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Thread: I feel terrible....... Trolls on Forums

  1. #51
    Join Date: Jun 2010

    Location: Liverpool, UK.

    Posts: 1,228
    I'm Geoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pieoftheday View Post
    Just heard this on radio4 and thought it apt for this thread " no one can make you feel inferior without your consent"
    This is very true of course but if you're depressed, consent is not an option within your possession to give.

    It's our hobby, it is unimportant in the grand scheme of life and not worthy of such mud slinging.

    I wish the OP all the very best and hope that he receives the help, support and guidance that he is able to pass such comments as a minutiae in a fulfilled life.

    Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
    Last edited by oldius; 22-04-2017 at 11:34.
    Main system: Sony TTS8000; AT1010; Audio Technica Art1; The Lentek; Cambridge 851n, Yamaha NS1000.
    System 2 - SBT; Technics SH-X1000 DAC; Denon PMA-850

  2. #52
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,779
    I'm Martin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe View Post
    At the end of the day, hifi is just boxes and wires. Some people take it all far too seriously IMO, to the point where they're offering to fight others on the all-important issue of whether cables make a difference.
    The fighting is not about the cables per se but due to the fact that whilst arguing on the internet about cables - or anything else - it is too easy to be disrespectful to people. You rarely see this happen when people talk face to face. Someone disrespects you, your first instinct is to knock them on their ass. That's perfectly normal.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  3. #53
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Wakefield west yorkshire

    Posts: 1,930
    I'm James.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldius View Post
    This is very true of course but if you're depressed, consent is not an option within your possession to give.

    It's our hobby, it is unimportant in the grand scheme of life and not worthy of such mud slinging.

    I wish the OP all the very best and hope that he receives the help, support and guidance that he is able to pass such comments as a minutiae in a fulfilled lie.

    Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
    Indeed its a simplistic approach, but has a certain logic
    novafidelity x40 music server/pre/dac, Arcam A39, roksan k3 power amp,Monitor Audio Monitor 50, Dali spektor 1, van damme interconnects and speaker cable, roskan k3 CD player

  4. #54
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    The fighting is not about the cables per se but due to the fact that whilst arguing on the internet about cables - or anything else - it is too easy to be disrespectful to people. You rarely see this happen when people talk face to face. Someone disrespects you, your first instinct is to knock them on their ass. That's perfectly normal.
    oh, Kelly's boy eh?
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
    FIIO K7 BT, M11 PLUS, BTR7, KA5 - OPPO BDP-103D - PANASONIC UB450 - PANASONIC 4K ULTRA HD TV - PIXEL 6 - AVANTREE LR BLUETOOTH - 2* X600 SOUNDCORE - HEADPHONES INCLUDE, FIIO, NURAPHONES', FOCAL, OPPO, BOSE, CAMBRIDGE, BOWER & WILKINS, DEVIALET, MARSHALL, SONY, MITCHELL & JOHNSTON - 2*ZBOOK'S- MERCURY BD ROM, ROON, QOBUZ, TIDAL, PLEX, CYBERLINK, JRIVER - MULTI HDD'S -

    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

    "You don't have free will. You have the appearance of free will.”

    “There's a war out there, old friend. A world war. And it's not about who's got the most bullets. It's about who controls the information. What we see and hear, how we work, what we think... it's all about the information!”


    ***SMILE, BE HAPPY***

  5. #55
    Join Date: Aug 2012

    Location: North East

    Posts: 3,670
    I'm Steve.

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    I wasn't going to contribute to this thread as most of the guys here seem to have things covered but here goes...

    Forums whether they are about hi-fi or other passions and/or pastimes are not unlike social media. When you write something on them it is out there in the public domain. People will interprate what they will in their own way much like reading a book or watching a movie. Frequenters of forums cover a wide cross section of the community all with their/our own views. They each have their individual personalities and sense of humour. The unfortunate thing is that some contributors are just down right nasty bastards and can't stop themselves from having a laugh at other peoples expense. You have quite obviously fallen victim to one or more of these unsavoury people who simply don't fully understand how they make people feel by their constant ridicule and idle threats. It is insane to think isn't it? that some of these people are highly intelligent sometimes professional people who get their kicks from it. Which only goes to show that you can't make a silk purse from a sows ear. When you are feeling depressed or are trying to deal with deaths in your family of loved ones it is made more difficult to tolerate such hideous mentality. It has been said here once already, these are only forums and not to be taken as real life. My experience of it crushed my faith in many aspects of Hi-Fi and prevents me from contributing as much as i did to forums or other projects like organising events. You are on the right forum here. Stay focused. stay here and don't look elsewhere as i sometimes feel compelled to do. I have made some great friends here both in the ether and in real life.
    Last edited by Floyddroid; 22-04-2017 at 17:08.

  6. #56
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Hi Simon,

    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamics View Post
    Hello Marco, it was a bit cathartic I suppose and as you said. I have tried to get help but largely it doesn't exist in the sphere of the NHS. I suppose I should have spent the money on private help rather than hi fi, but I don't know if private help could sort it too. My issues are more problematic than I'd care to say, but this is probably going off the point.
    Well I guess that every bit helps. Certainly talking to people with a sympathetic ear does, so if you consider that of benefit to you, then feel free to use this thread for that purpose.

