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Thread: Another major (presumably terrorist) incident. Now in Manchester.

  1. #321
    Join Date: Feb 2013

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    I'm Grant.

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    even the sas dont get official written stk orders. only those involed know for sure. most firearms folk in such circumstances will aim for the body first to bring down first shot.
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  2. #322
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim View Post
    UK Police never 'normally' shoot people in the leg, if they have then they have missed.
    I completely agree with your post above, Tim.

    However, surely in instances where highly-trained marksmen (using rifles with very accurate telescopic sights) have sufficient time to zoom in and obtain a clear shot of the target area, a leg wound could be achieved?

    I of course appreciate that such an instance wasn't applicable, in terms of what happened recently in London. There simply wasn't time for that, so the police did only what they could do.

    However, *if* possible, it would be useful not to kill these scum outright, so that later police could obtain from them what may be vital information, which could prevent other similar (planned) incidents from occurring.

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

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  3. #323
    Join Date: Feb 2011

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    However, surely in instances where highly-trained marksmen (using rifles with telescopic sights) have sufficient time to zoom in and focus on their target, a leg wound could easily be achieved?
    Short answer, no Marco - and if I ever get up to Wrexham (not that far now) I'll explain why
    "People will hear what you tell them to hear" - Thomas Edison

  4. #324
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

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    Okies - look forward to it

    I've rephrased the question slightly, btw....

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

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    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

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  5. #325
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

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    I'm Martin.

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    If the target is moving, which they usually are, then it is very difficult to hit a specific body part, no mater how good a shot you are or what fancy equipment you have.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  6. #326
    Join Date: Jan 2008

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    Yes, but I'm talking about when the target is still, for a period of time long enough [it need only be a matter of seconds] for a trained marksman to put a bullet straight into the area he has clearly within his sights.

    I've used rifles (.303s) to hunt deer, and such like in Italy [which trust me aren't easy targets either, in terms of getting a clear head shot at distance, for a clean kill], so I although not a police marksman, employed to do his duty during something such as a terror attack, I know a little about how guns work

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  7. #327
    Join Date: Apr 2012

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    I'm Geoff.

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    It's not just the difficulty of taking an accurate shot at a smaller target that would be a problem. There's also the need for immediate and decisive action. In a fast moving situation, you can't make judgement calls as to whether a shot should be fatal or not.

    I'm not in favour of high velocity weapons in close quarters situations and they are not normally used. A powerful rifle will go straight through a body and maybe even carry on through a wall or two as well, with the possibility of injuring others, even at distance.
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

  8. #328
    Join Date: Feb 2011

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    Quote Originally Posted by walpurgis View Post
    A powerful rifle will go straight through a body and maybe even carry on through a wall or two as well, with the possibility of injuring others, even at distance.
    Exactly Geoff, happened in Northern Ireland when a shot fired from a 7.62mm SLR over penetrated the target and went through housing walls to kill a child in their room.
    "People will hear what you tell them to hear" - Thomas Edison

  9. #329
    Join Date: Jan 2008

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    Good points (Geoff and Tim), which I fully accept

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  10. #330
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

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    I'm Martin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim View Post
    Exactly Geoff, happened in Northern Ireland when a shot fired from a 7.62mm SLR over penetrated the target and went through housing walls to kill a child in their room.
    This is one of the reasons why NATO moved to the 5.56 mm round (.22 calibre). The smaller round tumbles inside the body on impact rather than passing straight through.

    if the target is standing still long enough then you could realistically aim for a leg shot. That is unlikely to happen in a terrorist incident, though; and if you miss he will be off and running and your chance to take him down may have gone. Why risk it?
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

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