians

  1. #1
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: East Riding of Yorkshire these days

    Posts: 4,779
    I'm Shaun.

    Default Vegans and Vegetarians

    Right then, this year I have made quite a few new acquaintences with vegans and vegetarians and do not under any circumstance want this to be directed at any individual or establishment. I do not want what I am about to say to be taken as some kind of psuedo religous rant or anti statement but I just don't think they get the whole concept of animal cruelty.

    Back in the late seventies I worked for a huge chemical giant that specialised in agrochemicals that were mainly unbelievably toxic. I think we have all heard of permethrin...? Well, to take one example, this one, the company decided that permethrin (an active pyrethroid) was not efficient enough so they tagged a cyanide molecule on to it to make the new active ingredient cypermethrin. I worked on this compound for many years carrying out product development and optimisation. Cypermethrin is used worldwide to kill the cotton weevil that if not addressed will decimate cotton crops. Cotton is used by vegans for clothing. So am I correct that it is OK to kill billions of insects every minute of every day throughout the world but it is cruel and inhummane to kill animals that look cute and cuddly but on which we feed...?

    Most animals are killed by what is considered humane methods but insects are killed by chemical warfare which is effectively the equivalent of using a nerve toxin on a human as cypermethrin works as a neurotoxin. Yes, one could argue that insects are not sentient beings and therefore they are nothing like us but what other animals in the world are actually like us...? What animals are aware of life and death...?

    I'll start on GMO's next...!

    Marco, if this is too sensitive then please delete.

  2. #2
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

    Posts: 51,624
    I'm Geoff.

    Default

    Where do you draw the line Shaun, Is there pity for the millions of bacteria that die when you pour a bit of bleach down the sink? Do you stop walking about, for fear of inevitably stepping on insects? Do you stop digging the garden in order to avoid bisecting earthworms?

    On the other hand. Those who like meat, might like to go and kill their own cow...........................with their bare hands, just to keep it fair. See who comes out on top 'eh?
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

  3. #3
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: East Riding of Yorkshire these days

    Posts: 4,779
    I'm Shaun.

    Default

    Maybe this is where we should draw the line:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jainism


  4. #4
    Join Date: Aug 2010

    Location: East Midlands

    Posts: 426
    I'm Hugh.

    Default

    I really don't have a problem with vegans or vegetarians. I think they're seriously misguided. Humans are omnivorous, but as long as they don't judge my eating choices that's ok.

    It's when they start proselytising that I start to lose it.

  5. #5
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

    Default

    Humans have been farming animals for a long time. Most of the animals wouldn't exist now if we didn't tbh. Cereal crops are the staples. I don't eat a lot of meat but would rather die than stop.

    As said above if they leave me to mine I will do likewise
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
    FIIO K7 BT, M11 PLUS, BTR7, KA5 - OPPO BDP-103D - PANASONIC UB450 - PANASONIC 4K ULTRA HD TV - PIXEL 6 - AVANTREE LR BLUETOOTH - 2* X600 SOUNDCORE - HEADPHONES INCLUDE, FIIO, NURAPHONES', FOCAL, OPPO, BOSE, CAMBRIDGE, BOWER & WILKINS, DEVIALET, MARSHALL, SONY, MITCHELL & JOHNSTON - 2*ZBOOK'S- MERCURY BD ROM, ROON, QOBUZ, TIDAL, PLEX, CYBERLINK, JRIVER - MULTI HDD'S -

    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

    "You don't have free will. You have the appearance of free will.”

    “There's a war out there, old friend. A world war. And it's not about who's got the most bullets. It's about who controls the information. What we see and hear, how we work, what we think... it's all about the information!”


    ***SMILE, BE HAPPY***

  6. #6
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Alicante. Spain.

    Posts: 1,885
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    Hmmm - I eat meat but I have to say that all animals have a greater or lesser degree of sentience. Elephants go away from the herd to die and mourn their dead for days, etc.