    Maybe it's me and I have to look at how I can get annoyed sometimes but I don't feel it was very nice to spend ages helping people and then get rejected. Maybe forums are not for me, but I will play it very carefully and circumspectly from now on, as to debating with people for the sake of discussion (and being wrongly seen as being trying to enrage argument by some, which isn't the case)
    Yes, that happens all the time, because a lot of folk are simply very selfish and only out to get what they can for themselves (looking after No1) or to champion their 'world view'. I find that attitude is worse these days than ever. Generally you'll not get that here, as the members are always sharing information and helping each other out when they can, for mutual rather than individual gain.

    I was on avforums and the guy who runs it just seems to do it for the sake of his business but he has no interest in people helping people out for free.
    I think that's a big problem with the vast majority of forums, in that they are born for the wrong reasons, simply as vehicles to further the financial interests of their owners, and not to provide a useful service/information resource and *community* for their members. Plus, when profiting from the exercise is ultimately the primary focus, there will always exist an agenda, which ultimately acts as a disservice to the members, simply because protecting whatever generates income will always come first before anything else.

    AoS isn't like that, simply because it was never formed to facilitate my pension fund [nor do I need it to generate an income stream], or to pander to the needs of the hi-fi industry, although we do support some good dealers and manufacturers, but rather to give something back to genuine enthusiasts, where the focus is on showing them how to build genuinely musically satisfying systems, based on the 'SPPV principle' [sound-per-pound value], so that you get maximum 'bang for your buck'.

    And that will always be the focus here: what's best for the interests of punters, not what's best for lining my pockets.

    A lot of the people say things like decent hi fi is just as good as spending £20 on a hi fi dock, a slight exaggeration but I'm not far off! His name is Stuart Wright. Largely, not to blow my own trumpet, the kit I have and had before is a lot better than most on that forum so they maybe thought I was a hi fi snob. I was saying such things as cables make a difference, only for members to rubbish firms like chord and others and I told them to stop doing it as people's jobs could be affected by people who rubbish them but have never actually heard their products and if others believe what these people say. The owners did not do so and I found out on speaking to their editors (Phil Hinton) that he believes all cabling is 'snake oil', so they let these members carry on spouting rubbish. But it was more than rubbish, it was a concerted effort of inexperienced people to rubbish cable firms business, that exist because people must think they are good, as why are people buying their products. Then I was told by 10-20 people I must be wrong and hearing bias. I don't even work in the industry too!
    That's also the problem when the forum owner has 'signed away his soul to the devil', so he or she always has to be mindful of behaving in a way that best suits his or her commercial interests, and not to 'upset' someone who's paying you handsomely to advertise or whatever. Therefore, you can't really be yourself and say what you want to say, or more importantly, think *needs* saying.

    That's one of the main reasons why I haven't gone out of my way to monetise AoS, so that I don't feel 'tied' to protecting anyone's commercial interests (or indeed my own), thus I can relax, just be myself and contribute my views and relate my experiences solely as 'Marco the hi-fi enthusiast and music lover', and not "Marco the owner of AoS', who has to consider upsetting a dealer paying him £1k a year, to have a big multicoloured banner plastered all over the forum's homepage, if he thinks that something he sells is shit.

    That will *never* be what AoS is about, as profiting financially from the forum is not what drives me. Providing a relaxed and friendly environment, free from oneupmanship, for likeminded enthusiasts to share their respective 'audio journeys', showing them how to get the most from their systems, and when it all comes together and works (as it frequently does), *that* is what drives me

    That's why we're deliberately selective about ultimately who gets to stay here and who doesn't, by insisting on certain standards of behaviour. And those who show a blatant disregard for helping develop our community, eager to disrupt and divide, and who are, shall we say, fatally 'off-message', in terms of what we're building here, will be given very short shrift - and it's that type of control that ensures the existence of the friendly vibe people joining AoS for the first time quickly pick up on, and what separates us from most other forums.

    I've been on forums before and if ever you have a strong view, you get shot down.
    Oh trust me, I know ALL about that! Particularly if your strong (but perfectly politely expressed) view is contrary to those of the established clique, and/or is liable to adversely affect the owner's income or personal status in some way - then YOU will be given very short shrift indeed, and the 'powers that be' will try their best to 'engineer' your exit....

    Worse, is when you also have a reputation elsewhere for being outspoken (somewhat of an heretic) and holding strong views, which irk the rather belligerent and dogmatic 'scientifically-minded fraternity' [often suffering from 'measurement illness'], and who populate hi-fi forums in significant numbers, are friendly with the mods and admin, and as such are often responsible for 'driving the agenda', due to being afforded extra leeway to say pretty much what they like, and who attack and provoke any 'heretics' to such a degree, that they eventually just give up and leave.

    I suffered that form of what ultimately can only be described as bullying, and fate, only recently on a well-known UK forum, which I may name at some point later.

