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Thread: Renovation of Celestion 66 Studio Monitors

  1. #291
    Join Date: Nov 2016

    Location: Gozo, Malta

    Posts: 50
    I'm Rod.

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    Hi Martin

    That's the one, Mini T, should have known Paradise is the phono pre, I'm just about to build an EAR based phono myself. What exactly happened when the 66's asked to be fed?

  2. #292
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Carlisle - UK

    Posts: 1,956
    I'm Ken.

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    I tried lots of variations with the PP/electrolytic mix for the big mid range value.
    1% to 2% PP sounded best and up to a max 5% was acceptable and allows a bit of flexibility with stock values available to make the total required.
    By the time you get to 10% it sounds bad and strangely enough doesn't get much worse the more you add, I started at 50% then 30% etc.

    The Mini T mentioned is a class "T" amp and powered my 66's to reasonable levels before running out of steam. If you don't need loud, at about £100 it is a bargain for the quality you get.

    Many manufacturers are moving to class "D" and using OEM boards from Bang and Olufsen under the ICE branded technology or from Hypex, NAD's latest top end Amp uses Hypex modules for instance and it's not cheap at just under £4000. The modules are usually coupled to switch mode power supplies, which creates a very light weight yet powerful package, but occasionally heavy weight linear supplies are used. Like any class of amp there are good and bad examples of the technology. Class "D" seems particularly good for powering bass and many Pro Audio manufacturers have gone this route for PA and DJ use were lots of cheap watts are needed. I heard a couple of HiFi class "D" amps at last years NW Audio show, coupled to some decent kit and they sounded pretty damn good to me. At the MiBO meet, Ali's open baffle speakers had a 2000w class "D" powering the four 15" bass drivers and I think everyone was impressed with how they performed. So yes, class "D" is good, though not maybe to everyone's taste, then again what is.

  3. #293
    Join Date: Nov 2016

    Location: Gozo, Malta

    Posts: 50
    I'm Rod.

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    I've only ever experienced class D amplification with a subwoofer we were trying out years ago as maybe using ourselves (2002 ish maybe) was amazing for the size of cab and really made one hell of a noise for a 340x340x340 enclosure 12" driver and a bass radiator in this little cube - B.K Electronics were letting us try it out - very impressive. Still have the enclosure and drivers but the class D amp packed up and I feed the drivers with an external amp now - still makes an impressive sub, even more so when you take the overall size of it into account. It was a german manufacturer I think.....

  4. #294
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

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    I'm Geoff.

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    I've got a little Chinese D Class amp much the same size as the Mini T. It sounds pretty good as long as it's not driving anything too demanding. It drove my Tannoy System 800 speakers well enough, but they are 94db sensitivity.
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

  5. #295
    Join Date: Nov 2016

    Location: Gozo, Malta

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    I'm Rod.

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    I think that's the key thing here, if your not driving anything too demanding <91/2 db then the virtues of the tech shine through, I'm guessing. I can only talk about valve amps (EL84 based) about sensitivity. Haven't heard the latest swathe of class D amps myself, I would if I were closer to the UK....

    But hey, it's good these things are now available, back in the day..........

  6. #296
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

    Posts: 51,624
    I'm Geoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rodthebod View Post
    Haven't heard the latest swathe of class D amps myself, I would if I were closer to the UK.....
    Order one on ebay from China with the correct spec power supply. They are really cheap and I've found the Chinese sellers very dependable. You might be surprised by the sound quality.
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

  7. #297
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Carlisle - UK

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    I'm Ken.

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    I think there is some confusion here between the small class "T" amps of 20 watts or less into 4ohm and the true class "D" amps which can put out much more, dependant on build. The Tripath or clones of the "T" amp are a form of class "D" using a particular chip of very limited output, this is the type which RichB used with my 66's. I was talking about the more powerful versions here, the Hypex modules I'm considering are 180w, 400w or 700w into 4 ohm. My lay out uses four of the ucD180 modules and two SMPS to run these and my active crossovers. Sub woofer plate amps are a typical application for this type of module due to small size, weight and low heat output. I'm a fair way off building my unit but will post it all when I get to it.

  8. #298
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

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    I'm Geoff.

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    My understanding is that they are all Class D, Tripath included. Not sure why they are labelled 'D' though, as they are not digital. In fact, I'm not aware of any true digital amp on the market, although they may exist. I know Pioneer were working on a true digital design. But I can't see a great advantage in having one until digital speakers come along and ideas for those have been on drawing boards for years.
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

  9. #299
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

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    I'm Grant.

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    class d are switching amps as opposed to gain amps if memory serves Geoff. Think they d gets classified as digital because of the on off bit.
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  10. #300
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: N E Kent

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    I'm Geoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by struth View Post
    class d are switching amps as opposed to gain amps if memory serves Geoff. Think they d gets classified as digital because of the on off bit.
    That was my understanding too. The high speed switching producing the signal 'envelope' rather like AM radio as opposed to true digital.

    If AM is digital, then we've had 'digital' for a hundred years.
    It is impossible for anything digital to sound analogue, because it isn't analogue!

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