    If someone threatened me with a gun I'd be very aware of my mortality - if you hold a gun to my dog she won't care, not because she isn't sentient but because she had no understanding of a gun. She is however aware that cars are dangerous and will not walk in the road, though I've never told her not to. She knows fire is also bad for her. I am only aware of my own mortality because I recognise the threat - but all animals respond to danger in the same way as us. The difference is they cannot communicate it to us and they are not at the same level - god forbid, the way we treat them sometimes. My opinion of course.
    Technics SP10 mk2
    Jan Allaerts MC 1 Boron mk1 cart
    Miyajima Shilabe cart
    Hashimoto HM-X SUT
    Siggwan (gimballed not unipivot) Cocobola 12"
    Aurorasound Vida LCR Phonostage
    The Truth linestage
    Dave Slagle Autoformer Volume Controller
    Cary 805c SET amps
    Audio Note ANe-SPX speakers
    Townshend Isolda speaker cables
    Cardas Golden Presence interconnects

  7. #7
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

    Default

    I might add I abhor cruelty to animals. Oh and bugs and bacteria both have a major positive impact of the planet.
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
    FIIO K7 BT, M11 PLUS, BTR7, KA5 - OPPO BDP-103D - PANASONIC UB450 - PANASONIC 4K ULTRA HD TV - PIXEL 6 - AVANTREE LR BLUETOOTH - 2* X600 SOUNDCORE - HEADPHONES INCLUDE, FIIO, NURAPHONES', FOCAL, OPPO, BOSE, CAMBRIDGE, BOWER & WILKINS, DEVIALET, MARSHALL, SONY, MITCHELL & JOHNSTON - 2*ZBOOK'S- MERCURY BD ROM, ROON, QOBUZ, TIDAL, PLEX, CYBERLINK, JRIVER - MULTI HDD'S -

    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

    "You don't have free will. You have the appearance of free will.”

    “There's a war out there, old friend. A world war. And it's not about who's got the most bullets. It's about who controls the information. What we see and hear, how we work, what we think... it's all about the information!”


    ***SMILE, BE HAPPY***

  8. #8
    Join Date: May 2012

    Location: London

    Posts: 423
    I'm Spartacus.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Haselsh1 View Post
    So am I correct that it is OK to kill billions of insects every minute of every day throughout the world but it is cruel and inhummane to kill animals that look cute and cuddly but on which we feed...?
    You are wrong in assuming that being vegetarian is simply about cruelty to animals. Eating meat is not environmentally sustainable and one future scenario is that we will be eating insects.
    Cheers, Jeff

  9. #9
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

    Default

    My last post on subject; humans need to start taking responsibility for their breeding. There are far too many folk having huge families still when its both unnessessary and unsustainable. I lay this mostly at the male door.
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
    FIIO K7 BT, M11 PLUS, BTR7, KA5 - OPPO BDP-103D - PANASONIC UB450 - PANASONIC 4K ULTRA HD TV - PIXEL 6 - AVANTREE LR BLUETOOTH - 2* X600 SOUNDCORE - HEADPHONES INCLUDE, FIIO, NURAPHONES', FOCAL, OPPO, BOSE, CAMBRIDGE, BOWER & WILKINS, DEVIALET, MARSHALL, SONY, MITCHELL & JOHNSTON - 2*ZBOOK'S- MERCURY BD ROM, ROON, QOBUZ, TIDAL, PLEX, CYBERLINK, JRIVER - MULTI HDD'S -

    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

    "You don't have free will. You have the appearance of free will.”

    “There's a war out there, old friend. A world war. And it's not about who's got the most bullets. It's about who controls the information. What we see and hear, how we work, what we think... it's all about the information!”


    ***SMILE, BE HAPPY***

  10. #10
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

    Posts: 51,624
    I'm Geoff.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by struth View Post
    There are far too many folk having huge families still when its both unnessessary and unsustainable
    We need a cull!
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 9 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •