Wasn't gonna post this...

[Marco]

Not sure how an existing fuse can 'deteriorate' though. I mean it is just a piece of wire and it isn't exposed to the elements?

Well, every time you switch your equipment on and off, it stresses the filament inside the fuse, eventually causing it to sag, and to my ears, the effect of that physical deterioration is audible. This (the sagging) is clearly evident with case fuses constructed from clear glass.

If you're got some, and compare the old ones in your equipment with new fuses, you should clearly see the difference in the condition of the respective filaments

Marco.

[Spectral Morn]

Brian, Neil,

thanks, trying to look forward.

OK to look back but not good to stay there!

It will get a bit less sharp in time, the type of grief changes. It softens.

[Marco]

Normally the idiocy from 'over the road' [those in the know will be familiar with what I'm referring to] is ignored here, as the sheer level of nonsense spewed by the resident inmates is such that it doesn't warrant a response. However, the following comments from Mr Qwim are so farcically hypocritical that a response could only be considered as mandatory:

It is telling that none of the major members of AOS are able to sustain a membership at other less gullible forums, this is because AOS is the natural home of uncritical thinking and stupidity .

After a while , you can pick up points for style and along come flatppoopy with what he thinks is a clever comment. Alas , it is not unusual for flatpoopy to think his comments are clever when they are inane .

As I have said many times , I care not one jot for who you are I comment only on what you write with the pompous aim of trying to tease out the truth in a world full of bullshit and bollocks . And I said gazgam had lost all credibility upon the basis of what he had written .

Here we are again, another unqualified, arrogant, self-appointed judge of 'all that's wrong in hi-fi'. Just who do you think *you* are to feel justified in appointing yourself as the definitive arbiter of "bullshit and bollocks'?

You're a solicitor, FFS, and clearly an illiterate one at that, not a scientist or electronics engineer, so the reality is you're in no position whatsoever to judge anyone on the 'bullshit level' of their forum postings, on the subject of hi-fi, especially when your own output in that area is so frequently full of excrement, and shows scant evidence of acknowledging the hypocrisy of what leaves your keyboard and poses as an intelligent response.

Hang on, scratch that, you're an expert on changing nappies, so I guess you encounter lots of SHIT on a daily basis! Sorry, I couldn't resist, and after all, it's all that you're really good for...

In terms of credibility, when it comes to hi-fi, you have NONE, zero, hee-haw.. The King of No Credibility has more credibility than you.

All you do is copy what your master from NVA tells you to do, much like Jamrag and the rest of the painfully obsequious Disciples of Dunce, resident on HFS, who possess little ability to think for themselves, and need taken by the hand on every stage of their audio journey [excluding the likes of Slinger and Lindsayt, who appear to have resisted the brainwash and possess the ability to think freely as individuals].

Therefore, criticise Gazjam all you want [I know it will not phase him one iota], but at least he has the confidence and ability to trust his ears, think for himself and build a system based on his own judgement criteria, unlike you. All you can do is copy and follow your 'leader', like a sheep!

As for Andrew (flatpopely's) highly astute, far from inane, observation below:

Just wonder how the coments against the fuse square with this?

Welcome to Hi-Fi Subjectivist - a hifi discussion group
The world of Hi-Fi is plagued by people trying to stop you commenting on what you hear and making decisions from it. This forum is different - here we do not allow people to challenge what people hear, and we can discuss the musical ability of our systems

...and your master's ridiculous response, clearly outraged at how Andrew had exposed the sheer hypocrisy of the 'HFS mission statement', where despite claiming you don't challenge what people hear, there you were openly ridiculing Gazjam for that *very thing*, simply because what he's heard (and reported) on AoS trips your blinkered bullshit filter.

So what does your master do in order to prevent Andrew from further exposing the hypocrisy of the 'HFS mission statement'? He gags him, of course, by banning him, under the guise of making "daft comments" - and this from somewhere that claims to be free from censorship?? Honestly, you couldn't make it up!!

So, Lindsay, you won't get an answer to the questions you've asked Andrew because your 'boss', in his infinite wisdom, to prevent him being made to look like a tit, has banned him!

However, it's too late, as Dicky's farcical behaviour has already been 'caught on camera' for all to see and laugh at how, on one hand, others and him refer to AoS as "censorship central", and on the other he's gagging and banning folk for simply telling it as it is!! Free speech on HFS, eh?

Anyway, Qwim, my thanks to your master and you for providing some hilarity on an otherwise dull day. For the very definition of inane and that which totally lacks any credibility, sweetheart, look in the mirror.

Oh and FYI, as a statement of fact, a sizeable number of AoS members are also regular contributors on pfm and Wigwam, and they manage to exist there quite happily, unlike your 'leader' who's unwelcome anywhere else other than where he can censor and exercise his control.

Over and out!

Marco.

[RothwellAudio]

My point is that (and pardon the phrase, blame Mr Sircom...) Measurebators imo operate under the scope of the limits of a set framework (and no, I'm not talking about the laws of physics, no-one can lay claim to know them cos they havent all been discovered yet!)....its that scientific curiosity vs established thought thing thats the dragging point.

I think this is interesting and worth a comment. How does it become a "fact" that certain things are inaudible? As far as I know the researchers who established the "facts" asked subjects for their subjective observations. For example, a subject may be asked which is the louder of two test tones at the same frequency but different amplitudes. The subject answers based on their subjective appraisal of the two tones. After testing many subjects the minimum audible change in amplitude is established. Then it becomes a "scientific fact". I would love to know a lot more about the methods used to establish the "facts" about what the human hearing/perception system is capable of, but I've been unsuccessful so far in finding much detail online.
I remain open minded about what anyone "cannot possibly hear".

