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Thread: New speakers - masses of boomy bass

  1. #91
    Join Date: Mar 2016

    Location: Brighton, UK.

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    I'm Mike.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fatmarley View Post
    I definitely try a different amp. For a cheap experiment, a Cambridge Audio AM1 can be had for peanuts and sounds surprisingly good for a budget amp (No sonic nasties). Or a quad 303 (assuming easy load), 306, or 909 and a passive preamp will sound very different to your Naim, and the sound you describe.
    I was thinking Quad actually, aren't they very old though? Would need to be serviced right?

  2. #92
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: London

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    I'm James.

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    Hmm, if its a speaker control issue then a 1980s Jap amp for little money would be my first choice, or as Jerry said above try a T-amp which can be cheap as chips. You aren't looking for perfection at this point, just to see what affects what, and how much. If it were me I'd pull the speakers out into the room a lot and play with their placement. I know they can't stay there but you'll get an idea of the effect that the room is having. I'd also suggest if you want a warmer sound and can't get your speakers out of the corner then why not look for a pair of Snell J? They work fine in corners, or the AN-J which are designed for corner loading. They seem to be available from time to time at very reasonable money and sound great with your taste in music.

  3. #93
    Join Date: Mar 2016

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jazid View Post
    Hmm, if its a speaker control issue then a 1980s Jap amp for little money would be my first choice, or as Jerry said above try a T-amp which can be cheap as chips. You aren't looking for perfection at this point, just to see what affects what, and how much. If it were me I'd pull the speakers out into the room a lot and play with their placement. I know they can't stay there but you'll get an idea of the effect that the room is having. I'd also suggest if you want a warmer sound and can't get your speakers out of the corner then why not look for a pair of Snell J? They work fine in corners, or the AN-J which are designed for corner loading. They seem to be available from time to time at very reasonable money and sound great with your taste in music.
    I tried moving the speakers doesn't make much difference, I've now put them bang up against he back wall, I think this seems best? They're front ported anyway. Whats a T-amp?

  4. #94
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

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    I'm Martin.

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    The bass doesn't improve with positioning so I'd say you have an amp with low damping factor and speakers that are a little loose in the bass. So that means changing the amp or speakers. Snell/Audionote speakers would work in corners, as suggested, personally I don't go for that room enhanced bass thing they do, but it is all personal taste. Tannoy DC would also work but spendier by a margin. But I don't know how happy either speaker would be with the Naim amp.

    If it were me I'd keep the Talismans and sell the Naim pre and power and get a passive pre and a higher damped power amp or buy a renovated Jap battleship integrated from late 80s / early nineties. That won't take any nonsense from the Ruarks. You want a top of the line one mind, budget a grand for it at least.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  5. #95
    Join Date: Mar 2016

    Location: Brighton, UK.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    The bass doesn't improve with positioning so I'd say you have an amp with low damping factor and speakers that are a little loose in the bass. So that means changing the amp or speakers. Snell/Audionote speakers would work in corners, as suggested, personally I don't go for that room enhanced bass thing they do, but it is all personal taste. Tannoy DC would also work but spendier by a margin. But I don't know how happy either speaker would be with the Naim amp.

    If it were me I'd keep the Talismans and sell the Naim pre and power and get a passive pre and a higher damped power amp or buy a renovated Jap battleship integrated from late 80s / early nineties. That won't take any nonsense from the Ruarks. You want a top of the line one mind, budget a grand for it at least.
    Thanks for the replies Martin, wouldn't a £300 Sony 700 ES do the job? You would get an awful lot of Jap amp for a grand!

  6. #96
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

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    I'm Martin.

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    it would sound okay, and would probably sort your bass issue. But some of the cheaper ES gear is nothing special. The flagship amps are the ones to go for, where Japanese corporate pride has been staked, so it is as good as they could get it, rather than built to a price point. Worth paying the extra IMO.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  7. #97
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: Gravesend and France

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    I'm paul.

