Wasn't gonna post this...

[Gazjam]

I'll see your Sagan quote and raise it with another!

“People are not stupid. They believe things for reasons. The last way for skeptics to get the attention of bright, curious, intelligent people is to belittle or condescend or to show arrogance toward their beliefs"

[Gazjam]

All good mate, its ok to agree to disagree as Andrew said.
Leave me to my fairys (hang on, that didnt come out right....)

And about the Wam, you may say that I couldnt possibly comment

Big one for mains safety here Jez, all good.

What name calling? Just in case "audiophool" is considered more than banter I've changed it for ya

My take on subjectivism V measurement is that they are both important but I only "allow" myself a subjective opinion on those matters which are known to, likely to or may cause a difference... IE if something goes against the laws of physics, common sense and all known scientific knowledge I will not even bother considering it... and, yes, nor will I believe it, take it seriously or give it any credence if coming from someone else...

If someone tells me they've found a new species of worm at the bottom of their garden then, whilst I would consider it very unlikely, I would have to concede that it is a possibility and would be willing to go check it out with them. If on the other hand they tell me there are fairies at the bottom of their garden...... or that the world is flat, or the sun revolves around the earth....

I could describe the full path of the mains from switchboard to becoming DC in the amplifier/DAC/whatever, all the crimped connections, the riveted connections between different type of metal, the other fuses in the path, the screw connections, the soldered joints etc etc and then ask "and you really think that 1CM or so of wire in one particular fuse can make a difference?"... but you "believe" and have "faith" that it does so nothing I say will make any difference....

You could try Andrews idea of temporarily soldering a thick piece of wire across the fuse-holder to remove the fuse from the question of course

Would your measurist mate from the wam be Serge by any chance?

And I'm really outta here now before the discussion becomes even more polo shaped

Edit: Several posts since I left mine half completed until I came back for a fag... It may have been Alan's suggestion and not Andrews to rule out the fuse by soldering a wire across it... and as Anthony says (and Happy Birthday mate! ) be very careful when fecking with the mains

[struth]

I guess its going to be expensive to find out if it would blow either way. And thats possibly one of my probs with these. ....but on other hand, how can anyone say if any individual fuse is ok to use until it aint
Good luck with it Gaz, and if you hear a difference then why not.

[Macca]

I'll see your Sagan quote and raise it with another!

“People are not stupid. They believe things for reasons. The last way for skeptics to get the attention of bright, curious, intelligent people is to belittle or condescend or to show arrogance toward their beliefs"

I'm sure we all recall the thing with the stomach ulcers being caused by bacteria. The blokes who proposed that were laughed out of the room by the medical profession, but they turned out to be right. Fact is we don't know everything about how electricity actually works and even less about the point were it intersects with our appreciation of recorded music. To be sceptical is healthy, to be an absolutist is not. Especially if you have stomach ulcers caused by bacteria.

[wee tee cee]

Interesting Gary.

If you fancy a try of my Phonosophie fuses in your set up let me know. Ive had them a few years now and regard them as a solid infrastructure upgrade.

Bought them when I had my Naim kit-sat my wife and son down and just changed the fuse....they both heard a change in the sound( loud and clear in Glasgow let me try it with no obligation to buy)

Well worth experimentation IMHO if you trust your ears.

[Macca]

Yup,
Always this 63 page Thread too, folk like 'em.
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussio...istic-red-fuse

Post 4 and already burn in time is mentioned. My credulousness may be elastic but it only stretches so far; nevertheless I will read on. I might just try one in the CD player since it is small and not a big deal to post back if I hear no change. Preamp has no fuse as it's passive and the power amp has to be used with its supplied cable.

[Gazjam]

Post 4 and already burn in time is mentioned. My credulousness may be elastic but it only stretches so far; nevertheless I will read on. I might just try one in the CD player since it is small and not a big deal to post back if I hear no change. Preamp has no fuse as it's passive and the power amp has to be used with its supplied cable.

I was the same Martin, not readimg too much into anyones enthusiasm about something they just spent their hard earned on...but there was a overall pattern forming, enough to make me curious.
as I said too, couple of voices and pairs of ears on there I'd trust not to be making it up.

Id say to anyone its really worth trying.
Multi £££ bits of kit, £90 is bonkers for 'just a fuse' but small potatoes for the sound for pound improvement you get...especially in e context of expensive equipment with a 4p fuse fitted.

Built to a price of course.

[Marco]

Hi Anthony,

Could you expand on this:

My own personal findings with these fuses; to have any affect, is; that they cannot be the same rating as a standard like for like fuse, and therefore have lower resistance

In terms of the bit in bold, why not?

Basically, I don't understand why, say, a 5A 'audiophile fuse' can't be the same rating as a 5A standard fuse? Is it to do with their respective internal constructions or what?

In terms of Gaz's revelations, I can completely relate to what he's experienced, as out with of my Copper amp, all my gear is fitted with 'audiophile fuses', from Hi-Fi Tuning, simply because I heard the same [genuine] sonic improvements he did with the SR Blacks, albeit at less cost.

Whilst engineers like Jez are perfectly entitled to question and/or disagree with the views expressed on threads like this, I think it's very important that it's done in such a way so as not to stifle the desire of people to relate their valid audio experiences to fellow enthusiasts, in the hope that whatever it is they're recommending may be of use to others, as that's fundamentally what hi-fi forums, especially this one, are about: the sharing of experiences.

Therefore, sceptics should always play the ball, not the man, or in other words criticise/attack the opinion expressed, not the person behind it.

Now whether those experiences/opinions being shared align with our own or not, or whether or not they fit with our 'world view' or scientific sensibilities, is moot, as is the requirement of those relating them to 'prove' anything other than, to their ears, differences/sonic gains were heard. No-one here, after all, is submitting a scientific thesis for formal appraisal!

It's simply about telling others in an informal way how you improved the sound of your stereo, and therefore afterwards up to others to decide for themselves whether they consider there's some mileage in what's being recommended or not.

One thing I'll *never* allow here is people being scared to share those experiences for fear of being ridiculed by some blinkered dogmatist, scientific or otherwise, convinced that he or she knows it all and is always right, no matter if the laws of physics appear to be on their side.

Long live the free-thinkers on this earth, with genuinely open and inquisitive minds. *That* will always be the AoS way!

Marco.

[TheMooN]

I would highly recommend moving from the HiFi tuning fuses to SR Black's, if anywhere on source, pre and mains master 13 amp .

[Gazjam]

The SR Blacks are supposed o be a big step up Marco, worth a punt mate.