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Thread: LENCO - GL75 Project

  1. #961
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Yorkshire

    Posts: 9,302
    I'm Andrew.

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    Quote Originally Posted by brian2957 View Post
    Ello Andy , haven't seen you update this thread for a bit Hope you're enjoying the GL75
    Hello mate! The deck is pretty much finished now I occasionally scan lenco heaven for ideas and new pieces of kit. The lenco isn't quite as detailed as my other decks but it is so much fun and I think I've spun more vinyl on the Lenco than the 1210 over the last two months! I've still a few ideas that I could implement but it would mean a complete rebuild and design paradigm.
    SS
    CD Teac VRDS25X(Audiotuned) DECK 1210 Mat Crystal Audio Mods MN Base/Bearing/Platter+Ebony armboard Feet Isonoe PSU Paul Hynes SR7EHD-27XL/DCSXL Ag DC lead/3 Stage Regs/Recap PCB+No Pitch/Strobe/Light ARM SME V(Kondo Ag Rewire&Tags) MC Cadenza Black FGS CABLES Arm Yannis SPD-4 IC Yannis 222 Litz+Ag bullets Power WAR PRE ATC SCA2 SPEAKERS ATC 50ASL STANDS Atacama PHONO Sugden Masterclass PA4 SUT Ortofon ST80SE POWER PSAudio P10

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    Croft Epoch(Modded) AMP Sondex S100 (Modded) SPEAKERS Tannoy 15"MG+RFC Warwick cabs+ Ref XO + Batpure supertweeters DECK Garrard 301 Mat Teunto Bearings 401(Bastin) Plinth Bamboo Arms 3009/3012 PSU Eagle+Tachometer MC Ag Meister II/FGS + Ortofon SPU MONO CABLES Arm Yannis 420.5 Litz+ SpeakerPC Tripple C+WBT-0681 Ag IC Oyaide FTVS-510 AgWBT 0110Ag Phonostages Paradise(4 Box Mega-Modded) / Croft Musicmaker



  2. #962
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Yorkshire

    Posts: 9,302
    I'm Andrew.

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    Tonights Update - The Reference Lenco Pt XXXXXVIII - Cork blimey! Or more buggering about with mats........

    My current mat configuration is the "gimp" mat bought from eBay and an original Garrard 301 mat and this combo has seen my through
    for quite some time. I have tried many costly (Tenuto gun metal platter mat and Crystal glass mat) and many cheap options (cork,
    felt) and quite a few others alongside numerous combinations of all of the above. I decided to try 4mm cork and the Garrard mat
    and also a trial of the "gimp" mat and the 4mm cork mat. I have used these in various combinations and I'm happy to say that I have
    found a combination which wins hands down compared to the various combinations and experimentations that I've tried. I've settled
    upon 4mm cork as a base mat and then the Garrard 301 mat sitting on top. I've had a few hours listening and I think that this combo
    is the best to date.

    Listening to Van Halen 1984 with a "gimp" + cork mat combo was a very anaemic affair the soundstage went very lean and the
    guitar of Eddie Van Halen went very lean and etched, no detail. The soundstage seemed to recess and in general whilst it was OK for
    four minutes I can't say that I'd have wanted to continue for much longer. Moving back to the familar Gimp+Garrard combo restored my
    old Lenco soundstage (Phew)! Now trialling Cork+Garrard and things went up another level. Alex Van Halens cymbals had more shimmer
    the bass suddenly became fuller and more tuneful and delivered more harmonic insight. This combination seems to major in bringing
    more detail to the fore of the soundstage. A second experiment listening to the Rhyme of the Ancient Mariner with three different
    mat combo's brought some interesting results, suffice to say that the cork+garrard mat combo again trumped all combos.
    Again detail and a fuller soundstage seemed to be the main benefits of this combo.

    Surface noise appears to be a tad reduced which is always a bonus. I just happen to have a cork mat kicking around in my spares box
    but they can be purchased for <£7 from eBay. The Garrard mat can also be purchased from eBay, just do a search for Garrard 301. I
    wonder if the new Garrard mats are made from the same compounds as the original Garrard mats and consequently wonder if they would
    produce the same results so try and buy NOS or an original mat if you can. The cork mat has lifted the Lenco a little higher up the
    sonic ladder and I can honestly say that it's been one of those tweeks that has brought quite a marked improvement for virtually
    peanuts money.

