general election

[tapid]

But just imagine if they were presiding ( is that a word ) over 3 million unemployed, folks would
go barmy ! Instead there s record employment and lowest unemployment for 40 years ?. Surely
its not as bad as some peeps say on here ?. Baby boomers from post war are retiring now, this is bound
to put huge pressures on nhs. People new this 30 years ago it was called a ticking time bomb, but little preparation
seems to have been put in place over those years ! I think current diabetes costs are predicted at something like
18 ? billion a year by 2020. Its still a great country to live in, not suggesting because of this government btw.
( even I wound nt sat that)

[Macca]

We have a record number of people in employment but the population of the country is also at record levels. I believe the number of people registered as unemployed and looking for work is still 1.5 million or thereabouts.

You might recall back in 1979 that 1 million unemployed was considered unacceptable.

So the employment situation is not great in reality.

[Macca]

Btw, how you could even consider voting UKIP, is beyond me, as they're ostensibly a watered-down, superficially more palatable version of the NF! Racists should never be in power in our country

Marco.

Plenty of non-white UKIP members so I dispute that they are anything like the NF

I also made it clear earlier in the thread that I am not that keen on UKIP, however I am keen on Brexit and voting UKIP does seem to send a message to the Conservatives that Brexit needs to happen. If it wasn't for UKIP we would never have had a chance to vote on the European question.

[tapid]

Your point about the population of the country is a fair one Martin.! best wishes

[Joe]

You might recall back in 1979 that 1 million unemployed was considered unacceptable..

Back in 1979 it was actually 1.5 million. It peaked at 3.2 million in 1982. It was last under a million in way back in 1973.

[Marco]

Plenty of non-white UKIP members so I dispute that they are anything like the NF

You're of course entitled to sympathise with whoever you like, but if you can't see that Farage, underneath his rather thinly constructed facade to the contrary, is fundamentally a racist, then I'm afraid you're allowing your support for some of UKIP's policies to cloud the reality, much as I feel you've allowed your unfortunate experiences with socialism, gained during your youth, to cloud your thinking, and engender in you a misplaced support for Conservatism.

That being the case (Farage a racist), if UKIP were voted in, you'd soon see his true agenda (which some in his party may have been blind to so far), unfolded in all its 'glory'!!

Marco.

[Macca]

You're of course entitled to sympathise with whoever you like, but if you can't see that Farage, underneath his rather thinly constructed facade to the contrary, is fundamentally a racist, then I'm afraid you're allowing your support for some of UKIP's policies to cloud the reality, much as I feel you've allowed your unfortunate experiences with socialism, gained during your youth, to cloud your thinking, and engender in you a misplaced support for Conservatism.

That being the case (Farage a racist), if UKIP were voted in, you'd soon see his true agenda (which some in his party may have been blind to so far), unfolded in all its 'glory'!!

Marco.

Firstly I don't 'support Conservatism'. I do support conservatism. Big difference. I am not nor have I ever been slightly impressed with Theresa May. Hence the tricky decision about who to vote for.

I don't agree that Farage is a racist in the actual meaning of the word. i.e the belief in the supremacy of one race over another.

I'll assume you are using the modern definition of racist here i.e 'someone who does not agree with me on issues of immigration.' In which case he is a racist and so am I.

UKIP will not be voted into power so what they may or may not plan to do is irrelevant. However the total number of votes cast for UKIP is a good indicator to the two parties who do have a chance of power that there is still a hard core of support for leaving the EU.

My distaste for socialism is not based solely upon having seem it in action first hand back in the 1980s but also upon my knowledge of economics, history and business. In short: It doesn't work and its net effect is to hurt the people it proclaims to help.

This does not mean that I swing automatically to Conservative, although I appreciate that the typical wide-eyed socialist will automatically assume to be the case. This is because they see it all as good guys versus bad, black and white, with us or against us.

IMO it is that childlike naivety that creates divisions that need not exist and which makes it all the more difficult to arrive at genuine, pragmatic solutions to the important issues.

[Arkless Electronics]

You're of course entitled to sympathise with whoever you like, but if you can't see that Farage, underneath his rather thinly constructed facade to the contrary, is fundamentally a racist, then I'm afraid you're allowing your support for some of UKIP's policies to cloud the reality, much as I feel you've allowed your unfortunate experiences with socialism, gained during your youth, to cloud your thinking, and engender in you a misplaced support for Conservatism.

That being the case (Farage a racist), if UKIP were voted in, you'd soon see his true agenda (which some in his party may have been blind to so far), unfolded in all its 'glory'!!

Marco.

+1! I have EXTREME prejudice against ukip and anyone who votes for them and regard them as complete c***s. If I heard of Farages untimely demise I would celebrate. Same with Trump!

[Marco]

Firstly I don't 'support Conservatism'. I do support conservatism. Big difference. I am not nor have I ever been slightly impressed with Theresa May. Hence the tricky decision about who to vote for.

