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Thread: Centre speaker - or lack of!!

  1. #11
    Join Date: Jul 2014

    Location: Shropshire

    Posts: 2,420
    I'm Anto.

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    Cheeky !!!!
    I only ride 'em, I don't know what makes 'em work

  2. #12
    Join Date: Jan 2014

    Location: County Durham, England

    Posts: 555
    I'm Malcolm.

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    Interesting thread...

    I'm a big believer in centre speakers - mostly for when you want to sit at one end of the sofa and not the 'sweet spot'. A good one will add focus and solidity to the soundstage. I'm also a believer in setting the centre as 'small' even if it's quite capable in the bass department. The centre channel is the busiest channel in your average movie soundtrack. Hiving the bass off to the mains and/or sub leaves the centre (even a big one) and its power amp with more 'headroom' for want of a better term to handle the complexity of the signal.

    My two cents anyway. I think the only exception is if you're running something really epic as your main stereo pair (801, DSP8000, other behemoths) where a centre may just sully the system and sound weedy by comparison.

    Technics SL1210 MkII / SME 309 / Timestep PSU / Achromat / Denon DL-304
    Phono stage PS Audio NuWave Phono Converter
    Lossless / MP3 / Tidal > Roon > Bryston BDP-1USB > Marantz NA-11S1
    Marantz UD7007 SACD/Blu-ray/DVD-V/DVD-A
    Toshiba BDX1200 Blu-ray player (Zone A & Region 1)
    Audiolab 8200AP pre-amp/processor
    Power amp: Arcam P7
    B&W 804S stereo (bi-amped), HTM4S centre, CDMSNT surrounds (5.0)
    Sennheiser HD 700 headphones
    Panasonic PT-AT6000 projector

  3. #13
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Coventry

    Posts: 3,039
    I'm Will.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    You can program the receiver to send the centre output to the front left and right. Just de-select the centre speaker in the menu and it will happen automatically.

    That's what I do and I prefer it to having a centre speaker.
    I've gone one further and removed the sub, so 4.0 really...

    My main speakers (IPL S5TLs) go down to 23Hz, so I don't need any additional out of phase boom!

    Removing the AV powered center, and pushing all 3 main channels through my stereo rig is a massive improvement, particularly with music videos...

    All my AV processor does is drive my rear L & R rear surrounds, a set of old '91 Bose (OK I've admitted it ) AM5s, which are actually excellent for the rear surround job...honest!
    Cheers, Will

  4. #14
    Join Date: Jul 2014

    Location: Shropshire

    Posts: 2,420
    I'm Anto.

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    My sub sits next to the hi fi ,and the TV and AV receiver ,on the other side .
    I simply unplug the phono leads from one to the other ,depending on which I am using ,but its like spaghetti junction behind there !!
    4 sets of speakers and a sub
    I am sure if it was the living room ,I would have been evicted by now!!!
    Also ,my sons room is above , so I have to exercise caution apparently
    Fortunately the room is 20 x 40 ft , but seems to be filling up with hi fi boxes and second rate equipment
    I only ride 'em, I don't know what makes 'em work

  5. #15
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,774
    I'm Martin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oddball View Post
    Fortunately the room is 20 x 40 ft , but seems to be filling up with hi fi boxes and second rate equipment
    20 x 40! You need some monster JBLs in your life. Sell the cows, man!
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  6. #16
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WAD62 View Post
    My main speakers (IPL S5TLs) go down to 23Hz, so I don't need any additional out of phase boom!
    Lol... Not so, if you get it right!

    'Taint no boom here... The little Yamaha sub seems to work seamlessly with the 15XRs, their ABRs combining superbly well with it and creating very impressive 'slam' with movie explosions and gunshots!

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  7. #17
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Coventry

    Posts: 3,039
    I'm Will.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Lol... Not so, if you get it right!

    'Taint no boom here... The little Yamaha sub seems to work seamlessly with the 15XRs, their ABRs combining superbly well with it and creating very impressive 'slam' with movie explosions and gunshots!

    Marco.
    I get plenty enough slam from the IPL's mate!

    And the rears have their own sub too (2.1), under the couch, so more than enough bass all round, as full frequency range is sent to all 4 speakers

    Before the IPLs I used an old Yamaha sub in conjunction with my Mission 753s, they needed it...however with the IPLs in place the sub is rendered pointless IMHO
    Cheers, Will

  8. #18
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Absolutely, and that's cool. I was just saying that the addition of a sub doesn't have to result in "out of phase boom"

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


  9. #19
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

    Posts: 51,624
    I'm Geoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Absolutely, and that's cool. I was just saying that the addition of a sub doesn't have to result in "out of phase boom"

    Marco.
    Certainly not.

    As long as the sub is connected 'in phase' with the main speakers, the phase should be perfect. Also, the wavelength of low frequencies is so large that having the sub some distance away from the main speakers makes little difference.

    That said. I've tried subs on occasion and did not get on with them.
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

  10. #20
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Me neither, Geoff, as far as in 2-channel mode is concerned, but in the home-cinema system the Yamaha underpins and add gravitas very impressively to low frequencies. As such, I wouldn't be without it

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.


    Protect your HUMAN RIGHTS and REFUSE ANY *MANDATORY* VACCINE FOR COVID-19!

    Also **SAY NO** to unjust 'vaccine passports' or certificates, which are totally incompatible with a FREE society!!!


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