Anyhow, at the end of the day it's just a stereo and not worth any falling out or bad blood over it...

Absolutely. It's only a device for listening to a bit of music after all.

For me, it's simply about whether I want to 'go there' or not, as that's not where my head is at these days. I've pretty much done all the experimenting/tweaking I want to do in my system, so for me now it's all about the music: it's a contented mindset that takes a while to achieve

Yes, at some point enough is enough. For many people a cheap piece of crap is good enough and they're happy. I sometimes wonder if they're the ignorant fools or the enlightened ones.

Oh, and just to get a little bit more 'mentalist', the fuses are directional

Eh? A fuse passing DC, maybe. What about a fuse passing AC?

[Arkless Electronics]

Cool. No need to bow out, but rather simply accept that not everyone on this earth will think the same as you do, no matter how much supposed 'evidence' you throw at them to show that they're wrong. The human mind doesn't work in such a 'black or white' way, like a computer

Marco.

Well that's a great pity because everyone is indeed wrong on these and all other matters about fuses, which of course never effect sound under any circumstances.
To me this is a matter of deep concern as yet again we see people running round like headless chickens in pursuit of a wholly mythical "potential upgrade".
There is as much chance of these having an effect as there is of there being an actual pot of gold at the end of a rainbow.... the sad thing is one doesn't usually find oneself having to explain to adults that there isn't really a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

There are clever marketing people out there who exploit the fact that to the non technical electricity is "magic" and many people seem to want to believe in these things... so long as it is a simple unplug one thing and plug in another. This is something I keep going on about as I think it says it all: Take the lid off your pre amp DAC whatever and look how many parts there are. Now, why should it be the only part which you can simply unplug and then plug a new one in, without soldering, which should be so important to the sound? You've been had!

10+ pages now of chasing rainbows.... and if I started a thread, again concerning the quality of the power, but this time pertaining to areas that actually matter and are important, lets say the output impedance versus frequency of the voltage regulation, it would be lucky to get a page of comments because people find it too technical and so don't want to know!

I've used this analogy before but it's worth repeating. This is like watching a group of enthusiastic but non technical petrol heads discussing whether go faster stripes really make the car faster... and seeing many of them agreeing that they do (), and then when a real automotive engineer turns up and explains that go faster stripes cannot possibly actually make it faster, and to do that you need to re-map the fuel injection and fit higher lift camshafts, they all stick their fingers in their ears and go "la la la la la we don't want to know, too technical and we're not going to listen to you so go away"

Have fun gluing them stripes on folks, I'll be expecting 0 - 60 times next week...

[Beobloke]

Well that's a great pity because everyone is indeed wrong on these and all other matters about fuses, which of course never effect sound under any circumstances.

Ah, the reassuring sound of a firm nail/head interface, although I would caveat this with "mains fuses". I remember an old pair of speakers with a seriously corroded inline tweeter fuse that removed a fair chunk of treble!

Normally the idiocy from 'over the road' etc. etc. etc.

Forgive me, Marco, but haven't you just broken your own forum's rules? Will you be banning yourself for a week?!

[Marco]

I thought you were bowing out of this discussion, Jez, for reasons you seemed to accept last night?

You always say that, but never keep your promise, so kindly give it a rest before you and I fall out again over insisting on telling people they are "wrong" and preaching on how 'deluded' they are if they refuse to conform to the tenets of your scientific belief system.

If you've got nothing to offer other than ridicule, thinly-disguised as 'expert input', then say nothing - and I *mean* that. This is your very LAST warning!

Marco.

[Marco]

Forgive me, Marco, but haven't you just broken your own forum's rules? Will you be banning yourself for a week?!

There's a clause I occasionally invoke, which entitles me to respond to the most ludicrous of the hilariously hypocritical bullshite spewed over there!

Marco.

[Marco]

Hi Andrew,

I think this is interesting and worth a comment. How does it become a "fact" that certain things are inaudible? As far as I know the researchers who established the "facts" asked subjects for their subjective observations. For example, a subject may be asked which is the louder of two test tones at the same frequency but different amplitudes. The subject answers based on their subjective appraisal of the two tones. After testing many subjects the minimum audible change in amplitude is established. Then it becomes a "scientific fact". I would love to know a lot more about the methods used to establish the "facts" about what the human hearing/perception system is capable of, but I've been unsuccessful so far in finding much detail online.
I remain open minded about what anyone "cannot possibly hear".

Exactly!! That's the REAL scientific process outlined in a nutshell.

The problem is, you're dealing in some cases with years of ingrained dogma and extremely closed minds, and folk (often reductionists) who would no sooner entertain the notion that their deeply-ingrained and absolutist scientific belief system is flawed, than join a society of creationists!

Yes, at some point enough is enough. For many people a cheap piece of crap is good enough and they're happy. I sometimes wonder if they're the ignorant fools or the enlightened ones.

Indeed!!

Eh? A fuse passing DC, maybe. What about a fuse passing AC?

Dunno, mate. I just listen and observe, as a free-thinker and music lover with an open mind, blissfully unburdened by what is considered as 'correct' or not by established scientific wisdom. It's rather liberating having such an uncomplicated approach to music appreciation and hi-fi!

Marco.

[Arkless Electronics]

Ah, the reassuring sound of a firm nail/head interface, although I would caveat this with "mains fuses". I remember an old pair of speakers with a seriously corroded inline tweeter fuse that removed a fair chunk of treble!



Forgive me, Marco, but haven't you just broken your own forum's rules? Will you be banning yourself for a week?!

I did say in an earlier post "apart from speaker fuses"