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Thread: Renovation of Celestion 66 Studio Monitors

  1. #311
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Durham - UK

    Posts: 1,318
    I'm Ken.

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    I followed current thinking for best practice, for mounting the inductors, in terms of spacing and orientation and had the boards in the standard location behind the big bass driver magnet, mounted below behind the ABR and also mounted external.

    To be honest, I couldn't hear any significant difference in any of it, I certainly couldn't make up my mind if any one thing sounded better, or if reorienting the coils had made a difference. Other changes had made a far greater impact, so these days I just recommend the simple cap renewal on the stock boards. This gave 95% of the improvement I gained, all the extra work (the main chunk of the total) I did, made little if any difference, you are getting down to very very small changes to the sound, where you can fool yourself as to what if anything has changed and also if it is any better. In this particular set up, I think coil placement would be as much about peace of mind as any tangible benefit, so I will leave that one up to you.
    Ken

    http://www.jkwynn.co.uk/
    DIY Technics/ProJect based Turntable + Terminator linear tracker + Ortofon MC20 Supreme / Pro-Ject Phono box & Pre Box RS / KMTech Active X-Over / Nakamichi AVP1 Power / DIY Sealed Three Way Speakers / Stello CDT100 Transport / DAC Magic.

  2. #312
    Join Date: Nov 2016

    Location: Malta

    Posts: 47
    I'm Rod.

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    Well Ken thanks for the honesty about hearing any differences with the crossovers out etc.

    Been busy with Christmas visitors and just about ready to carry on with speakers - it's so been bloody cold here, and I'm talking Malta here, that the garage has been a no no for finishing the cabs off, but I'm almost there now.

    Finally got the caps from Wilmslow - Ansar and Mundorf's E-caps as shown on Ken's final crossover design (the one with tri-wire config shown on this thread) with 1uf Ansar across 22uf Mundorf bipolar E-cap for MD500 midrange unit, I have the MF500 so have 29uf E-cap+1uf Ansar. BUT, they sent the 6.8uf Mundorf E-cap as PLAIN bipolar which was to go with the 22uf E-cap to make up around 29uf and 1uf Ansar for the ideal 30uf for the MF500 midrange. However, with no reason given I was supplied with a RAW version of the 22uf E-cap, it's really tiny compared to the 6.8uf cap, less than half the physical size, and measures over 10% over tolerance, it's marked as 5% tolerance. But it's the RAW vs PLAIN thing I'm disappointed about. There is no LL shown for low loss shown anywhere.

    On a more positive note, all the Ansar caps supplied show almost bang on when measured (within 1-2%)

    I've contacted Wilmslow to see what they will do, hopefully it is a genuine mistake and they will get me the correct 22uf PLAIN E-caps I expected - I've noticed that the PLAIN type Mundorf E-caps are around 2-3 times more expensive than the equivalent value RAW type, which is what Wilmslow charge - ie the higher rate, but why have they the RAW type in stock at all.....

    Anyway I'll keep you posted. Haven't ordered the Alcaps from Falcon for the bass and mid yet, was going to try the speakers out first then decide what to do, it would have been nice to have a working pair to try before embarking on this project, but I have every faith that things will work out well.

    I have the one working original Studio 66 speaker as a temporary centre speaker in the listening room and does it blow away what I was using in terms of overall soundstage and realism - a pair of 5.5" drivers in 16 litre cab vs 12" + ABR in the 66's much bigger cab, not pretty as a centre speaker but I have the luxury of a listening room for me so no WAF to worry about... heaven. The old Celestion 66 really shines through on concert music but there are things wrong in the top end/upper mid when you get into particular songs which almost certainly are the crossovers using the way out of spec old original elcaps and electrolytics, the cabs are not airtight either around the drivers, short term solution was to use blutak to temporarily bung up the bigger gaps! So impressed by this centre solution I have acquired a 12" 66 bass driver from fleabay and am looking for a midrange MF500 or MD500 to make up a centre speaker using the old cab once I use the existing drivers in my new cabs - I could live without the ABR on a centre, unless one comes up - any suggestions on what to do with the crossover to make a non ABR version centre much appreciated. From what Ken has said I would like to get hold of a pair of MD500's long term then use one of the MF500's in a centre speaker 66.

    I received my DOUK EAR834P Valve Phono Preamp clone board from China after three-four weeks with all resistors/caps components inc. JJ valves and I have to comment that the quality is exceptionally good for the cost, haven't wired it up yet and I'm looking for a case solution and need RCA chassis plugs IEC mains connection etc.
    I'll probably end up cannibalising one of my Claritas Stands Unique media PC enclosures in a big way, use the side extrusions and slice down the 3mm ali top and base plates to a reasonable size. Modelling it up now in a 3D app to get some ideas.
    Ken, where do you get your RCA chassis plugs from? ebay has many types described a 'Neutrik' but the actual Neutrik site shows no bare bones type chassis sockets only the more expensive square recessed type. I just need a reasonable quality set of 4 sockets as I'll use the Phono Preamp case with the passive attenuator and a switch for CD/DAC/Turntable. I have noticed some of the cheaper gold plated sockets used on kit discolour after a couple of years which isn't a good sign.

  3. #313
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Durham - UK

    Posts: 1,318
    I'm Ken.

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    See things are coming together.
    If you have trouble getting the "Plain" Mundorf eCaps from Wilmslow (didn't know they kept them) HiFi Collective keep them.
    Ken

    http://www.jkwynn.co.uk/
    DIY Technics/ProJect based Turntable + Terminator linear tracker + Ortofon MC20 Supreme / Pro-Ject Phono box & Pre Box RS / KMTech Active X-Over / Nakamichi AVP1 Power / DIY Sealed Three Way Speakers / Stello CDT100 Transport / DAC Magic.