    As always, stay tuned.
    SS
    CD Teac VRDS25X(Audiotuned) DECK 1210 Mat Crystal Audio Mods MN Base/Bearing/Platter+Ebony armboard Feet Isonoe PSU Paul Hynes SR7EHD-27XL/DCSXL Ag DC lead/3 Stage Regs/Recap PCB+No Pitch/Strobe/Light ARM SME V(Kondo Ag Rewire&Tags) MC Cadenza Black FGS CABLES Arm Yannis SPD-4 IC Yannis 222 Litz+Ag bullets Power WAR PRE ATC SCA2 SPEAKERS ATC 50ASL STANDS Atacama PHONO Sugden Masterclass PA4 SUT Ortofon ST80SE POWER PSAudio P10

    VALVE
    PRE
    Croft Epoch(Modded) AMP Sondex S100 (Modded) SPEAKERS Tannoy 15"MG+RFC Warwick cabs+ Ref XO + Batpure supertweeters DECK Garrard 301 Mat Teunto Bearings 401(Bastin) Plinth Bamboo Arms 3009/3012 PSU Eagle+Tachometer MC Ag Meister II/FGS + Ortofon SPU MONO CABLES Arm Yannis 420.5 Litz+ SpeakerPC Tripple C+WBT-0681 Ag IC Oyaide FTVS-510 AgWBT 0110Ag Phonostages Paradise(4 Box Mega-Modded) / Croft Musicmaker



  3. #963
    Join Date: Nov 2013

    Location: HAMPSTEAD

    Posts: 1,156
    I'm brian.

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    Hi Andy , Recently purchased a reso mat on ebay and really pleased with results so far on my 75 with mayware / decca combo ( have you tried it ?)
    Also do you think 2 mats is generally better than 1 ?. Lastly are you see doing the 5 mile, or was it 10 everyday.best wishes

  4. #964
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Yorkshire

    Posts: 9,302
    I'm Andrew.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tapid View Post
    Hi Andy , Recently purchased a reso mat on ebay and really pleased with results so far on my 75 with mayware / decca combo ( have you tried it ?)
    Also do you think 2 mats is generally better than 1 ?. Lastly are you see doing the 5 mile, or was it 10 everyday.best wishes
    Brian, I've had the resomat befor and yes it worked well on my 1210 but it got replaced with a crystal mat. Now, with respects to your questions. I usually stick with one mat as I find VTA problems can sometimes arise which means faffing about with the vertical height of the tonearm. You may also have problems with the two mats not sitting correctly on top of each other, so a record might be needed. It's hard to give honest advice but after messing around with platter mats for quite some time I've come to the conclusions that on my 75 two mats seems to work better than one. But I think it's fun experimenting. Finally, yep the five mile walk is still a daily occurrence.
    SS
    CD Teac VRDS25X(Audiotuned) DECK 1210 Mat Crystal Audio Mods MN Base/Bearing/Platter+Ebony armboard Feet Isonoe PSU Paul Hynes SR7EHD-27XL/DCSXL Ag DC lead/3 Stage Regs/Recap PCB+No Pitch/Strobe/Light ARM SME V(Kondo Ag Rewire&Tags) MC Cadenza Black FGS CABLES Arm Yannis SPD-4 IC Yannis 222 Litz+Ag bullets Power WAR PRE ATC SCA2 SPEAKERS ATC 50ASL STANDS Atacama PHONO Sugden Masterclass PA4 SUT Ortofon ST80SE POWER PSAudio P10

    VALVE
    PRE
    Croft Epoch(Modded) AMP Sondex S100 (Modded) SPEAKERS Tannoy 15"MG+RFC Warwick cabs+ Ref XO + Batpure supertweeters DECK Garrard 301 Mat Teunto Bearings 401(Bastin) Plinth Bamboo Arms 3009/3012 PSU Eagle+Tachometer MC Ag Meister II/FGS + Ortofon SPU MONO CABLES Arm Yannis 420.5 Litz+ SpeakerPC Tripple C+WBT-0681 Ag IC Oyaide FTVS-510 AgWBT 0110Ag Phonostages Paradise(4 Box Mega-Modded) / Croft Musicmaker



  5. #965
    Join Date: Nov 2013

    Location: HAMPSTEAD

    Posts: 1,156
    I'm brian.

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    Thanks Andy, yes flaffing around seems to be a continuos theme at this game me thinks, but as you suggest its all part
    of this hobby!

  6. #966
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Yorkshire

    Posts: 9,302
    I'm Andrew.

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    Tonights Update - The Reference Lenco Pt XXXXXIX - Lenco addiction is worse than meth crack!