    On one forum called cyrusunofficial I had to leave as I had very bad trolls even calling me offensive names, and all such members are still there. It's like a clique of very few people who chat with each other and reject, as a collective, people who have a different opinion. I think when some people loose a debate they tend to go towards offence as the only way they can deal with it. But I won't be doing much debating on here to try and not attract these people to cause offence. These are the real trolls and people who hide behind keyboards and not me. If you debate, a person looses the argument or debate, and then they cause offence, these are the trolls for me. And these forum owners do nothing about it which is worrying to.
    Yes indeed, and that's essentially what's just happened to me on the forum I've referred to. Unfortunately, lots of forums are essentially run by the established clique, who actively promote an agenda, backed up by a weak owner with poor leadership skills, who's too afraid to do the right thing and rid the place of these parasites, which would actually benefit both him and the forum in the long run, but cops out of doing so for fear of 'upsetting' the interests of the clique, and so the clique always wins and controls the agenda.

    Thus creating a never-ending vicious circle, which simply alienates many good people who would otherwise join and contributes to discussions, adding more interest and diversity in the process, but instead are scared away from doing so because they've watched many others before them being dreadfully treated in that way, and don't wish to become the next victim.

    And the sad thing is that some of these weak forum owners don't even realise that's happening because they're too blinkered from keeping the clique happy or doing 'thousands of other things', which they consider as more important, than maintaining the harmony and ultimately well-being of their forum, by ensuring that the atmosphere there and the image projected to the outside world is conducive to its future growth and development.

    It often only hits home when all of a sudden they find that no-one outside of the clique is posting anymore, and their forum has effectively died behind their back....

    Anyway, I've said enough for now, but I've got plenty more to say on this subject, and indeed address some of the very valid comments made on this thread, so more on that later!

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

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  7. #57
    Join Date: Mar 2017

    Location: Seaford UK

    Posts: 1,861
    I'm Dennis.

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    "Just heard this on radio4 and thought it apt for this thread " no one can make you feel inferior without your consent""

    I would agree, but my experience is that some really intimidate and disallow personal autonomy in so doing.

    I am not being indulgent, seeking sympathy, or pitying myself here, but;

    My Father used to hit me every other day and call me a "Dirty ugly stupid little bastard", and this when I came top of the class in four successive reports (in my primary years), and I was constantly derided, humiliated, ridiculed, and disparaged all of my childhood to the age of 11 by him.

    How could I under these conditions have an autonomous choice to agree with what was being said to me?

    I think it important to separate our lovely interest, which is innocuous and enjoyable, from people's needs to 'have a go' at others. These needs are largely to do with personality problems, and are from those with inadequate personalities,

    This is a universal phenomenon, and it is superimposed everywhere in all scenarios and arenas, people using the arena to sublimate and vent venomous persecution, actually coming from unresolved issues of their own.

  8. #58
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

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    Sometimes wonder if poor rearing causes much of what you see now. I guess it probably does. I was lucky to have a good, caring family and in turn gave one. We all treat each other with respect care and love and always have. My kids were brought up that way, and my daughter brings her kids up the same. any of us behaved that way, someone would bring the culprit to heel pdq.
    Its great though that folk have been strong enough not to follow the poor message their parents may have given them and went and found their own one.
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
    FIIO K7 BT, M11 PLUS, BTR7, KA5 - OPPO BDP-103D - PANASONIC UB450 - PANASONIC 4K ULTRA HD TV - PIXEL 6 - AVANTREE LR BLUETOOTH - 2* X600 SOUNDCORE - HEADPHONES INCLUDE, FIIO, NURAPHONES', FOCAL, OPPO, BOSE, CAMBRIDGE, BOWER & WILKINS, DEVIALET, MARSHALL, SONY, MITCHELL & JOHNSTON - 2*ZBOOK'S- MERCURY BD ROM, ROON, QOBUZ, TIDAL, PLEX, CYBERLINK, JRIVER - MULTI HDD'S -

    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

    "You don't have free will. You have the appearance of free will.”

    “There's a war out there, old friend. A world war. And it's not about who's got the most bullets. It's about who controls the information. What we see and hear, how we work, what we think... it's all about the information!”


    ***SMILE, BE HAPPY***

  9. #59
    Join Date: Oct 2012

    Location: The Black Country

    Posts: 6,089
    I'm Alan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pharos View Post
    My Father used to hit me every other day and call me a "Dirty ugly stupid little bastard"
    That in my book is inexcusable Dennis.

    I am very glad to say that from my own point of view you come across as an intelligent and sensible poster on here, and I always enjoy reading your posts.

    Keep on keeping on, as they say

  10. #60
    Join Date: May 2009

    Location: gone away

    Posts: 4,870
    I'm joe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    The fighting is not about the cables per se but due to the fact that whilst arguing on the internet about cables - or anything else - it is too easy to be disrespectful to people. You rarely see this happen when people talk face to face. Someone disrespects you, your first instinct is to knock them on their ass. That's perfectly normal.
    Having been on the internet for 20-odd years, I started off posting in unmoderated forums, which was kind of a baptism of fire. I couldn't give a toss if someone 'disrespects' me online, because it just reveals them as idiots.

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