  4. #314
    Join Date: Sep 2014

    Location: brighton uk.

    Posts: 2,305
    I'm jamie.

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    yep ive just received mine today from hifi collective,great service from all 3 company's,falcon (alcaps) cricklewood audio (ansars) and hifi collective (mundorfs)
    1 slight set back is the 1uf ansars are on bloody back order,will take a week they say
    it would also appear that falcon no longer stock alcap LL 72uf's i recapped mine a while back,im glad i did now!

    have a look here rod if your interested
    http://theartofsound.net/forum/showt...itton-66-recap
    My System/ Yamaha NS1000M speakers,Pioneer PLC-1700, direct drive turntable, Townsend Elite rock 2 turntable,,Alphason HR-100S-MCS tonearm,Ortofon 2M BLACK cartridge ,Sony 700ES Amp,Sony X555ES CD Player, Nakamichi ca5 pre amp ,

  5. #315
    Join Date: Nov 2016

    Location: Malta

    Posts: 47
    I'm Rod.

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    Thanks for the info Jamie, that was my next move getting the 72uf LL and 4uf from Falcon, any idea where there are some or something as good/equivalent fro my 66's?
    Wilmslow had the 1uf Ansars in stock around Christmas, they were part of my order which I just received.

  6. #316
    Join Date: Sep 2014

    Location: brighton uk.

    Posts: 2,305
    I'm jamie.

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    hi rod,
    cricklewood audio sell them but im not sure if they are low loss.
    My System/ Yamaha NS1000M speakers,Pioneer PLC-1700, direct drive turntable, Townsend Elite rock 2 turntable,,Alphason HR-100S-MCS tonearm,Ortofon 2M BLACK cartridge ,Sony 700ES Amp,Sony X555ES CD Player, Nakamichi ca5 pre amp ,

  7. #317
    Join Date: Jan 2013

    Location: Durham - UK

    Posts: 1,318
    I'm Ken.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rodthebod View Post
    Thanks for the info Jamie, that was my next move getting the 72uf LL and 4uf from Falcon, any idea where there are some or something as good/equivalent fro my 66's?
    Wilmslow had the 1uf Ansars in stock around Christmas, they were part of my order which I just received.
    The 72uF were not Low loss, just use ordinary Alcaps. You wont get LL Alcaps anyway, no one has them, don't now if they were ever made at that value.
    They are used in a parallel situation and my original Elcaps were not LL.
    Replacing these with ordinary Alcaps made a big improvement to the bass on mine, the originals had drifted a bit off spec.
    Ken

    http://www.jkwynn.co.uk/
    DIY Technics/ProJect based Turntable + Terminator linear tracker + Ortofon MC20 Supreme / Pro-Ject Phono box & Pre Box RS / KMTech Active X-Over / Nakamichi AVP1 Power / DIY Sealed Three Way Speakers / Stello CDT100 Transport / DAC Magic.

  8. #318
    Join Date: Sep 2014

    Location: brighton uk.

    Posts: 2,305
    I'm jamie.

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    hmm i must be getting confused then,i did do mine a while ago,looking through my old caps i cant see any LL 72uf elcaps either! sorry for misleading anybody
    My System/ Yamaha NS1000M speakers,Pioneer PLC-1700, direct drive turntable, Townsend Elite rock 2 turntable,,Alphason HR-100S-MCS tonearm,Ortofon 2M BLACK cartridge ,Sony 700ES Amp,Sony X555ES CD Player, Nakamichi ca5 pre amp ,

  9. #319
    Join Date: Sep 2014

    Location: brighton uk.

    Posts: 2,305
    I'm jamie.

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    here's a question for you ken or anyone else that may know,did the 66's come with the Velcro strips to hold the grills on or are they added by people who have lost the fixing screw?
    the reason i ask is that with the Velcro strips fitted it makes getting the grills located in the metal clips at the top corners tricky,they also don't seem to go tight against the body too.

    ive seen pics with them and without them so just wondered.
    cheers.j.
    My System/ Yamaha NS1000M speakers,Pioneer PLC-1700, direct drive turntable, Townsend Elite rock 2 turntable,,Alphason HR-100S-MCS tonearm,Ortofon 2M BLACK cartridge ,Sony 700ES Amp,Sony X555ES CD Player, Nakamichi ca5 pre amp ,

  10. #320
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: Southall, West London

    Posts: 26,915
    I'm Geoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jamie123 View Post
    here's a question for you ken or anyone else that may know,did the 66's come with the Velcro strips to hold the grills on or are they added by people who have lost the fixing screw?
    the reason i ask is that with the Velcro strips fitted it makes getting the grills located in the metal clips at the top corners tricky,they also don't seem to go tight against the body too.

    ive seen pics with them and without them so just wondered.
    cheers.j.
    They were original. I remember seeing them on new ones. I believe they used smaller velcro pads at one stage instead though.

    There was a bit of 'slack' in the grilles when in position.
    Mr. Tact!

    Main system: MMs/ADCs/Low output MC's/One rare Japanese SUT/One scarce British phono stage/various tonearms/hefty Japanese DD TT and hefty Japanese BD TT and small British BD TT. 4 CD players/2 jitter buster/2 DACs/Valve buffer. TVC stepped attenuator or valve pre-amp or solid state pre-amp. Current dumping power-amp or either of two Class A SS power-amp or Class A EL34 valve monos or big Japanese (part Class A) integrated. Big dual concentric speakers/Smaller dual concentric speakers/Two way British compacts and full range speakers, amongst others. And too much more to list!

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