    Sitting hear tonight listening to the Lenco and some Led Zeppelin as I can't be bothered being boiled half to death with the Sondex & Croft being switched on. I have a single malt in my hand and have started musing what can be done next to the Lenco and after spending a little time over on Lenco Heaven have come up with some new ideas. I've been following the build threads on a few decks and I'm always amazed at what can be done with these excellent little decks. So, the first idea is to dampen the Alphason's tonearm pillar with EVA. It's a cheap material and I have plenty sitting in the workshop. For those of you who want to do more research, fill 'yer boots http://www.castel-engineering.com/en...n-pads-219.htm I have no information with respects to how well EVA works at dampening but for the sake of a little work in the workshop it could prove a nice cheap improvement. We shall see .

    Secondly I also considered further dampening the underside of both the heavy platters that I'm using, probably with some Dynamat. This has several advantages. Firstly it should theoretically dampen the platter further and further mitigate vibration getting into the cartridge. Secondly it adds a little mass to the platter which again is beneficial for the fly wheel effect on the platter and finally Dynamat has a thin aluminium base which should proof a little extra shielding for the cartridge from EMI (well it possibly could). The Lenco is the only deck that I've ever worked on which seems to better as it's progressively dampened. I'm also considering re-spraying the platters satin black to match the top plate of the deck, again it's only an idea but we shall see.

    Finally I've thought long and hard with respects to this upgrade but it could be extremely beneficial. I've been considering buying a new idler wheel. I currently use a 5 holed version which is widely considered the best, but I have one big issue with the idler wheel. I have no idea how old it is and consequently it could be upto 40 years old.
    The rubber looks good externally but could be buggered internally. It's also got ~40 years usage and subsequently could have uneven wear so I have plumped to order a new idler wheel. Again, we shall have to see what, if any this wheel brings to the table. I hate using new parts and have been quite pig headed in trying to retain original parts, this is why I refused to get the Frenck motor installed onto the Lenco. From what I can see the Norbert Idler wheel is very sympathetic to the original lenco design, so I'll give it a whirl.

    I thought that this deck was finished but it looks like we have a summer of upgrading, foolin' around and having fun experimenting. What else can I say, stay tuned.
    SS
    CD Teac VRDS25X(Audiotuned) DECK 1210 Mat Crystal Audio Mods MN Base/Bearing/Platter+Ebony armboard Feet Isonoe PSU Paul Hynes SR7EHD-27XL/DCSXL Ag DC lead/3 Stage Regs/Recap PCB+No Pitch/Strobe/Light ARM SME V(Kondo Ag Rewire&Tags) MC Cadenza Black FGS CABLES Arm Yannis SPD-4 IC Yannis 222 Litz+Ag bullets Power WAR PRE ATC SCA2 SPEAKERS ATC 50ASL STANDS Atacama PHONO Sugden Masterclass PA4 SUT Ortofon ST80SE POWER PSAudio P10

    VALVE
    PRE
    Croft Epoch(Modded) AMP Sondex S100 (Modded) SPEAKERS Tannoy 15"MG+RFC Warwick cabs+ Ref XO + Batpure supertweeters DECK Garrard 301 Mat Teunto Bearings 401(Bastin) Plinth Bamboo Arms 3009/3012 PSU Eagle+Tachometer MC Ag Meister II/FGS + Ortofon SPU MONO CABLES Arm Yannis 420.5 Litz+ SpeakerPC Tripple C+WBT-0681 Ag IC Oyaide FTVS-510 AgWBT 0110Ag Phonostages Paradise(4 Box Mega-Modded) / Croft Musicmaker



  7. #967
    Join Date: May 2011

    Location: Glasgow

    Posts: 7,718
    I'm Brian.

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    Interesting ideas Andy . Firstly , I agree with you on the idler wheel replacement . I always wondered if it was one hundred percent . It must also be remembered that the rubber on the idler wheel provided a barrier to the vibration from the motor . Any time the motor touched a part of the turntable I was quite taken aback at how much it vibrated .

    Agreed again on the mods you have suggested for the platters , although I would think twice about painting them as you may have difficulty getting the paint to take to those highly polished surfaces .

    I don't know the arm Andy but I'm sure any kind of damping will yield good results .

    Anyway thanks for keeping this thread updated . Always food for thought and an excellent resource for Lenco modders
    Regards
    Brian

    Sell your cleverness and buy bewilderment . (Rumi )


    Korus Computer Audio music server
    JustBoom DAC . HRT Musicstreamer 2
    Amplifier : Sony TA FB740R
    Speakers : Tannoy 637
    Interconnects : MS Audio / Klotz MC5000 .
    Speaker cables : Western Electric 16AG

  8. #968
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Yorkshire

    Posts: 9,302
    I'm Andrew.

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    Quote Originally Posted by brian2957 View Post
    Interesting ideas Andy . Firstly , I agree with you on the idler wheel replacement . I always wondered if it was one hundred percent . It must also be remembered that the rubber on the idler wheel provided a barrier to the vibration from the motor . Any time the motor touched a part of the turntable I was quite taken aback at how much it vibrated .

