Linear vs Switched mode PSU

[anthonyTD]

I agree with that too Geoff,
My point was not about designing equipment that deliberately distorts whats fed to it, far from it, my point has always been about how people as individuals hear' and therefore perceive' recorded music on a personal level, and why they choose certain aspects of an audio replay chain to further enhance their listening pleasure!

My thoughts too. An amplifier should amplify and do no more or less. With a good amp, it should not be possible to guess whether one was listening to any particular type of design.

[walpurgis]

why they choose certain aspects of an audio replay chain to further enhance their listening pleasure!

Surely there's a bit of that in everybody's choices. I think I do it. What I mean, is that I'm more swayed by transparency and lucidity than neutrality.

[Marco]

...yes, but transparency and lucidity may also be a part of 'neutrality'

Marco.

[Marco]

I took your original point to be; HI FI SHOULD MEAN THE CLOSEST APROACH TO THE ORIGINAL SOUND!
My point was, and still is; what if the sound engineer cocked it up from the begining, which is why I believe most folk cant, wont, or dont want to listen to The Closest Aproach To The Original Sound!

I think most folks here understand *exactly* where you're coming from and agree, including Jez, although he won't admit it, as it doesn't quite suit his argument!

Marco.

[walpurgis]

...yes, but transparency and lucidity may also be a part of 'neutrality'

Marco.

I was implying that (most) colourations don't bother me too much!

[Marco]

To argue that a hi-fi amp should even have a voice strikes me as bizarre. Sure, musical instruments are voiced to create a particular sound - and so are guitar amps (though they really belong in the musical instrument category) - but hi-fi amps should be devoid of their own "voice" and simply reproduce what's fed into them.
Shouldn't they?

In theory, yes.

However, if musical accuracy is the goal, i.e. said hi-fi amp possessing the ability to reproduce a high-fidelity recording of a guitar, so that it *genuinely* sounds like a real guitar [as the guitar did when it was initially recorded], rather than simply what a collection of measurement equipment deems as such, when the amp is tested by the designer on his bench, (but that may not actually equate to such in the real world), then during the final design stage, a good designer will 'voice' said amp, so that it delivers the former [musical accuracy], simply by subtly altering the circuit and/or changing some components used - the effect of which may be measurable or not...

That type of 'voicing', for me, is perfectly acceptable, and indeed if done correctly, highly desirable [as the designer's goal is ultimately to achieve greater musical accuracy], and a different thing altogether from 'voicing' in such as way as to deliberately colour the sound, in order to create a euphonic effect and/or ameliorate certain tonal characteristics [inherent in the sound of the recorded guitar] that should be there (i.e were part of its original sound), but which may 'offend' the ears of the listener.

I trust that you can appreciate the difference?

Essentially, just because one's test equipment/measurement apparatus deems a piece of equipment 'accurate', doesn't necessarily mean that it is. Perhaps it may be electrically, but not always musically - so that's when the ears of a good designer come in, to ensure that the final sound that the amplifier produces (to them) is right

Marco.

[Marco]

I was implying that (most) colourations don't bother me too much!

I see... Well, they would me, *if* to my ears, said coloration resulted in significantly falsifying the sound of a recorded instrument. For example, coloration that smoothed or 'rounded off' its natural raw sound.

If I'm listening to a violin or a trumpet, for example, played in the same room as me, then I want the sound my system reproduces of such (as far as possible) to 'take my head off', just as it would in real life. If something's not meant to sound 'nice', then I don't want my system making it so!

I want to hear the natural raucousness of those instruments in all its glory [as well as their timbre and tonality], simply because that's what makes a recording of such sound believable and LIFELIKE.

Marco.

[anthonyTD]

Look lets get real here, from the beginning of the recording process, through to its end; it’s a big fat lie!
One example, one of the recording studios I go to on a regular basis has’ on one of its walls the entire string compartment of a grand piano, it is used to add echo to what is possibly an otherwise sonically underwhelming room.
Now let’s take the argument from the very beginning, would you rather listen to someone’s voice being recorded in a somewhat dead sounding room, or would it be perhaps more beguiling, or interesting, or maybe even more real sounding to use the echo effect?

Ok, now lets get on to the equipment, anything amplified will also lie, it will add to; or detract from certain sonic aspects , of the original recording, that were in the original recording after the decision was made to use the echo, or not!
Why? Because the equipment is made up of components and circuitry that will impose their own sonic imperfections/character to the original signal they were given.

Another quick example; A guitarist recently brought a vintage Fender amp to me to repair, and also to ask my opinion on different rectifiers, Now going on what some here would say, Jez included, diodes dont know, or care where their electrons come from, nor do caps, etc, etc, if that were the case, then both rectifier types would sound exactly the same, guess what, the guy was almost dumbfounded after hearing how different his amp sounded, just by changing a simple rectifier valve from one type, to another, now lets get back to it

How do we know that each piece of kit in the replay chain is accurate?
Well’ some would say, we’ll measure them, eg, take the amplifier, well test what goes in, and what comes out, and measure any discrepancies, what if you measure two different amplifiers, from two different manufacturers, and you find that there is no discernable differences in all aspects of the test procedures performed across the audio frequency spectrum?

Well, one might come to the conclusion that both amps are telling the truth, and that either amp will do the job of faithfully reproducing what it is fed’ in the context of the audio replay chain, ie; source, speakers etc.

Now what happens when both amplifiers are tested in the system, and they both produce a similar, but slightly different portrayal of the original signal being fed to the speakers? It happens, therefore; just by these couple of examples, we can see that we often need variously different approaches’ to achieve something that resembles what we feel, as individuals that which constitutes as right or wrong as far as the audio replay chain is concerned!

[Stratmangler]

Look lets get real here, from the beginning of the recording process, through to its end; it’s a big fat lie!

Amen!

[Marco]

...which is why the designing of hi-fi equipment, as well as the listening to the sound it produces, is *ultimately* a subjective thing!

Marco.