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Thread: A new tweak.

  1. #1
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Birmingham

    Posts: 2,420
    I'm James.

    Default A new tweak.

    I have not really done much with my system this year other than play with alternative cartridges but last night I did a small tweak to my system which was as a result of having to raise my speakers slightly.

    I have just had a new sofa which in itself changed the acoustic characteristics of my room slightly but the biggest effect was to raise my lug holes slightly higher than they were before and thus the ideal listening level with the tweeters in my speakers was compromised. I did not realise how key this aspect was to perceiving a number of elements my speakers did including detail, soundstage and positioning of instruments and vocals.

    In order to bring my speakers tweeters up to a level with my ears I decided therefore to use some special laminate material which I use under my turntable. This stuff is very dense and heavy, a bit like granite in weight but in actual fact it is made by laminating a number of materials together to form a very hard substance which is used throughout the construction industry for partitioning. It works fabulously under my turntable but I had never tried it under speakers. I had two ideal pieces which were pre cut to size that would do the job so I put the speaker plus stands which are spiked normally through my carpet into concrete onto them.

    This immediately and noticeably not only bought the tweeters up to perfect listening position but also tightened up the whole imaging of the speakers. Quite amazing really as I had not expected this aspect, I just though I would get the same sound as I had before but this material worked much better than spiking the stands into concrete. Definition and precision of instruments and vocals in particular were improved to a point where some lyrics I had not been aware of came out of the mix with much greater coherence.

    Need to do some more listening but I feel it is definitely worth experimenting with not only with different speaker stands but the actually substrate they are standing on as it can have quite a marked influence how speakers perform. I know there is an obvious difference between wood suspended floors and concrete but I can now see that there is also quite a difference between lots of other materials on which speakers stand.

    Definitely worth more investigation?
    VPI Scout 1.1 / JMW 9T Tonearm / 2M Black / DECCA Blue /Croft 25R+ / Croft 7 / Spendor SP2

  2. #2
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Alicante. Spain.

    Posts: 306
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    Spiked into concrete has never worked for me, unless the spikes are glued into pre drilled locators the speakers will move during excursion, thus smearing things. How are the new platforms 'grounded'? Spikes?

    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk

  3. #3
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Birmingham

    Posts: 2,420
    I'm James.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by farflungstar View Post
    Spiked into concrete has never worked for me, unless the spikes are glued into pre drilled locators the speakers will move during excursion, thus smearing things. How are the new platforms 'grounded'? Spikes?

    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk
    The new platforms are not spiked, just sitting on carpet.
    VPI Scout 1.1 / JMW 9T Tonearm / 2M Black / DECCA Blue /Croft 25R+ / Croft 7 / Spendor SP2

  4. #4
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Alicante. Spain.

    Posts: 306
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    If it was me I'd drill the concrete and screw the platform's into place. I'd then either spike the speakers into the platform's or use 3 dollops of blu- tac.

    All good fun.
    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk

  5. #5
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: vancouver

    Posts: 515
    I'm danilo.

    Default

    A few years back it was a fairly common Bodge to mass weight the bottoms of one's Speaker boxes.
    Usually floor standers, pouring in a couple of inches of:
    Lead shot ( if Flush ),
    Aquarium glass sand/gravel or even River Rock gravel if not.
    Dunno if any still do this, but it was claimed as genuinely useful.
    My audio bits: Thorens / diy phono, CD/dvd player(s), diy pre, F6, Tannoy Golds in my boxes / my xovers, and of course all strung together with basic diy Wires
    Lots of Cd's, yet more audio files, a couple of hundred semi worn Lps.

  6. #6
    Join Date: Dec 2015

    Location: Alicante. Spain.

    Posts: 306
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    The problem with filling the bottom of an enclosure is you lose litres and hence change the low end response - this may partially account for the 'tighter' bass after filling. Unless the enclosures are very very heavy cone excursion will create a force on the enclosure and it will move, even subtle shifts can smear sound stage and blur bass. An enclosure must be rigid and unable to move if the driver is going to do its job well. IMO

    Adey

    Sent from my Aquaris E4.5 using Tapatalk

  7. #7
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Birmingham

    Posts: 2,420
    I'm James.

    Default

    Stands used are heavy Steel filled half way with sand. I could drill and install spikes into the laminate material and then spike this into the concrete,however I feel the gains I have made already just standing the speakers on these blocks is good enough. They are very inert and have the same weight as slabs of slate or granite.

    I believe this laminate material is the key as it somehow absorbs vibration and stops the speaker bouncing it back up through the spikes. The material I use is made into roller shelves and which are used to sound isolate equipment.
    VPI Scout 1.1 / JMW 9T Tonearm / 2M Black / DECCA Blue /Croft 25R+ / Croft 7 / Spendor SP2

  8. #8
    Join Date: May 2011

    Location: Glasgow

    Posts: 5,460
    I'm Brian.

    Default

    Excellent James . I would leave well alone until upgraditis strikes again

    Got a link to this stuff at all ?
    Regards
    Brian


    Korus Computer Audio music server .
    Rega DAC .
    Amplifier : Rega Brio R
    Speakers : Tannoy 637
    Interconnects : MS Audio / Klotz MC5000 .
    Speaker cables : Van Damme hi-fi series 6mm .

  9. #9
    Join Date: May 2011

    Location: Glasgow

    Posts: 5,460
    I'm Brian.

    Default

    [QUOTE=brian2957;816416]Excellent James . I would leave well alone until upgraditis strikes again


    Got a link to this stuff at all ?
    Regards
    Brian


    Korus Computer Audio music server .
    Rega DAC .
    Amplifier : Rega Brio R
    Speakers : Tannoy 637
    Interconnects : MS Audio / Klotz MC5000 .
    Speaker cables : Van Damme hi-fi series 6mm .

  10. #10
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Birmingham

    Posts: 2,420
    I'm James.

    Default

    Further experimentation with speaker isolation and vibration control resulted in the laminate material now sandwiched between stand and base of speaker.
    [IMG][/IMG]

    This works much more effectively than standing the stand and speaker on the laminate. I have used a tiny bit of blu tack between laminate and stand but not between speaker and laminate.

    [IMG]
    [/IMG]

    Stands are half filled with sand and spiked through to concrete floor with 6mm spikes.

    Immediately there was a large improvement in definition and stability to the sound. It was almost as if the speaker cabinets previously vibrated in an uncontrolled manner and blurred the image of the music as it were. Now I am getting more focus on vocals and instruments. Spacial definition especially deep into the mix is improved and extends further. It is as if the whole sonic picture has been stabilised and cleaned up. Very impressed and will be keeping this tweek in situ permanently as it has had quite a profound effect.

    Now here is the interesting bit. Over Christmas I was looking at one of my favourite sites Analogue Planet and Michael Fremer did a post on Wilson Audio speakers. He posted up a video tour of the Wilson factory including a chat with one of the Wilson techies and remarkably during the interview he had a piece of laminate material not too dissimilar to what I have used, slightly different construction but the same idea. They are looking and may well be using it in their speaker construction!?
    VPI Scout 1.1 / JMW 9T Tonearm / 2M Black / DECCA Blue /Croft 25R+ / Croft 7 / Spendor SP2

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