Denon 103, 103R, 301 &c

[rdpx]

Hi -

I'm wondering if anyone has much opinion on the difference between the 103 and 301.

I think the 301 is going to be an easier fit for my arm (Thorens TP13A) but am also pretty sure I can fettle it to work with the much lower compliance 103.

My plan was to get a 103 and in time do the wood body then the retip upgrades, but looking at the compliance has made me think I might be better off with the 301. Anyone know if you can do a wood body upgrade on the 301?

I'm fully aware of all the SUT shenanigins, but at this stage I just want to have some help making the decision on the cart as I am experiencing choice paralysis.


[Looking around the web it seems there are a few people who have had success with a 103 on this old arm/deck. There is also no solid info about the mass of the TP13A anywhere online. Best guesses seem to put this as a medium mass arm, possibly in the 11-14g range.]


Robert

[hifi_dave]

Not sure the arm is up to the job.

[rdpx]

Not sure the arm is up to the job.

Up to the job of being an arm at all, or specifically for the carts I have mentioned?

[walpurgis]

I've owned each cartridge. I'd sooner have the 301 than the 103, but would have the 103R over either of those. I agree with Dave, the arm is doubtful. It may just about be OK with the 301, which is a bit less arm fussy than the 103's.

[Marco]

Hi -

I'm wondering if anyone has much opinion on the difference between the 103 and 301.

I think the 301 is going to be an easier fit for my arm (Thorens TP13A) but am also pretty sure I can fettle it to work with the much lower compliance 103.

My plan was to get a 103 and in time do the wood body then the retip upgrades, but looking at the compliance has made me think I might be better off with the 301. Anyone know if you can do a wood body upgrade on the 301?

I'm fully aware of all the SUT shenanigins, but at this stage I just want to have some help making the decision on the cart as I am experiencing choice paralysis.


[Looking around the web it seems there are a few people who have had success with a 103 on this old arm/deck. There is also no solid info about the mass of the TP13A anywhere online. Best guesses seem to put this as a medium mass arm, possibly in the 11-14g range.]

Hi Robert,

The DL-103 is somewhat my specialist subject - I know these babies inside out!

I'm pretty unfamiliar with your arm, so can't really comment on its efficacy with the cartridges you mention, although what I will say, in terms of the 'vanilla 103', is if you can successfully add the right amount of mass to the headshell, the otherwise 'lossy' construction of the arm's design should suit it well, providing you can get the cartridge to physically fit into the headshell, as it's quite big.

Sonically, in comparison with the 103R, to my ears, the latter sounds cooler, tonally, and somewhat more 'hi-fi'. It majors on producing a bright and punchy sound, full of vim and vigour, but it can, in some systems, become a little overbearing in its 'eagerness' to major on clarity. The 'vanilla 103' possesses similar traits, in terms of it being a 'fun listen', but is a subtly smoother performer, with an overall more 'organic', less 'showy' sound, with superb bass and midrange alacrity.

For me, if your system doesn't need the added 'treble sparkle' and energetically projected midrange of the 103R, the standard 103 is a more musical listen, especially over long periods of time and with recordings that are less than perfect.

The 301 is a totally different beast. It's a superb all-rounder, and whilst doesn't have the low-end 'slam' or expansiveness of either version of 103, although it is no slouch in this area, it trumps them in terms of overall resolution and detail retrieval, but still packs plenty of punch and possesses a lovely lucid and communicative midrange. It's a little more Audio-Technica like in its sonic and musical presentation than the average Denon, so you might prefer that.

As ever, much will depend on the type of sound you're looking for and how well the cartridge marries, not only with your arm, but also your phono stage. The 301, being slightly higher output than either of the 103s, will be easier to accommodate in that respect, and also won't need 'nannying', in terms of mass, like the 103s.

Hope that helps!

Marco.

[Jimbo]

I have had just the same considerations regarding these cartridges as yourself but after consulting with Marco I chose to go down the 301 route as it was a much easier match compliance wise with my tonearm and probably the easier cartridge to get the best out of without too much faff.

I bought the Denon 301 Mk2 which is widely available for around £200 and it has been a joy to use. Set up was a doddle and it was a easy cartridge to find a suitable SUT or head amp to match. It tracks like a limpet and is very forgiving of poorer condition records. It has a full rich and very smooth sound with a sophisticated top end, not bright or etched but detailed.

[CornishPasty]

I've had a few 103s and a 301 which I liked a lot but I found the 110 hard to beat. Comes with a decent stylus and no step up required. I've just bought another as a stop gap until I can afford to get my Benz Ace retipped and I'm not disappointed. I would think that given its beefy cantilever and its price point Denon didn't envisage it being used on esoteric tonearms so I see no reason why it wouldn't work in that Thorens tonearm.

[Johnnie7]

out the 2 carts the 301 may be better suited

but ideally get a better arm to get most from cartridge

[Marco]

Yo Johnnie,

Howz it going, dude? Good to see you checking in again! Hope you're well and kept busy

Marco.

[rdpx]

Hey thanks to everyone who has responded to this, I've not been ungrateful I've just been on planes the past 24hrs or so!

I'll respond properly soon! Leaning towards the 301 though...



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