    Agreed again on the mods you have suggested for the platters , although I would think twice about painting them as you may have difficulty getting the paint to take to those highly polished surfaces .

    I don't know the arm Andy but I'm sure any kind of damping will yield good results .

    Anyway thanks for keeping this thread updated . Always food for thought and an excellent resource for Lenco modders
    Well I'll be doing some more tweaking and making sure tonearm setup is correct etc. It'll be a little more time before I dampen the tonearm pillar etc. I need to buy some drill bits and a few other bits and pieces. All good fun! The idler wheel is going to take ages before it arrives. I think painting the platters should be easy, just loads of primer, paint and then laquer, should look good. I've just started experimenting with a tripple combination of platter mats and seem to be getting better results! I'll be updating at some point.
    SS
    CD Teac VRDS25X(Audiotuned) DECK 1210 Mat Crystal Audio Mods MN Base/Bearing/Platter+Ebony armboard Feet Isonoe PSU Paul Hynes SR7EHD-27XL/DCSXL Ag DC lead/3 Stage Regs/Recap PCB+No Pitch/Strobe/Light ARM SME V(Kondo Ag Rewire&Tags) MC Cadenza Black FGS CABLES Arm Yannis SPD-4 IC Yannis 222 Litz+Ag bullets Power WAR PRE ATC SCA2 SPEAKERS ATC 50ASL STANDS Atacama PHONO Sugden Masterclass PA4 SUT Ortofon ST80SE POWER PSAudio P10

    VALVE
    PRE
    Croft Epoch(Modded) AMP Sondex S100 (Modded) SPEAKERS Tannoy 15"MG+RFC Warwick cabs+ Ref XO + Batpure supertweeters DECK Garrard 301 Mat Teunto Bearings 401(Bastin) Plinth Bamboo Arms 3009/3012 PSU Eagle+Tachometer MC Ag Meister II/FGS + Ortofon SPU MONO CABLES Arm Yannis 420.5 Litz+ SpeakerPC Tripple C+WBT-0681 Ag IC Oyaide FTVS-510 AgWBT 0110Ag Phonostages Paradise(4 Box Mega-Modded) / Croft Musicmaker



  9. #969
    Join Date: May 2011

    Location: Glasgow

    Posts: 7,718
    I'm Brian.

    Default

    3 mats Sounds interesting mate .
    Regards
    Brian

    Sell your cleverness and buy bewilderment . (Rumi )


    Korus Computer Audio music server
    JustBoom DAC . HRT Musicstreamer 2
    Amplifier : Sony TA FB740R
    Speakers : Tannoy 637
    Interconnects : MS Audio / Klotz MC5000 .
    Speaker cables : Western Electric 16AG

  10. #970
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Yorkshire

    Posts: 9,302
    I'm Andrew.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by brian2957 View Post
    3 mats Sounds interesting mate .
    Well I think the extra detail I'm hearing is due to one of either 2 things. 1. The extra GIMP mat is helping a little more with the dampening or 2. The extra 2mm of height from the GIMP mat is helping with the VTA of the cartridge. More listening and tweaking/testing over this week I'm afraid.
    SS
    CD Teac VRDS25X(Audiotuned) DECK 1210 Mat Crystal Audio Mods MN Base/Bearing/Platter+Ebony armboard Feet Isonoe PSU Paul Hynes SR7EHD-27XL/DCSXL Ag DC lead/3 Stage Regs/Recap PCB+No Pitch/Strobe/Light ARM SME V(Kondo Ag Rewire&Tags) MC Cadenza Black FGS CABLES Arm Yannis SPD-4 IC Yannis 222 Litz+Ag bullets Power WAR PRE ATC SCA2 SPEAKERS ATC 50ASL STANDS Atacama PHONO Sugden Masterclass PA4 SUT Ortofon ST80SE POWER PSAudio P10

    VALVE
    PRE
    Croft Epoch(Modded) AMP Sondex S100 (Modded) SPEAKERS Tannoy 15"MG+RFC Warwick cabs+ Ref XO + Batpure supertweeters DECK Garrard 301 Mat Teunto Bearings 401(Bastin) Plinth Bamboo Arms 3009/3012 PSU Eagle+Tachometer MC Ag Meister II/FGS + Ortofon SPU MONO CABLES Arm Yannis 420.5 Litz+ SpeakerPC Tripple C+WBT-0681 Ag IC Oyaide FTVS-510 AgWBT 0110Ag Phonostages Paradise(4 Box Mega-Modded) / Croft Musicmaker



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