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    I swapped PX25 monoblocks, built by Jim turner for Jim carfrae to demo his carfrae horns to a Sony STR 6055 receiver I paid £69 for and it does all the PX25's did and more. Haven't found another STR 6055 for less than £300 lately. It's as good as all the valve amps I've had and I had always dismissed solid state as dull.
    Bakoon 13r Denon DP80 Stax UA-70 Shure Ultra 500 in a Martin Bastin body with jico stylus, project ds2 digital Rullit aero 8 field coils in tqwt speakers

    Office system, DIY CSS fullrange speakers with aurum cantus G2 ribbons yulong dac Sony STR6055 receiver Jvc QL-A51 direct drive turntable, Leema sub. JVC Z4S cart is in the house

    Garage system another Sony receiver, cassette deck


    System components are subject to change without warning and at the discretion of the owner.

  8. #98
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: Gravesend and France

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    I'm paul.

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    There is a Sony STR 6055 on eBay starting £125 no bids ends tomorrow
    Bakoon 13r Denon DP80 Stax UA-70 Shure Ultra 500 in a Martin Bastin body with jico stylus, project ds2 digital Rullit aero 8 field coils in tqwt speakers

    Office system, DIY CSS fullrange speakers with aurum cantus G2 ribbons yulong dac Sony STR6055 receiver Jvc QL-A51 direct drive turntable, Leema sub. JVC Z4S cart is in the house

    Garage system another Sony receiver, cassette deck


    System components are subject to change without warning and at the discretion of the owner.

  9. #99
    Join Date: Mar 2017

    Location: Seaford UK

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    I'm Dennis.

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    Borrow, or get a mate round to lend and help with trying another amp, an amp which is well known for its low O/P impedance and with a high drive capability. It will show instantly if your amp is to blame for poor damping.

    The only remaining things are; your speakers are inherently underdamped by design, be it in the drivers or the Xover making them 'wooly', or your room interaction, this usually very clear from symptoms.

  10. #100
    Join Date: Feb 2017

    Location: Midlands

    Posts: 93
    I'm Mark.

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    I just clicked on this thread randomly. I happen to have used Talisman 2s for a decade (changed a couple of months back), a friend still runs them, and my brother still has some in a second system. I'd guess I've heard them on about a dozen different amps or pre/power combinations and with stacks of sources, up to reasonably good like a £4k RRP combination of CD Transport and Dac.

    I scan read the thread.

    Firstly, you have them on spikes, and on carpet yes? If so great, and you want those spikes driven straight through the carpet to make contact with the floorboards or concrete underneath. (I saw mention of sitting them on metal discs/coins? Forget doing that). Also, you need to spend time making sure they do not wobble about, levelling the spikes until they sit perfectly with no wobble if you go to rock them.

    Now, IF you chose to put a big stone slab under each speaker and put them on that instead fair enough, but don't expect a different ballpark of bass, it won't be radically different.

    Someone else has spotted positioning, I think they are right, ideally a little more out from the wall and sides of the room will help a bit regarding bass.

    From there on in there can be reasons you don't like them:

    1) You just don't like them
    2) How they sound in your particular room is something you don't like
    ...but...
    3) Are they not sounding like they should anyway?

    So, you need to rule out number 3. All I can say is I have run them or heard them with loads of amps, from an old £150 Arcam Alpha One (I think I have that noted right), to custom built valve integrated, to Rotel Michi Pre-Power, Class D (Nord), about 6 variants of Cyrus amps, and a few more. Now, with every amp, the character of the Talisman's never really changed too much, not enough to have a completely different amount of bass. So, my advice (just like the guy above says) is get hold of any other amp you can, any old speaker cable (preferably not some naim specific thing) and a CD player, any old one again. Now, play music on it for 2 minutes and ask yourself if the bass is overwhelming still, if it is, forget Talismans in that room, they won't be for you. If you however find they sound way different, you've managed to find an amp and kit that does not partner well with them at all, I never did, I found ones I preferred but not ones that truly didn't play ball.

    By the way, they are really easy to drive, they aren't in need of lots of power to sound great, and the sound you can get out of them is really really good for the small amount of money they cost, if they suit the room you have them in. I kept mine and they are back in their boxes up in the loft, one day I might put them into another system.

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