I thought you said you voted Tory in 1987, thus for Thatcher of all people...? If that isn't supporting Conservatism, I don't know what is!

I don't agree that Farage is a racist in the actual meaning of the word. i.e the belief in the supremacy of one race over another.

I'll assume you are using the modern definition of racist here i.e 'someone who does not agree with me on issues of immigration.' In which case he is a racist and so am I.

I'm using the "definition" of such, as indicated by my eyes and ears, whenever listening to and watching him speak, which for me clearly indicates that, if he had his way, he'd indiscriminately banish ALL Muslim immigrants from the UK and prevent any more from entering the country. If that's not fundamentally racist, I don't know what is.

My distaste for socialism is not based solely upon having seem it in action first hand back in the 1980s but also upon my knowledge of economics, history and business. In short: It doesn't work and its net effect is to hurt the people it proclaims to help.

What, you mean like conservatism (small 'c'), as currently practised by the Tories, isn't hurting those very same people? I'm afraid that the mountains of currently available evidence to the contrary proves otherwise...

Also, not all socialists are hapless idiots like Derek Hatton!!

This does not mean that I swing automatically to Conservative, although I appreciate that the typical wide-eyed socialist will automatically assume to be the case.

Lol... I hope you're not referring to me.

The only kind of 'ist' I am, is a REALIST, and yes, a "wide-eyed" one at that, observing the poverty, suffering and injustice all around me in our country, which is supposed to be one of the richest in the world, but yet continually ignores properly looking after its most vulnerable people - and it's quite clear to me who is most responsible for that, and it isn't the socialists!

IMO it is that childlike naivety that creates divisions that need not exist and which makes it all the more difficult to arrive at genuine, pragmatic solutions to the important issues.

No "childlike naivety" here; simply the observing of undisputed reality, which you appear to wish to brush under the carpet.

So what are the "important issues" then, for you?

I suspect the likes of achieving greater fairness and equality in our society, an end to UK poverty and homelessness, and folk starving in the streets (which could easily be achieved by penalising the fat cats/spending less on nuclear weapons, and diverting those funds instead into to building more hostels), and ensuring that those citizens of our country, together with the rest of our underprivileged, live a dignified and purposeful life, or an end to the disabled having their benefits cruelly cut, won't feature in your list of "important issues" because you rarely, if ever, mention such things....................

Marco.

[Arkless Electronics]

I thought you said you voted Tory in 1987, thus for Thatcher of all people...? If that isn't supporting Conservatism, I don't know what is!



I'm using the "definition" of such, as indicated by my eyes and ears, whenever listening to and watching him speak, which for me clearly indicates that, if he had his way, he'd indiscriminately banish ALL Muslim immigrants from the UK and prevent any more from entering the country. If that's not fundamentally racist, I don't know what is.



What, you mean like conservatism (small 'c'), as currently practised by the Tories, isn't hurting those very same people? I'm afraid that the mountains of currently available evidence to the contrary proves otherwise...

Also, not all socialists are hapless idiots like Derek Hatton!!



Lol... I hope you're not referring to me.

The only kind of 'ist' I am, is a REALIST, and yes, a "wide-eyed" one at that, observing the poverty, suffering and injustice all around me in our country, which is supposed to be one of the richest in the world, but yet continually ignores properly looking after its most vulnerable people - and it's quite clear to me who is most responsible for that, and it isn't the socialists!



No "childlike naivety" here; simply the observing of undisputed reality, which you appear to wish to brush under the carpet.

So what are the "important issues" then, for you?

I suspect the likes of achieving greater fairness and equality in our society, an end to UK poverty and homelessness, and folk starving in the streets (which could easily be achieved by penalising the fat cats/spending less on nuclear weapons, and diverting those funds instead into to building more hostels), and ensuring that those citizens of our country, together with the rest of our underprivileged, live a dignified and purposeful life, or an end to the disabled having their benefits cruelly cut, won't feature in your list of "important issues" because you rarely, if ever, mention such things....................

Marco.

Spot on!

If you look at the people living in an average UK street in an average UK city there will be the bloke 2 doors down in the wheel chair, the single mother with 2 kids over the road, the old bloke who needs to stop to use his inhaler every 50 yards, the 3 or 4 who lost their jobs when the local factory shut down (probably cos of brexit!) and haven't been able to find another job cos they're in their 50's and haven't done anything but work in that factory...

If you vote Tory you are saying "yep I've just condemned all of you, the poorest and neediest in my own street, to a worse life cos Tory tax policy means I (me me me!!!) can save a fiver a week towards my next foreign holiday/new car/ jacuzzi/whatever and I don't give a fuck what happens to my neighbours".

I don't know how anyone who would condone this can sleep at night... and if they can then I hope they themselves lose their jobs and or become ill and find out what it's like first hand!

I think it was Gandhi who said something on the lines of "a nation may be judged on how it treats its sick, its elderly, its animals and its prisoners".